Author Topic: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?  (Read 12492 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #30 on: July 26, 2016, 03:21:16 AM »

Offline byennie

  • Webmaster
  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2572
  • Tommy Points: 3033
Lin is an average player, bad teams typically don't have . Look at who he's replacing though. Not average player, not below average players, awful players. Vasquez too.

Who are their significant subtractions? A fringe starter at PF and ball dominant old SG neither of t played good defense? Trevor Booker might be better for all we know, he posted a 2.3 DBPM last year and that team had way bigger defensive issues than offensive ones. RHJ should be of assistance on defense, and maybe one or two of their young guys show something.

You're overthinking this. Thaddeus Young is better than Booker. Yes theoretically Booker could thrive, but we're talking about a guy with career highs of 8/5 with some decent defensive numbers obtained mostly against backups, versus a guy putting up 15/9 against starters with one of the league's highest big man steal rates. He's being counted on now as a starting PF. McCullough? Some potential sure, but now he MUST be in the rotation.

They had Young, Johnson, Ellington, Larkin, Sloan.

They now have Lin, Booker and a bag of peanuts. There are literally 5 guys on the roster who have ever been a regular contributor on an NBA team.

Who knows. Pretty much any group can win 20 games with good coaching and a few breaks. But they are absolutely worse on paper than last year.




Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #31 on: July 26, 2016, 05:23:21 AM »

Offline BornReady

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 981
  • Tommy Points: 40
Don't matter how many
If Lopez is out then they are last in the NBA

They still need to fill out their team
But no way they sign any frontcourt players that can match Lopez production
I don't think there are any good free agent C left

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #32 on: July 26, 2016, 07:19:43 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 36776
  • Tommy Points: 2961
Dead Last.  .......and not even close. 

There is no move available for them to make that would impact his departure or injury .

There are NO inside presence available but at third string level.  No scoring centers.   

At this point , the only thing standing between Nets and being pure cannon fodder is Lopez.

He can't hold the fort by himself but so many minutes a game ........then the enemy is going to completely over run the Nets .

This is dangerous for Brooke to play in this environment ........he could injured even easier.

I wonder IF this is not payback from the front office for his being a sissy and whined back when they had at least a shot shot at contending .  Then he was relegated to the bench for not trying .

He now is having to work his reputation back to the top as a player with both a healthy MIND and Body .




Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #33 on: July 26, 2016, 07:48:42 AM »

Offline cornbread1981

  • Xavier Tillman
  • Posts: 44
  • Tommy Points: 3
not many even with lopez they brought on so many new players it will take a while for them to figure it out

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #34 on: July 26, 2016, 08:38:55 AM »

Offline CapnDunks

  • Brad Stevens
  • Posts: 222
  • Tommy Points: 13
Depends a lot on coaching, if they can learn and implement system changes quickly enough with so many new players, they might only be bottom 5. There appear to be fewer teams tanking next season. If they struggle or have any chemistry issues and Lopez gets injured, I strongly believe they will have a shot at a historically bad record.

Lin is a solid backup/fringe starter, but he's not some GIANT upgrade over Jack. Also, Lin has never played well on a team where he is the only and primary ball-handler.

Thad Young would still be the 2nd best player on this team.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #35 on: July 26, 2016, 12:22:33 PM »

Offline RAAAAAAAANDY

  • NCE
  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 995
  • Tommy Points: 57
Lin is an average player, bad teams typically don't have . Look at who he's replacing though. Not average player, not below average players, awful players. Vasquez too.

Who are their significant subtractions? A fringe starter at PF and ball dominant old SG neither of t played good defense? Trevor Booker might be better for all we know, he posted a 2.3 DBPM last year and that team had way bigger defensive issues than offensive ones. RHJ should be of assistance on defense, and maybe one or two of their young guys show something.

You're overthinking this. Thaddeus Young is better than Booker. Yes theoretically Booker could thrive, but we're talking about a guy with career highs of 8/5 with some decent defensive numbers obtained mostly against backups, versus a guy putting up 15/9 against starters with one of the league's highest big man steal rates. He's being counted on now as a starting PF. McCullough? Some potential sure, but now he MUST be in the rotation.

They had Young, Johnson, Ellington, Larkin, Sloan.

They now have Lin, Booker and a bag of peanuts. There are literally 5 guys on the roster who have ever been a regular contributor on an NBA team.

Who knows. Pretty much any group can win 20 games with good coaching and a few breaks. But they are absolutely worse on paper than last year.

Johnson, Ellington, Larkin and Sloan are all bad players. Those aren't losses.

And we're really doing per game averages when one guy had Favors and Gobert ahead of him suppressing his playing time? Ok then... That's a fools errand but have at it. Their replacing Robinson with their 1st round pick from a few years ago, Jack's injured awfulness with Lin, the Larkin abomination with Vasquez, getting back RHJ, upgrading defensively at PF because Young was a bad defender, and getting a coach who isn't the east coast version of Byron Scott.

