Author Topic: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread  (Read 26064 times)

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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #105 on: January 09, 2017, 09:49:07 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

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So I'm still a bit unclear about this.. but is it official there is zero chance Zizic comes in this season and he will come over next season for the team? Or is there a chance Zizic can come by the second half of the season.

I wouldn't mind if he stayed overseas and improved this season while coming in next season to Boston, but I'm just curious.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #106 on: January 09, 2017, 09:59:16 AM »

Offline saltlover

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So I'm still a bit unclear about this.. but is it official there is zero chance Zizic comes in this season and he will come over next season for the team? Or is there a chance Zizic can come by the second half of the season.

I wouldn't mind if he stayed overseas and improved this season while coming in next season to Boston, but I'm just curious.

Prior to him going to Turkey, there was a small chance (I'd say less than 10%).  But as his Turkish team paid $1.5 million for Zizic just for the rest of the year, and the Celtics can only pay $650k to buy him out of his contract, it's zero for all intents and purposes.  He's allowed to come over, but there's no way that's contractually happening.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #107 on: January 09, 2017, 10:08:14 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

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So I'm still a bit unclear about this.. but is it official there is zero chance Zizic comes in this season and he will come over next season for the team? Or is there a chance Zizic can come by the second half of the season.

I wouldn't mind if he stayed overseas and improved this season while coming in next season to Boston, but I'm just curious.

Prior to him going to Turkey, there was a small chance (I'd say less than 10%).  But as his Turkish team paid $1.5 million for Zizic just for the rest of the year, and the Celtics can only pay $650k to buy him out of his contract, it's zero for all intents and purposes.  He's allowed to come over, but there's no way that's contractually happening.

Alright makes sense. Thanks! TP.

Really have high hopes for him though, and I will not be sad when Zeller and Olynyk leave.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #108 on: January 09, 2017, 10:13:00 AM »

Offline trickybilly

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Probably been said before but I think he needs to get at least an Amir level Three point shot to really fit right in soon.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #109 on: January 09, 2017, 10:14:36 AM »

Offline saltlover

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So I'm still a bit unclear about this.. but is it official there is zero chance Zizic comes in this season and he will come over next season for the team? Or is there a chance Zizic can come by the second half of the season.

I wouldn't mind if he stayed overseas and improved this season while coming in next season to Boston, but I'm just curious.

Prior to him going to Turkey, there was a small chance (I'd say less than 10%).  But as his Turkish team paid $1.5 million for Zizic just for the rest of the year, and the Celtics can only pay $650k to buy him out of his contract, it's zero for all intents and purposes.  He's allowed to come over, but there's no way that's contractually happening.

Alright makes sense. Thanks! TP.

Really have high hopes for him though, and I will not be sad when Zeller and Olynyk leave.

I'll be sad if Olynyk leaves.  I really like the Smart-Olynyk combo.  Seems like they've got some good chemistry on offense.
2018 Mock Trade Deadline:

Pelicans: Davis, Holiday, Vucevic, Rondo, Clarkson, Nance, Hart, Moore, Ilyasova, Ajinca, Hill, Miller, Jackson, Dotson, Dakari Johnson

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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #110 on: January 09, 2017, 11:52:57 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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Yes, but here’s what we do know.

Here's what you don't know. The level of his competition. Maybe i am wrong but i think it is important in order to place the things you know into context

He wasn’t supposed to get many minutes behind Semih Erden.

Says who ? Erden today is a d-league level center and not the 10mpg NBA player you remember


We absolutely know the level of competition.  He is not only competing in Euro league which is more completive than the NCAA he is playing significant minutes and machining a serious statistical impact.   

Semih Erden was a good rotational quality player like a Zeller that just didn’t get any love from Doc.  He’s been playing meaningful minutes in Europe and you think he’s a D leaguer?  He was better than that when he was here.   Just because a guy like Erden will make more and play more in Europe, doesn’t mean he can’t play here. 

What makes players succeed and even excel in the NBA is the ability to reach or exceed their potential.  To do this players hone their strengths and improve upon and/or eliminate weaknesses in their game.  When we draft a player we are drafting an incomplete product and hoping they can overcome some weakness.   One of the things that has me excited and is a good reason for the buzz surrounding Zizic is the speed at which he is addressing his weaknesses.   

