Author Topic: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."  (Read 38430 times)

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Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2016, 02:48:44 PM »

Offline walker834

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I think the next 2 drafts are somewhat overrated where Ainge has made everyone believe these picks are gold. They are good drafts but not nearly as good as the last few.

Deandre Ayton looks good.  Philly will take him too and still have the 1st pick by then?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 02:57:50 PM by walker834 »

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #31 on: September 26, 2016, 03:00:26 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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He sounds annoyed.  He clearly wants out.  Tough situation for him... He's one of the best defensive prospects in the league.  He has the potential to anchor a team's defense.  And yet he's stuck in a situation where he might be the third string center on a team that should still be in the lotto next season.  You can't blame him for being salty.  Especially if it cuts into his minutes and impacts his free agency options next summer.   He wants minutes so he can get paid.

TP. That's what many of us have been saying this whole time, though I think they ultimately like Noel more than Okafor and would give him more minutes than Okafor. However, it looks like Noel is going to force their hand to trade him over Okafor anyways with all of this talk.
I don't blame Noel for being frustrated but that doesn't mean Philly "needs" to make a trade. They will almost certainly move someone when the time is right, but there is no gun to their head forcing them to take pennies on the dollar right now.  Despite how frustrated Noel is, it's probably still best for Philly to wait and see how things shake out.  If the offers are weak, they should just hang onto the guys - regardless of how salty Noel is.  That's what a lot of fans fail to understand when they come up with their silly lopsided trade offers.   15 mins out of Noel off the bench is better than trading him for a late 1st or a d-leaguer who will get 15 mins off the bench.

Disagree. Not only does this pretty much screw Philly with agents, who will not appreciate them screwing over Noel in a contract year, but it's obviously just going to decrease his trade value even more by (a) him barely playing and (b) being a locker room disturbance.

You can say they should hold out for a better option, but with the way things are going, it doesn't make any sense that the offers would go help with him hardly playing, having less time left on his contract, and him becoming a locker room issue.
You are assuming he barely plays, which I find highly unlikely.  I mean Philly has already gone on the record saying Embiid will not play back to backs and will be on a heavy minutes restriction (that is if he even manages to stay healthy all year).  I'm guessing Noel will play at least 24 minutes a night and would probably guess it more in the 30 minute range. 

Him being a lockerroom disturbance is on him and will only hurt his free agent value.
Where are these minutes coming from? Is Okafor not playing? There won't be any minutes at PF for him because of Simmons and you can't even bump Simmons to SF (which would be a bad idea anyway) because Saric is there. And Saric should really be playing some minutes at PF himself.

Noel is fighting 2 other guys who can only play center for 48 minutes a night.
2 of those 3 guys will play a fair amount of time at PF.  Simmons will play a lot at SF. 

There are 7,872 minutes available from the PF and C position.  I'd guess the end minutes are something like this:

Noel - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Okafor - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Embiid - 1440 - 60 games - 24 minutes
Simmons - 1600 (rest of time at SF) - 77 games - 21 minutes

and that still leaves 232 minutes

Absolutely no way Simmons can play SF that much. He's absolutely a PF, not a SF. They might try it for awhile, but they'll quickly see that he won't work there. He has enough trouble as it is defensively at the 4, how is he going to guard even faster and better overall 3's?

And don't forget that they have Covington at the 3 and small-ball 4, too.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #32 on: September 26, 2016, 03:02:33 PM »

Offline Big333223

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He sounds annoyed.  He clearly wants out.  Tough situation for him... He's one of the best defensive prospects in the league.  He has the potential to anchor a team's defense.  And yet he's stuck in a situation where he might be the third string center on a team that should still be in the lotto next season.  You can't blame him for being salty.  Especially if it cuts into his minutes and impacts his free agency options next summer.   He wants minutes so he can get paid.

TP. That's what many of us have been saying this whole time, though I think they ultimately like Noel more than Okafor and would give him more minutes than Okafor. However, it looks like Noel is going to force their hand to trade him over Okafor anyways with all of this talk.
I don't blame Noel for being frustrated but that doesn't mean Philly "needs" to make a trade. They will almost certainly move someone when the time is right, but there is no gun to their head forcing them to take pennies on the dollar right now.  Despite how frustrated Noel is, it's probably still best for Philly to wait and see how things shake out.  If the offers are weak, they should just hang onto the guys - regardless of how salty Noel is.  That's what a lot of fans fail to understand when they come up with their silly lopsided trade offers.   15 mins out of Noel off the bench is better than trading him for a late 1st or a d-leaguer who will get 15 mins off the bench.