This is a team that was barely breaking double digit 3 point attempts per game for the first month or two getting a guy who's from the Spurs tree, that's a massive upgrade.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #36 on: July 26, 2016, 01:07:53 PM »

Offline Granath

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2154
  • Tommy Points: 567
Johnson, Ellington, Larkin and Sloan are all bad players. Those aren't losses.

And we're really doing per game averages when one guy had Favors and Gobert ahead of him suppressing his playing time? Ok then... That's a fools errand but have at it. Their replacing Robinson with their 1st round pick from a few years ago, Jack's injured awfulness with Lin, the Larkin abomination with Vasquez, getting back RHJ, upgrading defensively at PF because Young was a bad defender, and getting a coach who isn't the east coast version of Byron Scott.

This is a team that was barely breaking double digit 3 point attempts per game for the first month or two getting a guy who's from the Spurs tree, that's a massive upgrade.

Talk about spin! You should be in sales. I'm sure the Nets ticket office could use your help.

(1) Yes, we are going to talk about per-game averages when the player in question is going to be 29 years old and has been in the league 6 years for two different teams. Expecting a breakout season from such a player is possible but unlikely.

(2) They are replacing Robinson with an untested, coming-off-an-injury 1st round pick from a few years ago. This may or may not be an upgrade.

(3) They get an upgrade with Lin over Jack. This is, however, the equivalent of replacing lima beans with plain cauliflower. There is a reason Lin is going to be on his 6th team in 6 years and it is not because he is a good player.

(4) They are replacing Larkin's awfulness with Greivis Vasquez's awfulness (another guy on his 6th team).

(5) They do get back RHJ. It was not like he was a major impact player last year though.

(6) There is no possible way anyone could consider them "upgraded" at PF at this stage. That's laughable.

Anyone can make the argument that virtually any team is better at this point in the offseason unless that team loses a superstar like OKC or Miami. But when you look at a team and compare it to the rest of the league it's hard to see how the Nets suddenly are a significantly better team than their competition. At best the Nets have a more cohesive roster this year rather than some considerable upgrade in talent level. But compared to the other bottom feeders in the East they lost ground. The 76ers added Saric, Bayless, Henderson and the #1 overall pick in the draft. The Knicks think they're a "superteam" now. Orlando added Ibaka among other pieces. The Bucks have better, younger talent than anyone outside of Lopez.

We will see once they play the games. But Vegas has the Nets as the overwhelmingly worst team in the league and the guys who do this with literally hundreds of millions of dollars on the line are rarely wrong. It happens every so often but I'll stick with the odds the experts set in this case.

The Nets are simply a bad team. Without Lopez for the year they would be contenders to set the all-time worst mark.
Jaylen Brown will be an All Star in the next 5 years.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #37 on: July 26, 2016, 01:56:51 PM »

Offline Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33461
  • Tommy Points: 1533
The Nets are basically this (there is 1 spot left)

PG - Lin, Vasquez, Whitehead
SG - Foye, Lavert, Harris
SF - RHJ, Bojan
PF - Booker, Scola, McCullough, Bennett
C - Lopez, Hamilton

That strikes me as a 20ish win team.  Without Lopez probably 12 to 13 range.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #38 on: July 26, 2016, 02:37:55 PM »

Offline celticsclay

  • Reggie Lewis
  • ***************
  • Posts: 15742
  • Tommy Points: 1386
Raaaandy, I got to say your view of the Nets strikes me as kind of absurdly optimistic and kind of overly pessimistic on the pieces they lost. Johnson is definitely still a solid NBA player. He started a decent amount games for the Heat and looked pretty solid as a starter on a playoff team. He was also scooped up pretty quickly by the Jazz in free agency. He is definitely not the all-star he once was, but he is a step above the vet min castoffs the Nets brought in this year. Booker is a replacement level player and definitely not as good a player as Thad Young. Jack was solid for them in the 40 games he played before he was hurt (though he should have been a bench player and not a starter). I think by any metric the Nets had a disappointing offseason. They lost on two guys restricted guys they thought they had structured contracts in a way that they wouldn't be matched. Portland seemed unlikely to match given the Evan Turner contract while Miami seemed unlikely under the assumption they would give Wade and Whiteside big money. Unfortunately for them neither of those moves worked and by the time the offers were matched many other targets were signed. With Lopez their projected win total has been set to 17.5. I would think without him, particularly given their lack of centers, it would be 11 or 12.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #39 on: July 26, 2016, 02:44:22 PM »

Offline Bucketgetter

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1227
  • Tommy Points: 11
16-18, Scola could hold down the fort and if they simply thing with that Kid McCullough he could be a bouncy 5 who can get out and run.

