Smart gets flop warning from NBA

[walker834]

Rozier's jumper looked so good tonight.  He has a really good shot.  He got enough minutes tonight where he heated up.

[Chief]

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

Well ...

He's not getting as many steals, his rebounding is a little bit worse, his shooting isn't any better, he's getting to the rim less, his free throw rate is less ...

Also, his defensive rating stinks.

I guess the answer is that he's providing ballhandling and playmaking on the second unit.  His assist rate is significantly higher than it was last year.  But his point per-36 are down despite his usage rate being higher.

Combine that with the fact that his defense has not been up to his previous standard.

So, yeah, Smart seems to be stagnating.  It's pretty disappointing.

I don't care what his defensive rating is. My eyes see differently. It's amazing how many positions he can guard and nearly down. Dude might be one of the best defenders I've ever seen.

[jpotter33]

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

Well ...

He's not getting as many steals, his rebounding is a little bit worse, his shooting isn't any better, he's getting to the rim less, his free throw rate is less ...

Also, his defensive rating stinks.

I guess the answer is that he's providing ballhandling and playmaking on the second unit.  His assist rate is significantly higher than it was last year.  But his point per-36 are down despite his usage rate being higher.

Combine that with the fact that his defense has not been up to his previous standard.

So, yeah, Smart seems to be stagnating.  It's pretty disappointing.

I don't care what his defensive rating is. My eyes see differently. It's amazing how many positions he can guard and nearly down. Dude might be one of the best defenders I've ever seen.

Once again, I hate defensive stats, because I don't think they can properly isolate an individual's impact.

However, Smart is also second in the league for point guards behind Chris Paul in Defensive Real Plus Minus. Rozier is even 18th for point guards.

https://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/DRPM/position/1

[Ogaju]

"Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart received a flop warning from the NBA for his exaggerated dive at the end of Monday's 107-106 loss to the Houston Rockets. As Al Horford's last-second layup attempt rolled off the rim, Smart embellished contact chasing a rebound in hopes of a whistle. Smart is only the fourth player to receive a warning this year."

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

But he sure can play D-Fence.

[Alleyoopster]

Sure, Marcus oversells some fouls. However, there are two bigger problems the NBA still doesn't recognize. 1. That he's regularly shafted by the refs. This was brought up a number of times last year in this group. The refs either don't know how to call fouls when Marcus gets position + a player runs into him or they simply don't know the rules.

2. Another seldom recognized event, is that the more blatant floppers would have to be on the offensive end. For example, players who make a living by driving into the defender with no real intention on scoring..,just drawing contact. Why aren't they being warned?

The other night Marcus broke through a pick and Harden moved into him at the same moment and threw up a 3-point  shot. They called the foul on Marcus. Talk about incompetency by the refs and what I would call offensive flopping .... that call takes the cake.

In a related topic, players most often cannot fight through a screen without being called for a foul. This rule deliberately sets up uncontested space. If that's what the NBA wants why not just have them play horse.

My main point is why isn't it called flopping when offensive players jump into defenders?

[kraidstar]

Smart gets clobbered on a regular basis, and often doesn't get the call.

Compare that to Harden's flopping, and yet we haven't heard a peep about that from the league since November 2013.

Tim Donaghy explained this discrepancy pretty well:

Relationships between NBA players and referees were generally all over the board — love, hate, and everything in-between. Some players, even very good ones, were targeted by referees and the league because they were too talented for their own good. Raja Bell, formerly of the Phoenix Suns and now a member of the Charlotte Bobcats, was one of those players. A defensive specialist throughout his career, Bell had a reputation for being a "star stopper." His defensive skills were so razor sharp that he could shut down a superstar, or at least make him work for his points. Kobe Bryant was often frustrated by Bell's tenacity on defense. Let's face it, no one completely shuts down a player of Kobe's caliber, but Bell could frustrate Kobe, take him out of his game, and interrupt his rhythm.

You would think that the NBA would love a guy who plays such great defense. Think again! Star stoppers hurt the promotion of marquee players. Fans don't pay high prices to see players like Raja Bell — they pay to see superstars like Kobe Bryant score 40 points. Basketball purists like to see good defense, but the NBA wants the big names to score big points.

If a player of Kobe's stature collides with the likes of Raja Bell, the call will almost always go for Kobe and against Bell. As part of our ongoing training and game preparation, NBA referees regularly receive game-action video tape from the league office. Over the years, I have reviewed many recorded hours of video involving Raja Bell. The footage I analyzed usually illustrated fouls being called against Bell, rarely for him. The message was subtle but clear — call fouls against the star stopper because he's hurting the game.

[greece66]

Smart is 22 yo

I'm fine with him experimenting and taking some risks in his game, esp. if he learns from his mistakes.

[TheSundanceKid]

Smart may be a good defensive player but his lack of offensive skills negates much of the benefit the Celtics receive from his defense.   He is an offensive liability so does his being a good defensive player offset his poor offense? - it my mind it does not. 

Metrics apparently show that Smart is actually a net liability to the Celtics.

MikeB

I think it comes down to role. Against the Magic he was the PG for the team and you saw his shots decrease and his efficiency skyrocket. With IT in the lineup he seems to think his role becomes a shooter and it damages his numbers. It's not what he naturally does.

What I'm hoping for is to see him used on the ball a bit more with IT playing off the ball like he did with ET in stretches last year. I should still be ur primary point of offense but I think it would do more to help Smart and therefore the team become more efficient. I don' see him suddenly upping his shooting percentages

[vjcsmoke]

LOL, really?  Who cares.  How many times has a player actually been called for flopping vs drawing free throws?  Until that ratio changes, there is no reason for a defensive player not to sell a foul as much as they can.

