Author Topic: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?  (Read 8944 times)

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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2016, 08:34:08 PM »

Offline tankcity!

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He's a stud. I've been on his bandwagon since last year. I'm going to tp myself

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2016, 08:50:55 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2016, 08:58:27 PM »

Offline Snakehead

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The point of this thread is not this year.  It's talking about IT's future with the team past this year.

Rozier is certainly not getting 27 mins a game this year.
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2016, 11:07:52 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Rozier last year went what...4-13 , 3-10 etc

got a few nice clutch jump shots. Even at the playoff level. But again consistency was an issue

And his fg per has been so so (41, 42 per) dating back to his 1st year in college.. 

BUT.. this season so far (SL and Preseason), I mean he has been lights out shooting.  5-7, 4-8, 6-11..  from the 3 pt line 2-3 etc.    very impressive

Even if he starts to struggle a little in real games (likely) ,  he looks like a guy that will launch another 1000 shots after the game is over.  Then wake up and 1st thing in the morning do it again.

When he said he will bust his tail off for Danny , looks like he was not kidding.  Looking fwd to watching Rozier play this season

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2016, 11:40:06 PM »

Offline fantankerous

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IT has been my favorite player since we acquired him.  However, since this thread is about defining IT's value to the Celtics, let me throw out this scenario.  The Wizards are terrible out of the gate.  At or prior to the deadline, IT, Zeller, plus the Brooklyn 17 for John Wall.

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2016, 11:54:06 PM »

Online tazzmaniac

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IT has been my favorite player since we acquired him.  However, since this thread is about defining IT's value to the Celtics, let me throw out this scenario.  The Wizards are terrible out of the gate.  At or prior to the deadline, IT, Zeller, plus the Brooklyn 17 for John Wall.
That's an easy hell yes!!!  I figure there's a good chance we'll lose IT in 2 years anyway.  3 years of Wall on a good contract sounds great to me.  Danny could probably free up enough space to go after a MAX or at least near MAX player in the off season.  Griffin would be real nice or Noel as a fallback.  There would be a lot of possibilities.
 

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2016, 01:15:46 AM »

Offline Monkhouse

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IT has been my favorite player since we acquired him.  However, since this thread is about defining IT's value to the Celtics, let me throw out this scenario.  The Wizards are terrible out of the gate.  At or prior to the deadline, IT, Zeller, plus the Brooklyn 17 for John Wall.
That's an easy hell yes!!!  I figure there's a good chance we'll lose IT in 2 years anyway.  3 years of Wall on a good contract sounds great to me.  Danny could probably free up enough space to go after a MAX or at least near MAX player in the off season.  Griffin would be real nice or Noel as a fallback.  There would be a lot of possibilities.

Yeah no thanks.

I firmly believe if DMC doesn't get traded before his contract ends, that he would come to the Celtics willingly if we had the cap space... BUT THAT IS A BIG IF!!!

He has talked praise about Stevens, still close friends with IT, don't let him harping on about IT's incessant ball dribbling as a bad thing. When we start winning games, there won't be any issues or contempt from Cousins, who is by nature, emotional, but he's a very well oiled machine that will do his job in the right situation.

Either way, I feel like the Celtics should expedite this process. Go after Cousins. There is literally no team that is going to dole out the prospects, assets, and resources for Cousins that don't have enough leadership and stability to make him stay.

Just like Kevin Love, Cousins is going to be searching to join a playoff team, so he can at least experience it for himself. He wants to win.

So I say no. Save it to snag Cousins, and let our warts and chemistry

John Wall is an amazing player. Being so close to DC, has allowed me to see him, but I think Wall has it, but he's kind of has the same warts as IT. He's an awesome 2nd tier player, but he won't be able to elevate your team like a Westbrook or Curry can.

Save our assets, or go after DMC. Try to make enough cap space, and sign Hayward in the off-season. Go super small ball lol.
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2016, 01:26:56 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Agree re: minutes, not even sure he'd earn much more if available.  But you have to admit that Rozier is showing some signs that Smart isn't ... plenty of reason to be excited.  Halfway through last season, no one thought Young would catch RJ, either, but it's a discussion now.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 01:56:37 AM by tarheelsxxiii »
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2016, 01:57:26 AM »

Offline jpotter33

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Agree re: minutes, not even sure he'd earn much more if it were available.  But assuming he won't make a leap really isn't warranted imo.  You have to admit that Rozier is showing signs that Smart isn't ... plenty of reason to be excited.  Halfway through last season, no one thought Young would catch RJ, either, but it's a discussion now.