Lets compare Zizic to Zeller to illustrate my point.  Zeller is a back up big and is good enough for rotational minutes on a good team.  He is not what anyone would want as a started and a real contender would hope for more off the bench.  Zeller went 17 because he has weaknesses that looked tough to over come.

Zeller’s Weaknesses:

Even though Zeller has good height for the C spot, he certainly doesn’t have very good strength …

Still a problem

When he faces strong big men down low, they can easily seal and establish position on him for pretty easy shots …

Still a problem

He’s also not the toughest guy down low, and struggles with defensive rebounding and physical play inside on both ends …

Still a problem

Has a high center of gravity, and can be pushed out of the post by defenders with leverage …

Still a problem

Although he has most of his upside on the offensive end, he’s still a bit raw in his feel for the D and will force shots when kick outs are available …

He has improved greatly here

Doesn’t react to double teams very well …

He’s not good enough to draw a double team in the NBA ha ah

Not a particularly selfish player, but Zeller rarely looks to pass the ball back out …

He does do this now

Should look to add some left handed moves to his arsenal, as his jump hook is his only truly noteworthy move in the paint …

Nope still a one trick pony

He also should work on being less mechanical in his approach, as he can be turnover prone or get caught in awkward situations at times in the half-court offense …

Still a problem

Although his jumper is promising, he’s going to need repetition with it as it hasn’t been utilized a lot during his UNC career .

He has a nice mid range jumper now


Result his offensive game improved enough to keep him in the league coming of the bench but not good enough to be a starting caliber center.  When our front curt was extra sucky he got some starts but he is really a 10th to 12th man off the bench on a good team.

Could he have been more, sure but he couldn’t get past his weaknesses.  He looked great in college but he couldn’t translate to the NBA at the same level.   

So what’s different about Zizic?

Zizic Weaknesses: 

[Note:  His pre draft scouting report was from when he was 18, he didn’t get back to the US to go through Euro camp (he did do it in 2015) or the Combine, before the draft as he was busy playing pro ball.  Danny did travel to see him live and work him out in Europe before the draft.  He wasn’t a top pick so there wasn’t much need to update his profile.]


Good but not great size for a center …

Really?  Cousins is 6’11 270 at 26 years old.  Zizic is 7’ 260 at 20 years old.

Not a versatile player, since he can only play at the center position …

That’s what we need!  But in an early season interview he said he has been working on his game so he can play the 4 or the 5.  We’ll see, looks like he has been staying at the 5 so far.  But again WE NEED A CENTER!

Considered an average athlete by NBA standards …

He makes up foe it with a non-stop motor and the sheer will to make the play, dare I say somewhat like we see from Crowder.

Has to continue bulking up his body …

Look at him on film from last year to this year, he is much bigger now.

The fact that he needs time to gather before jumping can really hurt him at the next level …

Look at him on film he gets up quick now.

His footwork needs work on both ends of the floor …

This has improved on both ends of the floor, a big reason for his outstanding statistics this year.

He might not be afraid of contact, but in reality he has problems against bigger and more athletic bigs …

Not any more.  He has struggled against no one this year including his 4 games in the more challenging league.  Again this is a big reason for the hype train.

Has problems finishing through traffic …

Not anymore. Film don’t lie, he is crushing people now.

Not as adept at finishing at the rim with his left hand …

Not any more.  Again, film don’t lie.  Watch the tape, he finishes at the rim with the left effortlessly.

His post game is mostly dependant upon strength and needs polishing …

He doesn’t have the dream shake down, but he now has a few simple moves.  They work and it’s a start.

Although he can turn to both shoulders when he plays with his back to the basket, the truth is that he actually doesn’t have many counter moves …

So far no one has been able to stop the moves he has, so there hasn’t been a need to counter anything.

For the time being he can’t be considered a threat from mid-range…

Excellent FT shooting = high potential for a mid range game (see Zelller).  Also we have seen the occasion very nice looking mid range jumper.   But when he can’t be stopped in the paint, even with a double team, why take a jump shot?

He doesn’t have a Face to the basket game…

He is starting to show signs of having one.  Nothing to rave about but the beginning of one is evident.