Disagree. Not only does this pretty much screw Philly with agents, who will not appreciate them screwing over Noel in a contract year, but it's obviously just going to decrease his trade value even more by (a) him barely playing and (b) being a locker room disturbance.

You can say they should hold out for a better option, but with the way things are going, it doesn't make any sense that the offers would go help with him hardly playing, having less time left on his contract, and him becoming a locker room issue.
You are assuming he barely plays, which I find highly unlikely.  I mean Philly has already gone on the record saying Embiid will not play back to backs and will be on a heavy minutes restriction (that is if he even manages to stay healthy all year).  I'm guessing Noel will play at least 24 minutes a night and would probably guess it more in the 30 minute range. 

Him being a lockerroom disturbance is on him and will only hurt his free agent value.
Where are these minutes coming from? Is Okafor not playing? There won't be any minutes at PF for him because of Simmons and you can't even bump Simmons to SF (which would be a bad idea anyway) because Saric is there. And Saric should really be playing some minutes at PF himself.

Noel is fighting 2 other guys who can only play center for 48 minutes a night.
2 of those 3 guys will play a fair amount of time at PF.  Simmons will play a lot at SF. 

There are 7,872 minutes available from the PF and C position.  I'd guess the end minutes are something like this:

Noel - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Okafor - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Embiid - 1440 - 60 games - 24 minutes
Simmons - 1600 (rest of time at SF) - 77 games - 21 minutes

and that still leaves 232 minutes
How is Simmons going to play most of his time at SF when they've got Saric, Covington, and Grant? All are small forwards who should be getting minutes at PF as well.

And that's before we even get into how unsuited Simmons is to play SF,
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Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #33 on: September 26, 2016, 03:11:03 PM »

Offline ManUp

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Simmons is a pf until he finds some range.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #34 on: September 26, 2016, 03:12:20 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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He sounds annoyed.  He clearly wants out.  Tough situation for him... He's one of the best defensive prospects in the league.  He has the potential to anchor a team's defense.  And yet he's stuck in a situation where he might be the third string center on a team that should still be in the lotto next season.  You can't blame him for being salty.  Especially if it cuts into his minutes and impacts his free agency options next summer.   He wants minutes so he can get paid.

TP. That's what many of us have been saying this whole time, though I think they ultimately like Noel more than Okafor and would give him more minutes than Okafor. However, it looks like Noel is going to force their hand to trade him over Okafor anyways with all of this talk.
I don't blame Noel for being frustrated but that doesn't mean Philly "needs" to make a trade. They will almost certainly move someone when the time is right, but there is no gun to their head forcing them to take pennies on the dollar right now.  Despite how frustrated Noel is, it's probably still best for Philly to wait and see how things shake out.  If the offers are weak, they should just hang onto the guys - regardless of how salty Noel is.  That's what a lot of fans fail to understand when they come up with their silly lopsided trade offers.   15 mins out of Noel off the bench is better than trading him for a late 1st or a d-leaguer who will get 15 mins off the bench.

Disagree. Not only does this pretty much screw Philly with agents, who will not appreciate them screwing over Noel in a contract year, but it's obviously just going to decrease his trade value even more by (a) him barely playing and (b) being a locker room disturbance.

You can say they should hold out for a better option, but with the way things are going, it doesn't make any sense that the offers would go help with him hardly playing, having less time left on his contract, and him becoming a locker room issue.
You are assuming he barely plays, which I find highly unlikely.  I mean Philly has already gone on the record saying Embiid will not play back to backs and will be on a heavy minutes restriction (that is if he even manages to stay healthy all year).  I'm guessing Noel will play at least 24 minutes a night and would probably guess it more in the 30 minute range. 

Him being a lockerroom disturbance is on him and will only hurt his free agent value.
Where are these minutes coming from? Is Okafor not playing? There won't be any minutes at PF for him because of Simmons and you can't even bump Simmons to SF (which would be a bad idea anyway) because Saric is there. And Saric should really be playing some minutes at PF himself.