Take a look at the list of so called 10 worst floppers in NBA history and you see a list of HOFers and/or very good players:
http://www.goliath.com/sports/the-10-biggest-floppers-in-nba-history/8/

It's a total non-issue imo.

"Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart received a flop warning from the NBA for his exaggerated dive at the end of Monday's 107-106 loss to the Houston Rockets. As Al Horford's last-second layup attempt rolled off the rim, Smart embellished contact chasing a rebound in hopes of a whistle. Smart is only the fourth player to receive a warning this year."

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

[apc]

LOL, really?  Who cares.  How many times has a player actually been called for flopping vs drawing free throws?  Until that ratio changes, there is no reason for a defensive player not to sell a foul as much as they can.

Take a look at the list of so called 10 worst floppers in NBA history and you see a list of HOFers and/or very good players:
http://www.goliath.com/sports/the-10-biggest-floppers-in-nba-history/8/

It's a total non-issue imo.

"Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart received a flop warning from the NBA for his exaggerated dive at the end of Monday's 107-106 loss to the Houston Rockets. As Al Horford's last-second layup attempt rolled off the rim, Smart embellished contact chasing a rebound in hopes of a whistle. Smart is only the fourth player to receive a warning this year."

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

How did CP3 did not make it into that list?? big time flopper!

[kozlodoev]

LOL, really?  Who cares.  How many times has a player actually been called for flopping vs drawing free throws?  Until that ratio changes, there is no reason for a defensive player not to sell a foul as much as they can.

Take a look at the list of so called 10 worst floppers in NBA history and you see a list of HOFers and/or very good players:
http://www.goliath.com/sports/the-10-biggest-floppers-in-nba-history/8/

It's a total non-issue imo.

"Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart received a flop warning from the NBA for his exaggerated dive at the end of Monday's 107-106 loss to the Houston Rockets. As Al Horford's last-second layup attempt rolled off the rim, Smart embellished contact chasing a rebound in hopes of a whistle. Smart is only the fourth player to receive a warning this year."

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

How did CP3 did not make it into that list?? big time flopper!

Dunno. Not historic enough?

[Ilikesports17]

LOL, really?  Who cares.  How many times has a player actually been called for flopping vs drawing free throws?  Until that ratio changes, there is no reason for a defensive player not to sell a foul as much as they can.

Take a look at the list of so called 10 worst floppers in NBA history and you see a list of HOFers and/or very good players:
http://www.goliath.com/sports/the-10-biggest-floppers-in-nba-history/8/

It's a total non-issue imo.

"Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart received a flop warning from the NBA for his exaggerated dive at the end of Monday's 107-106 loss to the Houston Rockets. As Al Horford's last-second layup attempt rolled off the rim, Smart embellished contact chasing a rebound in hopes of a whistle. Smart is only the fourth player to receive a warning this year."

How much is Smart actually helping the Celtics?  Can't score, can't shoot and getting rep for being a flopper...

MikeB

How did CP3 did not make it into that list?? big time flopper!

Dunno. Not historic enough?

Europeans tend to flop more. I think it comes from soccer a little bit.

Also, that list is a bit misleading because if you are mediocre and flop a ton, no one is gonna remember or care about you. If you have a 15 year career and become a household name and flop a ton. Everyone remembers.

[PhoSita]

I don't care what his defensive rating is. My eyes see differently. It's amazing how many positions he can guard and nearly down. Dude might be one of the best defenders I've ever seen.

When he's really on, his defensive playmaking is spectacular.  Last night was a good example.

Games like last night wipe away any concerns and just leave you grinning, at least for a couple hours.

I remain disappointed in his lack of offensive development.  But he's a nice piece to have on the bench and I truly enjoy watching him play defense.

[blink]

my all time fav Smart flop.  versus Iowa State Deadre Kane, the dreaded double flop

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQoR4drTNDg

[Alleyoopster]

Smart gets clobbered on a regular basis, and often doesn't get the call.

Compare that to Harden's flopping, and yet we haven't heard a peep about that from the league since November 2013.

Tim Donaghy explained this discrepancy pretty well:

Relationships between NBA players and referees were generally all over the board — love, hate, and everything in-between. Some players, even very good ones, were targeted by referees and the league because they were too talented for their own good. Raja Bell, formerly of the Phoenix Suns and now a member of the Charlotte Bobcats, was one of those players. A defensive specialist throughout his career, Bell had a reputation for being a "star stopper." His defensive skills were so razor sharp that he could shut down a superstar, or at least make him work for his points. Kobe Bryant was often frustrated by Bell's tenacity on defense. Let's face it, no one completely shuts down a player of Kobe's caliber, but Bell could frustrate Kobe, take him out of his game, and interrupt his rhythm.

You would think that the NBA would love a guy who plays such great defense. Think again! Star stoppers hurt the promotion of marquee players. Fans don't pay high prices to see players like Raja Bell — they pay to see superstars like Kobe Bryant score 40 points. Basketball purists like to see good defense, but the NBA wants the big names to score big points.

If a player of Kobe's stature collides with the likes of Raja Bell, the call will almost always go for Kobe and against Bell. As part of our ongoing training and game preparation, NBA referees regularly receive game-action video tape from the league office. Over the years, I have reviewed many recorded hours of video involving Raja Bell. The footage I analyzed usually illustrated fouls being called against Bell, rarely for him. The message was subtle but clear — call fouls against the star stopper because he's hurting the game.

TP  a great article find - a possible correlation? That is interesting... 

Conducting a study to find out how much foul bias still exists in the NBA might make for sizzling analysis.

Is there deliberate fraud going on? If so, such information could open the NBA up to a Federal investigation.  They'd need to hire a good size crew (with lots of capital) to sift through 10,000 hours or more of tape or more to find out the whole truth.  Or, maybe this wouldn't take that much manpower???