Oh, he'll definitely make a leap, and his shooting is definitely exciting, especially since that's Smart's one main overall weakness that is holding him back.

However, I'm arguing that the leap is going to be much smaller than many here are expecting or even suggesting. We see this all the time in summer league and preseason where people seemingly get on a hot playing streak at the right time. I'm guessing he'll get around 20 minutes of playing time and put up 8-9 points on overall pretty decent percentages. And that's absolutely great for someone in his context, but it's just not what people are ultimately expecting, even if it is a bit irrational to expect that from him right now. At least this year, he's not going to have the minutes and/or role to really do much more than that, if he even can do it consistently at the next level.

EDIT: I ultimately see Rozier as a Schroeder level prospect with a ceiling of being a pretty decent starter on a playoff team. He looks to be a better shooter and scorer than Schroeder right now, but Schroeder is much better defensively and as an overall floor general with getting others involved.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 02:03:29 AM by jpotter33 »

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2016, 02:01:38 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Agree re: minutes, not even sure he'd earn much more if it were available.  But assuming he won't make a leap really isn't warranted imo.  You have to admit that Rozier is showing signs that Smart isn't ... plenty of reason to be excited.  Halfway through last season, no one thought Young would catch RJ, either, but it's a discussion now.

Oh, he'll definitely make a leap, and his shooting is definitely exciting, especially since that's Smart's one main overall weakness that is holding him back.

However, I'm arguing that the leap is going to be much smaller than many here are expecting or even suggesting. We see this all the time in summer league and preseason where people seemingly get on a hot playing streak at the right time. I'm guessing he'll get around 20 minutes of playing time and put up 8-9 points on overall pretty decent percentages. And that's absolutely great for someone in his context, but it's just not what people are ultimately expecting, even if it is a bit irrational to expect that from him right now. At least this year, he's not going to have the minutes and/or role to really do much more than that, if he even can do it consistently at the next level.

Yeah, he was forced into Turner's role before he was ready imo. While that had to happen to get Al, the 2nd unit si concerning early on.  Maybe halfway through the year we will look much different -- Smart and Rozier equally.  Brown seems to have surpassed CB expectations at this point, which is always a good thing.
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #25 on: October 21, 2016, 02:05:33 AM »

Offline jpotter33

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Agree re: minutes, not even sure he'd earn much more if it were available.  But assuming he won't make a leap really isn't warranted imo.  You have to admit that Rozier is showing signs that Smart isn't ... plenty of reason to be excited.  Halfway through last season, no one thought Young would catch RJ, either, but it's a discussion now.

Oh, he'll definitely make a leap, and his shooting is definitely exciting, especially since that's Smart's one main overall weakness that is holding him back.

However, I'm arguing that the leap is going to be much smaller than many here are expecting or even suggesting. We see this all the time in summer league and preseason where people seemingly get on a hot playing streak at the right time. I'm guessing he'll get around 20 minutes of playing time and put up 8-9 points on overall pretty decent percentages. And that's absolutely great for someone in his context, but it's just not what people are ultimately expecting, even if it is a bit irrational to expect that from him right now. At least this year, he's not going to have the minutes and/or role to really do much more than that, if he even can do it consistently at the next level.

Yeah, he was forced into Turner's role before he was ready imo. While that had to happen to get Al, the 2nd unit si concerning early on.  Maybe halfway through the year we will look much different -- Smart and Rozier equally.  Brown seems to have surpassed CB expectations at this point, which is always a good thing.

I'm not worried about the second unit. I think Smart and Rozier can handle themselves fine, and there will almost always be one to two starters out there with them to help, which we hardly saw at all in the preseason. KO coming back should help, too.

EDIT: The biggest change I saw between the first and second group was the lack of a playmaking big out there. It seemed that when Horford sat down we stopped doing a lot of the things that were making us look so impressive out there.