At times he tries to do things too fast, which leads to bad decisions…

He has 1.2:2 assist to turnover ratio now.  I think that is good for a big man, at least a 20 year old.

Feel for the game is a question mark …

He seems to have a really good feel for the game from watching him, at least this year.  Film don’t lie.

Has to improve his ball handling …

He’s not really handing the ball in a point center way, but he is touching the ball a lot.  He looks comfortable with the ball in his hands.

Turnover prone (3.4 turnovers per 36 minutes in Adriatic League) …

He’s only averaging 2 this year so that is almost cutting his turnovers in half.  That is big time improvement.

Bad passer (barely averages 0.5 assists per 36 minutes in Adriatic League)…

He is averaging 1.2 now, so again big time improvement.

His Assist/Turnover Ratio is bad (1 assist every 6 turnovers in Adriatic League) …

Now its 1.2 for every 2, so once again big time improvement.

When he sets screens on Pick And Roll situations he has the tendency to roll at the wrong side …

Not anymore he is killing it as a role man, film don’t lie.

Lateral quickness is average …

So far not a problem in the Adriatic, Turkish, or Euro league.  We’ll see in the NBA. I’m optimistic he can move as well as if not better than KO.

Struggles defending the Pick And Roll against quick guards …

Not anymore

Occasionally loses concentration on Defense, because he is too focused on the ball …

He is dialed in now, 1.2 blocks a game and .7 steals a game.

It’s difficult to imagine him become an elite rim protector because of his average size and athleticism …

Average size?  7’ with a 7’3 wing span, really?  He is bigger than anyone else on our team.  He also isn’t giving up too much when compared to some prospects we are currently looking at obtaining:  Noel 6’11 with a 7’4 wingspan; Okafor 6’11 with a 7’5 wingspan;  Cousins 6’11 with a 7’6 wingspan; Vucevic 7’ with a 7’4 wingspan;  Bogut 7’ with a 7’3 wingspan.


So he hasn’t played in the NBA yet.  We have had a hole at the center position for a long time.    He has the skills we need.  He is better offensively than Noel but not as good defensively.   He is better defensively than Okafor but not as good offensively.  He is a nice middle ground between the two.  He will be awesome as a back up center right away, should we trade for a starting caliber center, and he looks like he may become a good starting caliber two-way center.   

Okafor is 21 and Noel is 22.  We haven’t seen any improvements in their areas of weakness yet, but at 20 Zizic has already shown that he is getting better where it matters most.   This is why people are so excited about Zizic.  You want to compare someone to Mickey, compare Yabusele.  He looked good in summer league and is putting up crazy numbers in the CBA, but no one is going nuts over him.  He is like Mickey a lot of talent but it looks like he will be held back by his weaknesses.  It is the major improvements by Zizic not merely that he’s putting up big numbers that has people interested in him. 

Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #111 on: January 10, 2017, 12:22:31 AM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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Being optimistic in one thing , kicking out of the team everyone not named Horfod because the Serbian Barkley is coming is another.

This year is Zizic (whom if you bother searching i liked much more than Bedner before the draft) last year it was Mickey. I don't think that Mickey is what people here projected him to be. Now Zizic is anointed as the solution to the Cs frontcourt problems. Because of highlight videos and stat lines.

It's funny though that if you don't follow the flow here you are a **** and antagonistic. Actually watching the games is i guess irrelevant


No one thought a 6’8 230lb PF/Small ball center was the player of our dreams.   No one expected Mickey to start at center for sure, maybe there was hope he could play the 4, but we needed to see it.   We have been getting killed in rebounding and we barley block any shots.  People were tired of watching Sully, Zeller, and KO get bet on D over and over again.  They wanted to give the kid rebounding and blocking shots like a mad man in the D league a chance to show he was for real.  Well turns out between his size limitations and his difficulty picking up the NBA schemes, he just isn’t ready for rotational minutes.   

Also, no one is saying kick out the whole team.   Amir makes 12 million and Zeller 8 million.  That money can go to a free agent but we need to fill their spots.  We probably wont bring back both KO and Jerebko, as they are really quite similar players, so that is another spot that opens up.  People are glad that a guy like Zizic is coming on the cheep.  He looks to be all about working in the pain, crashing the boards and dunking everything.  At 7’ 260, he has the body to do just that in the NBA, more so than someone 6’8 230.

