We missed the left turn at Albuquerque...

[__ramonezy__]

Our team is currently lost on the road to a championship caught between "rebuilding" and "contending" status. Despite the catchy fanspeak of us being "rebuilding contenders", from a roster perspective that categorization makes absolutely no sense for several reasons; but unfortunately our Front Office is apparently trying to toe the line to be both when simple decisions can be made to propel the team further along whichever goal we choose. I've made two irreconcilable observations about the differences between "rebuilders" and "contenders".

Observation #1: Draft picks and young, raw talent mean very little to contending teams:
Proof of this is how easily the Cavs traded the #1 pick for Kevin Love... two years later their having championship parades in Cleveland.

Observation #2: Rebuilding teams focus on player development, Contending teams focus on playoff wins:
No one in Minnesota cares that they only won 20 games, they're excited about the development of Towns. Ask Golden State now how they feel about 73 wins... I'm sure they would trade 20 of those wins for the title. We're glorifying 48 regular season wins, which is amazing, but we only have 2 playoff wins in our two post-season visits and I'm not sure how many wins the current roster will get. Regular season wins, only get you to the playoffs, which is good for a "rebuilding" team, but means nothing to "contenders". Granted, it did attract Al Horford.


In my opinion we keep going back and forth between "contender" moves and "rebuilder" moves that I'm flat out confused when it comes to our roster...

Rebuilder move:
- We let go of Evan Turner - ET was a great player for us, but his removal frees up minutes for our younger players such as Rozier, Young, Smart and Brown. Their on-court development is essential for our mid to long-term success.

Contrary Contender move:
- We sign Gerald Green - This move essentially removes a roster spot and playing time for our young potential. If you liked Nader, he's definitely gone in the cut to 15. RJ Hunter/Young/Bentil may be gone now too. That's from a roster spot perspective. From a playing time perspective I expect Green to be more polished than Brown in his offensive abilities and is still just as athletic. There is also existing chemistry from Phoenix days between Green and IT... but reducing Brown's minutes for a 30 year old vet is a contender move... even if Green only gets 5 minutes per game.


Contender move:
- Maxing 30 year old Al Horford - this is a win now move, strengthening a position of need with a player in their prime.

Contrary Rebuilder move:
- Holding unto the Nets picks for dear life - the Nets picks figure to be high lottery picks, possibly Top 5 in both years. But they are our most valuable assets and the concept of an equitable deal on both sides is a myth. If Horford is to be considered a championship move, there must be another move to be made even if it seems lop-sided. If there was a time when the Kings wanted both Nets picks for Boogie and we didn't pull the trigger it was a waste!!!. 2016 Top 5: Simmons, Ingram, Brown, Bender, Dunn. 2015 Top 5: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Porzingis, Herzonja. Am I to believe that the combination of any two of these players is worth more than pairing Horford with Boogie on the road to a championship!!! Or with Blake, if we feel that is the move we need to make.


There are other moves I could point to, but in general I feel like I'm on a roster merry-go-round, with moves being made that ultimately keep us a two-win playoff team.

[GratefulCs]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

[__ramonezy__]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

The problem is that all the "available" players that would be worth giving up good draft picks for are pretty much one-year rentals, and we don't have LeBron on our roster to persuade a player into staying beyond this year.

Incredibly risky thing to do.

The only player I see who could move is Cousins and Sacramento has been quite pigheaded about trading him.

The fact is, is that star players are hard to acquire and rarely available to being traded, more so when teams have an abundance of cap space like they did this year and will have the next season as well.

Furthermore, star players being traded usually require good players in return on top of the picks.

[GratefulCs]

I just want to add that probably 90% of the league wishes they could be in our position

We're almost at contending level status, we're getting top talent in drafts, and we're getting meetings with too free agents


Soak it in and LET THE GOOD TIMES ROLL 

[DarkAzcura]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

Kawhi Leonard was a developmental project/prospect that was drafted into a declining team full of 30+ year olds. Without him, their window would have closed 5 years ago. His slow development into a now MVP level player is what is allowing them to extend their window another 8-10 years. There isn't anything wrong with having a couple of those projects/blue chip prospects on a contending or declining team. In fact, I consider it ideal and exactly what I've wanted for this team for years.