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #26 on: October 21, 2016, 02:07:53 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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Rozier's outstanding preseason and summer league performances show the postseason experience is paying off.  I do think he will play, a backup role, to Isaiah, just like Smart did last year, so around 27 minutes.  Isaiah won't be affected this year or after resigning.  If after Rozier overtakes or equals Isaiah then moving on would be beneficial. But if my intuition holds true, Isaiah in couple years, not as athletic and therefore defensively liable, is forced into the sixth man role.  Now, the salary cap may interrupt that logic, so it will depend on the contract signed after this year.  Most don't agree with his sixth man fit now he is our superstar but I suspect that Ainge  had him in mind for just that.

He's not getting 27 minutes a game. He'll be lucky to even get 20. There's just not the minutes there for him,and he's hardly even a defensive upgrade over IT.

People are just overreacting to an early preseason performance once again. It happens every year on a number of teams across the league. When the season starts, he'll come back down to Earth, and all of this will seem like exaggerated ridiculousness like it always does.

Terry has been good, but people are really exaggerating and reaching with some of this Rozier stuff.

Agree re: minutes, not even sure he'd earn much more if it were available.  But assuming he won't make a leap really isn't warranted imo.  You have to admit that Rozier is showing signs that Smart isn't ... plenty of reason to be excited.  Halfway through last season, no one thought Young would catch RJ, either, but it's a discussion now.

Oh, he'll definitely make a leap, and his shooting is definitely exciting, especially since that's Smart's one main overall weakness that is holding him back.

However, I'm arguing that the leap is going to be much smaller than many here are expecting or even suggesting. We see this all the time in summer league and preseason where people seemingly get on a hot playing streak at the right time. I'm guessing he'll get around 20 minutes of playing time and put up 8-9 points on overall pretty decent percentages. And that's absolutely great for someone in his context, but it's just not what people are ultimately expecting, even if it is a bit irrational to expect that from him right now. At least this year, he's not going to have the minutes and/or role to really do much more than that, if he even can do it consistently at the next level.

Yeah, he was forced into Turner's role before he was ready imo. While that had to happen to get Al, the 2nd unit si concerning early on.  Maybe halfway through the year we will look much different -- Smart and Rozier equally.  Brown seems to have surpassed CB expectations at this point, which is always a good thing.

I'm not worried about the second unit. I think Smart and Rozier can handle themselves fine, and there will almost always be one to two starters out there with them to help, which we hardly saw at all in the preseason. KO coming back should help, too.

Yes, and I think Green will provide solid minutes with them at times, too.  I got an alert from 'theScore' earlier that KO won't be back till mid November.   
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 02:17:49 AM by tarheelsxxiii »
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #27 on: October 21, 2016, 04:16:45 AM »

Online trickybilly

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Candidates in play who i would consider trading IT for:

Marc gasol
Blake


That is all.
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Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #28 on: October 21, 2016, 08:18:04 AM »

Offline clover

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Personally I think long term IT will be leaving.  He is just too good to be a bench guy, but I think we will want to spend elsewhere.  We will bring Smart up to start with Rozier coming off the bench.

I really like IT a lot but I think that's how it plays out.

Agreed. The question IMO is whether Danny trades him, when, and if so for whom. If Danny keeps him through this contract, I could see TRoz and IT on next year's championship team, with TRoz starting by the playoffs next year. It is possible that Smart's PGing and DJ's game come on quickly enough that Danny trades IT by this summer.

Re: If Rozier keeps up his play, how does IT future with the Celts play out?
« Reply #29 on: October 21, 2016, 09:14:46 AM »

Offline dreamgreen

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I think for the time being we should be wondering how much he will affect the future of Marcus Smart.

At just the right time, Rozier will get some serious minutes while Marcus recovers. He isn't quite the defensive monster Smart is, but he's clearly a plus defender, he's a great rebounder, and he makes shots consistently, something Marcus just hasn't proven he can do.

I expect to see Rozier averaging double figures while he's gone. They may end up switching spots on the depth chart.

This is the correct answer. Terry has no impact on Isaiah for the foreseeable future. Marcus is the one who will be impacted by Terry's emergence.

Yea if TRoz comes out of the gate firing on all cylinders and Smart misses a handful of games CBS will be forced to keep playing him.