If I had my way I’d trade low value assets for Vucevic and his manageable contract.  Zizic would back him up and when Vucevic’s deal is up the hope would be that Zizic is ready to anchor the middle for the long haul.  If not Vucevic I’d go for Bogut but only if we could resign him on the cheep, or at least a reasonable deal.   If Danny does it right, we should be able to trade for a center and sign a Max free agent.  Having Zizic coming on the cheep only helps make that possible.

Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #112 on: January 10, 2017, 12:45:45 AM »

Offline jdz101

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The wet towels are no more right than the blind optimists in this thread.

I will say the kid looks terrific as a 19 year old. He could develop into a pretty good NBA center.




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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #113 on: January 10, 2017, 07:21:30 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Being optimistic in one thing , kicking out of the team everyone not named Horfod because the Serbian Barkley is coming is another.

This year is Zizic (whom if you bother searching i liked much more than Bedner before the draft) last year it was Mickey. I don't think that Mickey is what people here projected him to be. Now Zizic is anointed as the solution to the Cs frontcourt problems. Because of highlight videos and stat lines.

It's funny though that if you don't follow the flow here you are a **** and antagonistic. Actually watching the games is i guess irrelevant

Ante is a Croat. Naming him a serbian Barkley is uninformed and even insulting, since serbian dictatorship wanted to occupy Croatia 20-25 years ago using military force. Many people died and were left without home. I understand this might not be that relevant to you, but if you are a true Celtic please do your homework before posting.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #114 on: January 10, 2017, 07:40:52 AM »

Offline DavorCroatiaFan

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I second that. Žižić, Bogdanović, Šarić, Hezonja, Zubac, Bender...Petrović, Kukoć, Rađa, Vranković are Croats. Serbs are Jokić, Marjanović, Bjelica...Divac, Stojaković, Krstić, Danilović, Đorđević, Miličić. Teletović and Nurkić are Bosnian, Dragić Slovenian and  Vučević and Pavlović from Montenegro.
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #115 on: January 10, 2017, 09:40:05 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Žižić will hopefully be a 3rd Croatian to play for the Celts. All bigs, all centers. Rađa would definitly be a 5 in todays game.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #116 on: January 10, 2017, 10:35:34 AM »

Offline footey

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Great scouting report on him on CB home page today.  Says he is ready to play now for team, but will most certainly come over next season. Thinks with time he has ability to start!!

Love it!!

Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #117 on: January 10, 2017, 03:40:17 PM »

Offline DavorCroatiaFan

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Žižić will hopefully be a 3rd Croatian to play for the Celts. All bigs, all centers. Rađa would definitly be a 5 in todays game.

Actually 5th Croatian (Stojko Vranković, Dino Rađa, Žan Tabak, Bruno Šundov)
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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #118 on: January 10, 2017, 04:42:50 PM »

Offline greece666

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Žižić will hopefully be a 3rd Croatian to play for the Celts. All bigs, all centers. Rađa would definitly be a 5 in todays game.

Actually 5th Croatian (Stojko Vranković, Dino Rađa, Žan Tabak, Bruno Šundov)

^

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Re: Official Ante Zizic Darussafaka Thread
« Reply #119 on: January 12, 2017, 04:25:28 AM »

Offline detour

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Zizic Alert

Darüşşafaka plays today with Spanish team Baskonia, at 17.00 GMT, or 12.00 US Eastern Time. Game is in İstanbul.

Baskonia sits at 3rd place with an 11-5 record, 1 win behind the leader CSKA Moscow. Darüşşafaka is at 8th place with an 8-8 record.

Baskonia is know for their uptempo style and taking quick shots. They are selected "the most fun team to watch" in a recent poll between Euroleague GMs. Also, they managed to go to final four last year. While they lost some important players like Bourousis this summer, they made additions like Shane Larkin, Bargnani, and Beaubois to stay at a high level. Chase Budinger also plays there for some weeks now.

Zizic will compete with a washed up Bargnani, up and coming German center Voigtmann, and maybe Diop.