Poll

Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?

Yes
60 (63.8%)
No
34 (36.2%)

Total Members Voted: 94

Author Topic: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?  (Read 28857 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #150 on: December 08, 2016, 08:52:13 AM »

Offline Big333223

  • NCE
  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7477
  • Tommy Points: 736
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
1957, 1959, 1960, 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1965, 1966, 1968, 1969, 1974, 1976, 1981, 1984, 1986, 2008

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #151 on: December 08, 2016, 06:46:42 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

  • NCE
  • Johnny Most
  • ********************
  • Posts: 20000
  • Tommy Points: 1323
I feel he is neutral pick, he is not good  ( lacks confidence, is passive) and he is not bad ( unique skill set, basketball IQ).  He plays and contributes, some nights he dominates (rarely) and some nights he disappears.   He is an NBA quality rotation player.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #152 on: December 08, 2016, 07:05:13 PM »

Offline Celtics18

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11688
  • Tommy Points: 1469
I feel he is neutral pick, he is not good  ( lacks confidence, is passive) and he is not bad ( unique skill set, basketball IQ).  He plays and contributes, some nights he dominates (rarely) and some nights he disappears.   He is an NBA quality rotation player.

Agreed.  It's taken him longer than it should, but I still feel like the passivity and confidence issues are things he can improve on as he continues to mature.
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #153 on: December 08, 2016, 08:25:50 PM »

Offline Eja117

  • NCE
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19274
  • Tommy Points: 1254
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
Did we just compare KO to Vucevic? Did that just happen?

It's more like comparing him to JR Giddens

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #154 on: December 08, 2016, 08:55:46 PM »

Offline Celtics18

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11688
  • Tommy Points: 1469
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
Did we just compare KO to Vucevic? Did that just happen?

It's more like comparing him to JR Giddens

Obviously, Nik Vucevic is a much more apt comparison for Kelly than JR Giddens and his total of 247 NBA minutes.
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #155 on: December 08, 2016, 09:34:11 PM »

Offline obnoxiousmime

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2421
  • Tommy Points: 258
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.

The criticism is legitimate because Giannis was only picked two picks later. It's not like you're just cherry picking some guy in the 2nd round who turned out to be good and exclaiming, "See! Why didn't Ainge take him???" Also, Ainge clearly showed interest. He went to see Giannis play in person.

Saying Giannis was a humongous missed opportunity does not necessarily mean one hates Olynyk or thinks he is a bust. They're not mutually exclusive.

Ultimately Ainge will be judged by championships and the way to win one is by drafting or acquiring stars. Drafting OK role players like Olynyk is nice, but ultimately doesn't make a huge difference in the larger picture. Look at Sullinger - a nice pick, helped us win some games. Unfortunately, he wasn't good enough to be the centerpiece in a deal for a star, and he also wasn't good enough to be re-signed and decreasing our flexibility. Olynyk will be in the same situation this offseason.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #156 on: December 08, 2016, 09:52:07 PM »

Offline Eja117

  • NCE
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19274
  • Tommy Points: 1254
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
Did we just compare KO to Vucevic? Did that just happen?

It's more like comparing him to JR Giddens

Obviously, Nik Vucevic is a much more apt comparison for Kelly than JR Giddens and his total of 247 NBA minutes.
By that logic maybe we should compare him to Hakeem too. I mean Hakeem played a lot of minutes at the same position and he had Jordan picked two spots after him but Hakeem was a good pick. Right?

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #157 on: December 08, 2016, 10:36:13 PM »

Offline Celtics18

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11688
  • Tommy Points: 1469
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
Did we just compare KO to Vucevic? Did that just happen?

It's more like comparing him to JR Giddens

Obviously, Nik Vucevic is a much more apt comparison for Kelly than JR Giddens and his total of 247 NBA minutes.
By that logic maybe we should compare him to Hakeem too. I mean Hakeem played a lot of minutes at the same position and he had Jordan picked two spots after him but Hakeem was a good pick. Right?

Yes, Hakeem was a good pick.  Not as good as Jordan, but an all-time great in his own right.

As far as my logic about Kelly Olynyk having more in common with Nik Vucevic than JR Giddens, well, yes, that's still true.
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #158 on: December 08, 2016, 10:57:20 PM »

Offline Rondo9

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5379
  • Tommy Points: 277
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.

The criticism is legitimate because Giannis was only picked two picks later. It's not like you're just cherry picking some guy in the 2nd round who turned out to be good and exclaiming, "See! Why didn't Ainge take him???" Also, Ainge clearly showed interest. He went to see Giannis play in person.

Saying Giannis was a humongous missed opportunity does not necessarily mean one hates Olynyk or thinks he is a bust. They're not mutually exclusive.

Ultimately Ainge will be judged by championships and the way to win one is by drafting or acquiring stars. Drafting OK role players like Olynyk is nice, but ultimately doesn't make a huge difference in the larger picture. Look at Sullinger - a nice pick, helped us win some games. Unfortunately, he wasn't good enough to be the centerpiece in a deal for a star, and he also wasn't good enough to be re-signed and decreasing our flexibility. Olynyk will be in the same situation this offseason.