Noel is fighting 2 other guys who can only play center for 48 minutes a night.
Not to mention, Covington will likely also be in the mix for minutes at the 3.
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Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2016, 03:12:41 PM »

Offline Moranis

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He sounds annoyed.  He clearly wants out.  Tough situation for him... He's one of the best defensive prospects in the league.  He has the potential to anchor a team's defense.  And yet he's stuck in a situation where he might be the third string center on a team that should still be in the lotto next season.  You can't blame him for being salty.  Especially if it cuts into his minutes and impacts his free agency options next summer.   He wants minutes so he can get paid.

TP. That's what many of us have been saying this whole time, though I think they ultimately like Noel more than Okafor and would give him more minutes than Okafor. However, it looks like Noel is going to force their hand to trade him over Okafor anyways with all of this talk.
I don't blame Noel for being frustrated but that doesn't mean Philly "needs" to make a trade. They will almost certainly move someone when the time is right, but there is no gun to their head forcing them to take pennies on the dollar right now.  Despite how frustrated Noel is, it's probably still best for Philly to wait and see how things shake out.  If the offers are weak, they should just hang onto the guys - regardless of how salty Noel is.  That's what a lot of fans fail to understand when they come up with their silly lopsided trade offers.   15 mins out of Noel off the bench is better than trading him for a late 1st or a d-leaguer who will get 15 mins off the bench.

Disagree. Not only does this pretty much screw Philly with agents, who will not appreciate them screwing over Noel in a contract year, but it's obviously just going to decrease his trade value even more by (a) him barely playing and (b) being a locker room disturbance.

You can say they should hold out for a better option, but with the way things are going, it doesn't make any sense that the offers would go help with him hardly playing, having less time left on his contract, and him becoming a locker room issue.
You are assuming he barely plays, which I find highly unlikely.  I mean Philly has already gone on the record saying Embiid will not play back to backs and will be on a heavy minutes restriction (that is if he even manages to stay healthy all year).  I'm guessing Noel will play at least 24 minutes a night and would probably guess it more in the 30 minute range. 

Him being a lockerroom disturbance is on him and will only hurt his free agent value.
Where are these minutes coming from? Is Okafor not playing? There won't be any minutes at PF for him because of Simmons and you can't even bump Simmons to SF (which would be a bad idea anyway) because Saric is there. And Saric should really be playing some minutes at PF himself.

Noel is fighting 2 other guys who can only play center for 48 minutes a night.
2 of those 3 guys will play a fair amount of time at PF.  Simmons will play a lot at SF. 

There are 7,872 minutes available from the PF and C position.  I'd guess the end minutes are something like this:

Noel - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Okafor - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Embiid - 1440 - 60 games - 24 minutes
Simmons - 1600 (rest of time at SF) - 77 games - 21 minutes

and that still leaves 232 minutes

Absolutely no way Simmons can play SF that much. He's absolutely a PF, not a SF. They might try it for awhile, but they'll quickly see that he won't work there. He has enough trouble as it is defensively at the 4, how is he going to guard even faster and better overall 3's?

And don't forget that they have Covington at the 3 and small-ball 4, too.
I'm confused, how many minutes do you think Simmons is going to play as a rookie?  Take last year's rookies, Towns led the way with 32 and only Mudiay and Okafor were also over 30.  I've got Simmons pegged for 21 at PF (and there are still 232 minutes at PF I didn't assign), even if Simmons plays what Towns did, that is just 11 minutes a night at SF.  I actually think Simmons will be closer to 30 minutes a night, which puts him at 9 at SF and again that is if he doesn't get some of those 232 left over at PF. 

I don't think Saric will play more than 20 minutes a night, which even if Simmons is 11 minutes at SF, still leaves 17 minutes for Covington at SF and he still has those 232 extra minutes at PF that could easily go to him.
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Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #36 on: September 26, 2016, 03:14:00 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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He sounds annoyed.  He clearly wants out.  Tough situation for him... He's one of the best defensive prospects in the league.  He has the potential to anchor a team's defense.  And yet he's stuck in a situation where he might be the third string center on a team that should still be in the lotto next season.  You can't blame him for being salty.  Especially if it cuts into his minutes and impacts his free agency options next summer.   He wants minutes so he can get paid.