They'll actually have guards this year too.
They might not win that WITH Lopez.
please explain to me how that team got 5 games worse this offseason. Delusional.
Lol. Still confident after nobody in this entire thread agrees with you? Ill put money down that the Nets don't win 18 games, and I don't care who gets hurt. Put your money where your mouth is, pal.

The difference of course being that they're enormously biased, and I'm not. They won 21 last year with the worst coach not named Byron Scott, nothing at PG and their only wing defender injured.
If we are all "enormously biased" because we're Celtics fans, then why aren't you biased? If you're not a Celtics fan, then get out of this forum and head on over to a Nets one.
CB Mock Deadline - Minnesota Timberwolves
Kemba Walker / Tyus Jones / Aaron Brooks
Jimmy Butler / Jamal Crawford / Treveon Graham
Rodney Hood / Nic Batum / Marcus Georges Hunt
Taj Gibson / Nemanja Bjelica / Jonas Jerebko
KAT / Derrick Favors / Cole Aldrich
Picks - 2018 CHA 1st (Lotto protected), none out

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #40 on: July 26, 2016, 03:02:48 PM »

Offline Granath

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2154
  • Tommy Points: 567
16-18, Scola could hold down the fort and if they simply thing with that Kid McCullough he could be a bouncy 5 who can get out and run.

They'll actually have guards this year too.
They might not win that WITH Lopez.
please explain to me how that team got 5 games worse this offseason. Delusional.
Lol. Still confident after nobody in this entire thread agrees with you? Ill put money down that the Nets don't win 18 games, and I don't care who gets hurt. Put your money where your mouth is, pal.

The difference of course being that they're enormously biased, and I'm not. They won 21 last year with the worst coach not named Byron Scott, nothing at PG and their only wing defender injured.
If we are all "enormously biased" because we're Celtics fans, then why aren't you biased? If you're not a Celtics fan, then get out of this forum and head on over to a Nets one.

On this point, is Vegas somehow enormously biased too?
Jaylen Brown will be an All Star in the next 5 years.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #41 on: July 26, 2016, 03:09:57 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8595
  • Tommy Points: 842
16-18, Scola could hold down the fort and if they simply thing with that Kid McCullough he could be a bouncy 5 who can get out and run.

They'll actually have guards this year too.
They might not win that WITH Lopez.
please explain to me how that team got 5 games worse this offseason. Delusional.
Lol. Still confident after nobody in this entire thread agrees with you? Ill put money down that the Nets don't win 18 games, and I don't care who gets hurt. Put your money where your mouth is, pal.

The difference of course being that they're enormously biased, and I'm not. They won 21 last year with the worst coach not named Byron Scott, nothing at PG and their only wing defender injured.
If we are all "enormously biased" because we're Celtics fans, then why aren't you biased? If you're not a Celtics fan, then get out of this forum and head on over to a Nets one.

On this point, is Vegas somehow enormously biased too?
Vegas typically carries a bias towards New York teams actually. More bettors come from New York I think.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #42 on: July 26, 2016, 03:37:05 PM »

Offline Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33461
  • Tommy Points: 1533
16-18, Scola could hold down the fort and if they simply thing with that Kid McCullough he could be a bouncy 5 who can get out and run.

They'll actually have guards this year too.
They might not win that WITH Lopez.
please explain to me how that team got 5 games worse this offseason. Delusional.
Lol. Still confident after nobody in this entire thread agrees with you? Ill put money down that the Nets don't win 18 games, and I don't care who gets hurt. Put your money where your mouth is, pal.

The difference of course being that they're enormously biased, and I'm not. They won 21 last year with the worst coach not named Byron Scott, nothing at PG and their only wing defender injured.
If we are all "enormously biased" because we're Celtics fans, then why aren't you biased? If you're not a Celtics fan, then get out of this forum and head on over to a Nets one.

On this point, is Vegas somehow enormously biased too?
Vegas odds are designed to drive bets.  Nothing more, nothing less.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #43 on: July 26, 2016, 04:10:58 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 36776
  • Tommy Points: 2961
A Lopez sprained ankle or badley jammed finger and they could loose 20 straight just real quick.....

Nets are walking a fine line on being as bad as Philly ever was.


Re: If Brook Lopez were out for 2016-17, how many games do the Nets win?
« Reply #44 on: July 26, 2016, 04:22:29 PM »

Offline Ed Hollison

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 619
  • Tommy Points: 195
Hate to change the subject, but... This team needs to trade Lopez immediately. What is he still on the team for? They're projected to the worst team in the league, they've got no other trade asset, and it's almost unlikely they'll sign anyone in FA next summer. And at roughly 20m/year this year and next his contract isn't crazy in the current environment.
"A thought of hatred must be destroyed by a more powerful thought of love."

http://fruittreeblog.com