In retrospect, imagine a situation where we had Pierce on this team, got the number 2 pick in 2007, drafted a raw prospect in Durant, and instead of trading Pierce and going all youth, we still swing for Garnett (regardless of him accepting his extension). Having Pierce and Garnett to contend for 2-3 years only for Rondo and Durant to take over as they declined would have been amazing. No Ray Allen in this situation, maybe no 2008 championship, but we would have been right there every single year from 2009-now. It's truly what I wanted to happen back then, but oh well. Now the Celtics have another shot at creating a potential loooonng window for contending if they play their cards right with the BKN picks.

I mean even Rondo is a small example of this. Without him as our raw prospect our window would have been completely shut close in 2009 after the Garnett injury. There is no 2010 or 2012 run without Rondo.

[alldaboston]

We're winning now. That much is clear. Maybe not a championship but we are a very good team. Winning now keeps the intrigue up and alerts free agents and disgruntled players that Boston is a good destination.

We are also developing/accumulating young talent with potential. These guys will be really good in 4-5 years. That just happens to align with the twilight of the careers of guys like Isaiah and Al. By the time they're done, we've still got our young guys who are nearing full development and ready to be handed the keys to the roster. Thus winning then too.

[Emmette Bryant]

Let's see, the Celtics have a likely top 5 pick in a loaded draft plus they have room for a max free agent plus they will probably win more than 50 games.

What a problem.   

[__ramonezy__]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

Kawhi Leonard was a developmental project/prospect that was drafted into a declining team full of 30+ year olds. Without him, their window would have closed 5 years ago. His slow development into a now MVP level player is what is allowing them to extend their window another 8-10 years. There isn't anything wrong with having a couple of those projects/blue chip prospects on a contending or declining team. In fact, I consider it ideal and exactly what I've wanted for this team for years.

In retrospect, imagine a situation where we had Pierce on this team, got the number 2 pick in 2007, drafted a raw prospect in Durant, and instead of trading Pierce and going all youth, we still swing for Garnett (regardless of him accepting his extension). Having Pierce and Garnett to contend for 2-3 years only for Rondo and Durant to take over as they declined would have been amazing. No Ray Allen in this situation, maybe no 2008 championship, but we would have been right there every single year from 2009-now. It's truly what I wanted to happen back then, but oh well. Now the Celtics have another shot at creating a potential loooonng window for contending if they play their cards right with the BKN picks.

I mean even Rondo is a small example of this. Without him as our raw prospect our window would have been completely shut close in 2009 after the Garnett injury. There is no 2010 or 2012 run without Rondo.

But these are my points exactly. We cannot have  a team full of projects. The Spurs invested in a single project and focused on contending with their core. Celtics have Smart, Brown,  Rozier, RJ,  Mickey and any future picks. it is impossible to develop them all and contend.

[mqtcelticsfan]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

I think the problem with trading the Nets picks is that it's not clear that you can get a star player using that pick without also gutting our core. If we can't get a true impact player that we can lock up long term, then we aren't really helping ourselves contend and we're giving up a chance at a prospect who could help us win championships down the road.

[Bobshot]

I think the Celtics should go all out on Griffin and Westbrook. Get deep into the playoffs with them, and then worry about an extension for either. Chances are they'll have a helluva team, and those two guys will re-sign, particularly with the signing advantage the Celtics will have with both.

I would give up both those Nets picks in a minute for those two guys. Chances are Danny has already used the best of the Nets picks: they'll be better next year, and then even better the year after. They better be--they're in NY and are free spenders competing with the Knicks. The big mistake is Danny overvaluing those Nets picks. Other teams, especially teams with stars who want to win now, don't value those picks so much.

The way to get Griffin and Westbrook is to give Doc and Sam Presti offers they can't refuse: give each a Nets draft pick and their pick of Smart, Crowder or Bradley, plus Amir, etc. Whatever the rumored deals are.

Remove the requirement of an extension. Throw the dice. Doc and Sam might jump for this. They'll never do any better. Life is short.

[ThePaintedArea]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

Kawhi Leonard was a developmental project/prospect that was drafted into a declining team full of 30+ year olds. Without him, their window would have closed 5 years ago. His slow development into a now MVP level player is what is allowing them to extend their window another 8-10 years. There isn't anything wrong with having a couple of those projects/blue chip prospects on a contending or declining team. In fact, I consider it ideal and exactly what I've wanted for this team for years.