TP. That's what many of us have been saying this whole time, though I think they ultimately like Noel more than Okafor and would give him more minutes than Okafor. However, it looks like Noel is going to force their hand to trade him over Okafor anyways with all of this talk.
I don't blame Noel for being frustrated but that doesn't mean Philly "needs" to make a trade. They will almost certainly move someone when the time is right, but there is no gun to their head forcing them to take pennies on the dollar right now.  Despite how frustrated Noel is, it's probably still best for Philly to wait and see how things shake out.  If the offers are weak, they should just hang onto the guys - regardless of how salty Noel is.  That's what a lot of fans fail to understand when they come up with their silly lopsided trade offers.   15 mins out of Noel off the bench is better than trading him for a late 1st or a d-leaguer who will get 15 mins off the bench.

Disagree. Not only does this pretty much screw Philly with agents, who will not appreciate them screwing over Noel in a contract year, but it's obviously just going to decrease his trade value even more by (a) him barely playing and (b) being a locker room disturbance.

You can say they should hold out for a better option, but with the way things are going, it doesn't make any sense that the offers would go help with him hardly playing, having less time left on his contract, and him becoming a locker room issue.
You are assuming he barely plays, which I find highly unlikely.  I mean Philly has already gone on the record saying Embiid will not play back to backs and will be on a heavy minutes restriction (that is if he even manages to stay healthy all year).  I'm guessing Noel will play at least 24 minutes a night and would probably guess it more in the 30 minute range. 

Him being a lockerroom disturbance is on him and will only hurt his free agent value.
Where are these minutes coming from? Is Okafor not playing? There won't be any minutes at PF for him because of Simmons and you can't even bump Simmons to SF (which would be a bad idea anyway) because Saric is there. And Saric should really be playing some minutes at PF himself.

Noel is fighting 2 other guys who can only play center for 48 minutes a night.
2 of those 3 guys will play a fair amount of time at PF.  Simmons will play a lot at SF. 

There are 7,872 minutes available from the PF and C position.  I'd guess the end minutes are something like this:

Noel - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Okafor - 2300 - 75 games - 31 minutes
Embiid - 1440 - 60 games - 24 minutes
Simmons - 1600 (rest of time at SF) - 77 games - 21 minutes

and that still leaves 232 minutes
How is Simmons going to play most of his time at SF when they've got Saric, Covington, and Grant? All are small forwards who should be getting minutes at PF as well.

And that's before we even get into how unsuited Simmons is to play SF,

This is the classic philly optimist take. However, I would rather take Noels view of things (we are all centers) than people trying to be ludicrously optimistic about where people can play. Noel has now made it clear he doesn't like this situation and there needs to be a move. It is not really something people can try and argue about anymore.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #37 on: September 26, 2016, 03:23:00 PM »

Offline walker834

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Their GM is a moron is all I take from this. This is why you don't draft just bpa every year. You end up with a bunch of guys who all play the same position and can't keep them. They also have Saric, Covington and drafted Luwawu to go with Simmons.  He has no vision whatsoever.   They will end up being ok just because they have talent but they are very stupid.  Gerald Henderson good player, Grant, BAyless.  Some of these GM's are worse then some of the people you see in fantasy leagues. Sergio Rodriquez.  Of course sign him too.   If Hinkie or Colangelo were on this board I would think they aren't very bright. 

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #38 on: September 26, 2016, 03:25:50 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Their GM is a moron is all I take from this. This is why you don't draft just bpa every year. You end up with a bunch of guys who all play the same position. They also have Saric, Covington and drafted Luwawu to go with Simmons.  He has no vision whatsoever.   They will end up being ok just because they have talent but they are very stupid.  Gerald Henderson good player, Grant, BAyless.  Some of these GM's are worse then some of the people you see in fantasy leagues. Sergio Rodriquez.  Of course sign him too.   If Hinkie or Colangelo were on this board I would think they aren't very bright.

hinkie is on this board and he loves draft tiers.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #39 on: September 26, 2016, 03:27:59 PM »

Offline walker834

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Well it  amazes me that guys like this go to major universities like cornell and stanford. Anyone can get a degree. Sry if he really is but some of the supposed bright people in this world aren't very bright.