Who knew Giannis would be this good? He was a high risk considering that was a weak draft other gms should've scouted him out too

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #159 on: December 08, 2016, 11:26:30 PM »

Offline liam

  • NCE
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 43360
  • Tommy Points: 3148
Wouldn't L. Nogueira look good in green right about now? Ah, hindsight is always 20/20. In every draft there are going to be players you wish you took. I think the Lakers are going to be kicking themselves for not taking Jaylen but I guess we'll see.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #160 on: December 09, 2016, 07:32:18 AM »

Offline adam8

  • Al Horford
  • Posts: 415
  • Tommy Points: 54
It wasn't a weak draft at all. And even if it was then that would mean there were a lot of bad picks and he was one of them.

It's very easy to name 3 guys picked after him we'd rather have by a ton and a couple others that are better difference makers or just better.

You also have to ignore that Steven Adams was picked one pick ahead of him. Pretty huge drop off
2013 was most definitely a weak draft. Certainly in top end talent (Giannis is looking like the only all star in the entire draft). It's looking more and more like there were solid players deeper in the draft but certainly not more than you'd find in any other decent year.

Of course there were better players after Kelly, but let's not forget that Anthony Bennett, Cody Zeller, Ben Mclemore, Trey Burke, and the ROY Michael Carter-Williams (who already has one foot out of the league) were selected ahead of him. For his position in the draft and the type of talent around him, he was a pretty good pick. Not great, pretty good.

But claiming he was a bad pick just because there were better players after him is like saying Nikola Vucevic was a bad pick at 16 in 2011 because Jimmy Butler and Isaiah Thomas were still on the board.
Did we just compare KO to Vucevic? Did that just happen?

It's more like comparing him to JR Giddens

Obviously, Nik Vucevic is a much more apt comparison for Kelly than JR Giddens and his total of 247 NBA minutes.
By that logic maybe we should compare him to Hakeem too. I mean Hakeem played a lot of minutes at the same position and he had Jordan picked two spots after him but Hakeem was a good pick. Right?
See this is looking backwards at a draft, you have to go back to the time of the draft and in that draft there was no question Hakeem was going to be the first pick, big men with that skill set are going to be taken over swings and guards that's how it works, and Hakeem was an all-time great so it was an easy pick and also a very good pick. That is why you always hear about Bowie going in front of Jordan not Hakeem.

The way I look at this if you are a guy that likes to swing for the fences, was happy when the Celts took Gerald Green over Danny Granger than you wanted Giannis, if you prefer taking a guy that you know has some NBA level skills you take Olynyk but you can't look back and cherry pick the couple swing for the fences guys that were hits without also saying I liked all these guys that were busts.

I liked the Gerald pick at the time, and I was rooting for us to take Giannis at the time but I don't blame Danny at all, his job is on the line with the decisions he makes, I just sit on the couch and like to root for crazy athletic projects to pan out.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #161 on: December 09, 2016, 07:54:04 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

  • NCE
  • Johnny Most
  • ********************
  • Posts: 20000
  • Tommy Points: 1323
Quote
Wouldn't L. Nogueira look good in green right about now? Ah, hindsight is always 20/20. In every draft there are going to be players you wish you took. I think the Lakers are going to be kicking themselves for not taking Jaylen but I guess we'll see.


It is true, hindsight gives a big advantage.   But I looked on his body of work as a player when I judged if he was a good pick, rather than the draft.   This lead to me, to my conclusion that he is a NBA rotation player, who can be good one game and invisible the next.  Taking the draft away from the equation, he contributes but it is clear Ainge missed the chance to get a star.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #162 on: December 09, 2016, 08:58:15 AM »

Offline The Oracle

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1197
  • Tommy Points: 597
Quote
Wouldn't L. Nogueira look good in green right about now? Ah, hindsight is always 20/20. In every draft there are going to be players you wish you took. I think the Lakers are going to be kicking themselves for not taking Jaylen but I guess we'll see.


It is true, hindsight gives a big advantage.   But I looked on his body of work as a player when I judged if he was a good pick, rather than the draft.   This lead to me, to my conclusion that he is a NBA rotation player, who can be good one game and invisible the next.  Taking the draft away from the equation, he contributes but it is clear Ainge missed the chance to get a star.
K.O. is only invisible to those who refuse to see.  He always plays solid D, He always sets great screens, he always is a really good floor spacer etc.  People love to judge him by what they see in the box score and very often the box score is only telling a small part of the story.  His +/- numbers have been ridiculous when compared to his teammates over all of his 4 years and it is no accident.  His excellent defensive ratings are no accident either and in addition to all the little things he does well results in a player that makes a very positive impact.

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #163 on: December 09, 2016, 09:13:00 AM »

Offline TheSundanceKid

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2493
  • Tommy Points: 199
Giannis was a missed opportunity but to pretend that it was a no brainer for DA to pick him is just ludicrous. There were huge question marks over GA, the biggest one being could he actually play basketball or was he just an athlete? Even after his rookie season that question wasn't answered.

KO was a good pick for his draft position. He is quite clearly in the top 13 players of that draft. The fact that someone picked behind him managed to overcome all his question marks does not make him a bad pick. For every Giannis there is a Fab Melo and some.

I think Cs fans are yearning for our next superstar and in place of that atm we are putting unfair expectations on our recent picks. Smart, KO and Sully have all been criticised for not being perfect players but what people forget is that none of them are called Michael Jordan...

Re: Is it safe to say that Kelly Olynyk was a good pick by Ainge now?
« Reply #164 on: December 09, 2016, 09:17:39 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 36703
  • Tommy Points: 2951
If he plays great defense on Raptors BiGs tonight ,  I'll heap praise.  At 7 ft he need help rebounding and boxing out their bigs .  It makes me mad to see our little guards boxing out BiGs while Kelly stands around watching  ::)