In retrospect, imagine a situation where we had Pierce on this team, got the number 2 pick in 2007, drafted a raw prospect in Durant, and instead of trading Pierce and going all youth, we still swing for Garnett (regardless of him accepting his extension). Having Pierce and Garnett to contend for 2-3 years only for Rondo and Durant to take over as they declined would have been amazing. No Ray Allen in this situation, maybe no 2008 championship, but we would have been right there every single year from 2009-now. It's truly what I wanted to happen back then, but oh well. Now the Celtics have another shot at creating a potential loooonng window for contending if they play their cards right with the BKN picks.

I mean even Rondo is a small example of this. Without him as our raw prospect our window would have been completely shut close in 2009 after the Garnett injury. There is no 2010 or 2012 run without Rondo.

But these are my points exactly. We cannot have  a team full of projects. The Spurs invested in a single project and focused on contending with their core. Celtics have Smart, Brown,  Rozier, RJ,  Mickey and any future picks. it is impossible to develop them all and contend.

 Your use of the term "project" is outside the usual NBA usage. Marcus Smart is not a project – he's been playing rotation minutes for two years now. Nor are Brown or Rozier.  Hunter yes, Young yes, Mickey yes - but the team has used very little court time on them.  Hardly a "team full"; and they certainly have not gotten in the way of the team contending - the issue there is with their top eight guys, not their bottom three.

[rochrist]

I think the Celtics should go all out on Griffin and Westbrook. Get deep into the playoffs with them, and then worry about an extension for either. Chances are they'll have a helluva team, and those two guys will re-sign, particularly with the signing advantage the Celtics will have with both.

I would give up both those Nets picks in a minute for those two guys. Chances are Danny has already used the best of the Nets picks: they'll be better next year, and then even better the year after. They better be--they're in NY and are free spenders competing with the Knicks. The big mistake is Danny overvaluing those Nets picks. Other teams, especially teams with stars who want to win now, don't value those picks so much.

The way to get Griffin and Westbrook is to give Doc and Sam Presti offers they can't refuse: give each a Nets draft pick and their pick of Smart, Crowder or Bradley, plus Amir, etc. Whatever the rumored deals are.

Remove the requirement of an extension. Throw the dice. Doc and Sam might jump for this. They'll never do any better. Life is short.

That would be a truly excellent way to blow all the work they put into putting themselves in the position they're currently in.

[Surferdad]

I think it's just an unusual (in a good way) position for a team to be in


No one else can continue to get better while having legit top picks. It's normally "to tank or not to tank"


I'm sure if we were only rebuilding the young guys would get much more burn, but i think we're on the right path.

We're consistently been getting better while adding top picks, so i get seriously confused when people question this team's direction


Also, i think we should definitely keep this coming year's nets pick. It's supposed to be a loaded draft. And if we used it to pry away a westbrook or a griffen and they walked after the season, then we would be banging our heads against a wall for 15 years after

But that's my point exactly, if the Nets pick is valuable due to how "loaded" the draft is, the higher it's trade value. Whoever we get will be a development prospect, but we just maxed a 30-year-old player. Trade the pick for someone that is proven and keep our forward momentum towards a championship... adding another young player to develop when we have to be stashing 1st round draft picks is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.

I say, yes to both, it is not an either/or proposition.  The C's are in a position to not only add another max player, but to also take advantage of great picks the next 2 years.

I hope this doesn't come as a surprise to the OP, but Danny Ainge has to think both short-term (next 2 years) and long-term.  I believe Wyc is coming around to the idea of building a sustainable championship contender, a team that will be in the mix every year for 5-10 years or maybe more.  Meantime, he cannot ignore the present because that pays the bills and keeps the fan base interested.  In short, I think Wyc himself has matured a bit as a managing partner since his "fireworks" comment.  Nothing is easy, nothing is simple.

[Celtics4ever]

There are other moves I could point to, but in general I feel like I'm on a roster merry-go-round, with moves being made that ultimately keep us a two-win playoff team.

No offense, but Ainge has a better track record than some dude on a blog.