They do have a lot of centers and pf/sf's.  They have size.  But they are going to need to figure that one out. 


Simmons, Embiid, Okafor or Noel.  That's 3 guys who can't shoot in your lineup.

Noel can not coexist with either Embiid or Okafor. Embiid and Okafor is even a question. Then you have  Simmons who has no position in the  nba yet.

Good luck guessing which one of those big men is going to be a walking injury as well.

I love the sixers and doctor j,  but none of those guys are that. Allen Iverson.  This one makes no sense to me except they have talent and size.  That is it..
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 03:48:00 PM by walker834 »

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #40 on: September 26, 2016, 03:47:27 PM »

Offline MBunge

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It's too bad that Noel doesn't understand the situation as well as a certain poster around here.  Then he'd know there was no problem at all.

Mike
He doesn't understand the situation at all obviously.  Otherwise he wouldn't have opened his mouth further diminishing his own trade value and making it more likely he gets stuck there. 

I'm beginning to think that Noel is just really dumb.  Like all time level dumb.

Or, he could be telling Philly to trade him NOW, no matter the return, or he'll Greg Monroe them next year.

Mike

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #41 on: September 26, 2016, 03:52:23 PM »

Offline BDeCosta26

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The dude is frustrated because he's on a team that doesn't fit his skill-set at all, they have a glut of bigs and it's his contract year. His value fell playing with Okafor last season. Playing another season with Okafor, plus Embiid, Simmons as Saric is going to really hurt his value.

That team accentuates his weaknesses and ignores most of us strengths. That's why he's frustrated and that's why they need to move him now. He's just losin value by the minute in that place. So is Okafor.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #42 on: September 26, 2016, 04:02:25 PM »

Offline Moranis

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It's too bad that Noel doesn't understand the situation as well as a certain poster around here.  Then he'd know there was no problem at all.

Mike
He doesn't understand the situation at all obviously.  Otherwise he wouldn't have opened his mouth further diminishing his own trade value and making it more likely he gets stuck there. 

I'm beginning to think that Noel is just really dumb.  Like all time level dumb.

Or, he could be telling Philly to trade him NOW, no matter the return, or he'll Greg Monroe them next year.

Mike
And then Philly gets two more years of him, which doesn't seem like a bad deal for Philly.  If Noel really wanted out, he wouldn't crush his own value, because it makes it far less likely he is the guy that gets moved.
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Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #43 on: September 26, 2016, 04:08:47 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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The dude is frustrated because he's on a team that doesn't fit his skill-set at all, they have a glut of bigs and it's his contract year. His value fell playing with Okafor last season. Playing another season with Okafor, plus Embiid, Simmons as Saric is going to really hurt his value.

That team accentuates his weaknesses and ignores most of us strengths. That's why he's frustrated and that's why they need to move him now. He's just losin value by the minute in that place. So is Okafor.
This is very key point when looked at from Noels perspective. Being used improperly, having to give up big minutes for others, being on an all time bad team, they are all going to reduce the value of bis next contract. I know aomw will argue that calling to be traded could hurt Noels value on his next contract but if he gets hims3lf traded and plays for a good team that utilizes him properly and he shows his worth, he could get a bigger contract than if he says nothing and spends the year in Philly.

Re: Noel on Sixers having three centers: "It doesn't make any sense."
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2016, 04:20:34 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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Well it  amazes me that guys like this go to major universities like cornell and stanford. Anyone can get a degree. Sry if he really is but some of the supposed bright people in this world aren't very bright.

They do have a lot of centers and pf/sf's.  They have size.  But they are going to need to figure that one out. 


Simmons, Embiid, Okafor or Noel.  That's 3 guys who can't shoot in your lineup.

Noel can not coexist with either Embiid or Okafor. Embiid and Okafor is even a question. Then you have  Simmons who has no position in the  nba yet.

Good luck guessing which one of those big men is going to be a walking injury as well.

I love the sixers and doctor j,  but none of those guys are that. Allen Iverson.  This one makes no sense to me except they have talent and size.  That is it..

Hinkie is definitely intelligent. However, intelligence doesn't equate to BBIQ or understanding the game of basketball or how to build a team. He almost built that team like you would a fantasy team without regard to fit, chemistry, etc., which has been increasingly shown to be one of the most important factors in winning in the NBA.