Author Topic: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???  (Read 11238 times)

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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2016, 01:03:58 PM »

Offline manl_lui

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i think the Celtics move the ball a lot better when IT is not on the floor chucking shots and playing hero ball. WITH THAT SAID, I think trading IT for this reason is silly as he is the only guy on our team aside from Horford who could generate his own shot. Especially down in the 4th quarter, he is the only guy who can take it to the whole and score. Not every game will be like Orlando, when we face tougher opponents, where the score is neck and neck, you need IT

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2016, 01:10:23 PM »

Offline Smartacus

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Like seriously? Dude is still our best scorer and like it or not, the only reason the C's won two games in the Hawks series last season is because of IT, because everyone else was shooting bricks.

Alright let's take a breath. This statement is nearly as bad as the trade IT after 1 game crowd. I'm not part of that mindset, but you have to admit last night was a prime example of what happens when you have a team loaded with talent at every position like ours being lead by someone looking to distribute first and call their own number when the opportunity presents itself.

Everyone else was shooting bricks? Maybe that's because our point guard wasn't putting enough focus into generating quality looks for his teammates in their spots. By that logic IT actually lost us the series!

But of course the answer is somewhere in the middle. He probably shoots a bit too much for how this offense is designed but then that same shot taking mindset has put teams away that might have otherwise gone on a run.

Trade IT? Preferably not, but by my estimation he's not untouchable.

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2016, 01:36:31 PM »

Offline GratefulCs

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I just want to put this out there

I don't think we have a chance of winning it all with IT as our best scorer. And i don't think he'd thrive as a second option. He has the ball in his hands too long way too often

To those mentioning lillard and harden.. I wouldn't want those guys. Ball stoppers. Or rather, i'd want those guys, but only as trade chips

Whoever mentioned curry earlier, he and IT shouldn't really be in the same sentence


The next 5 years are pretty much all about the warriors and cavs

I feel as though we'd be best off waiting them out (not tanking though)


I don't want the celtics to be stuck paying thomas 25 mil while potentially stunting the growth of our other point guards


I'd like to sell high on Thomas

Love his grit and determination, but that's just how i feel

I could be WAAAAAY wrong

Maybe we trade for cousins and roll out with IT bradley crowder al and cousins and win it all

I don't know


I do know that Thomas is an incredible talent and i get why people are offended by the notion of trading him, or having him come off the bench
I trust Danny Ainge

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2016, 01:40:44 PM »

Offline blink

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Like seriously? Dude is still our best scorer and like it or not, the only reason the C's won two games in the Hawks series last season is because of IT, because everyone else was shooting bricks.

But of course the answer is somewhere in the middle. He probably shoots a bit too much for how this offense is designed but then that same shot taking mindset has put teams away that might have otherwise gone on a run.

Trade IT? Preferably not, but by my estimation he's not untouchable.

This is basically how I feel as well.  We need him right now to generate points.  For his size he can occasionaly be a pesky defender.  The view that 'if he was 6'3" we would consider him to be untouchable' might be true, but he isn't 6'3" and his size certainly has an impact on our def schemes. 

If Smart, Rozier continue to improve, I could see us selling high on IT.  Not sure exactly when that would be, probably after this season.

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2016, 01:56:43 PM »

Offline Clench123

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Don't trade him, send him to the bench.

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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2016, 02:13:21 PM »

Online Moranis

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I'm confused by this thread.  There have been trade IT threads for months.
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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2016, 02:30:20 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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If we beat Toronto but lose to OKC with IT back

Or

Lose to Toronto bc cant produce offense and beat OKC with IT back as starter

One of these things will set off a firestorm in this forum

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2016, 02:32:10 PM »

Offline Rosco917

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Heck no...trade one of the best 6th men in the NBA? His value is very high as a 6th man, and less so as a starting PG.

We're just tossing the idea around that he may be more value off the bench, at opportune times in the game.


Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2016, 02:39:25 PM »

Offline mgent

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People are irrationally quick to throw IT under the bus because of his size. 

If he were 6'3'' with literally the exact same stats and performance people would be clamoring for him to be an MVP candidate.  He'd be considered untouchable.

Well, duh.  If he was 6'3" he probably wouldn't be constantly taken advantage of on defense.

One great offensive player can carry a great offense (as can 2 or 3 or 4), but your defense is only as good as your weakest link.  The other 4 can do the best they can to help, but eventually the little guy is gonna get isolated.

That's the only reason anybody would ever look to trade IT.

And so long as we get back an equal offensive player who is better at defense/rebounding, I don't see why anybody would have a probably with it.  And we're actually in a great situation, because we could trade him for a player of any position 1-5, and AB/Smart/Jae/Horford are so versatile that it works.
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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2016, 02:43:05 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Well, duh.  If he was 6'3" he probably wouldn't be constantly taken advantage of on defense.


I don't think so.  Damian Lillard and Kyrie Irving are pretty awful defenders at around that size.  Yet all agree they are superstar players. 

What I'm saying is, forget about physical ability.  Focus on results.  If IT were the same size as Lillard or Irving, with exactly the same results, he would be seen very differently.
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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2016, 02:44:57 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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If he were 6 inches taller and still just as bad on defense (like, say, Damian Lillard), people wouldn't be nearly as critical even if he was still the exact same player

Precisely my point.
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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2016, 02:45:08 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

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I'm in the trade IT camp because

- you'll never win it all with a 5'9" PG.  (CLE has been especially punishing vs IT)
- he's gonna get paid and tie up cap disproportionate to his value
- he's a crutch offensively
- I don't think he'll age well, which we debated ad nauseum in another thread

Love him as a person and a player, but if you can get value I think trading him is correct.

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2016, 02:50:47 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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And so long as we get back an equal offensive player who is better at defense/rebounding, I don't see why anybody would have a probably with it.

Well, sure.

What player are you envisioning that fits that description? 

How many guys in the league right now are equal to IT offensively while better at defense and rebounding?


Here's a list of guys who put up 25+ points per 36, 5+ assists per 36 minutes with at least 55% True shooting:

- Kevin Durant
- James Harden
- Stephen Curry
- Damian Lillard
- Isaiah Thomas
- Kemba Walker
- Kyrie Irving

If you lower the points to 20+ per-36, the following names are included:

Chris Paul
Giannis Antetokounmpo
John Wall


Basically ... if you're trading IT, there better be an All-NBA caliber player coming back the other way.  Otherwise, it's likely to be a downgrade.  He is an extremely rare offensive talent.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2016, 02:54:44 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Well, duh.  If he was 6'3" he probably wouldn't be constantly taken advantage of on defense.


I don't think so.  Damian Lillard and Kyrie Irving are pretty awful defenders at around that size.  Yet all agree they are superstar players. 

What I'm saying is, forget about physical ability.  Focus on results.  If IT were the same size as Lillard or Irving, with exactly the same results, he would be seen very differently.

This is a really good point and I agree with this completely

Re: Really People... 1 Game And It's Already "Trade IT"???
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2016, 02:59:46 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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Well, duh.  If he was 6'3" he probably wouldn't be constantly taken advantage of on defense.


I don't think so.  Damian Lillard and Kyrie Irving are pretty awful defenders at around that size.  Yet all agree they are superstar players. 

What I'm saying is, forget about physical ability.  Focus on results.  If IT were the same size as Lillard or Irving, with exactly the same results, he would be seen very differently.

This is a really good point and I agree with this completely
I think one key difference here is why the 3 listed players struggle on defense. It is my understanding that Irvings struggles can primarily be attributed to a lack of intensity and concentration. We've seen him buckle down and defend really well in the playoffs because he can pick up the intensity for stretches. Isaiah Thomas cannot be 6'3" for stretches.
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