Author Topic: Thinking out loud - does Gordon for Brown makes sense for both Boston + Orlando?  (Read 26272 times)

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Offline Ed Hollison

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I haven't really been following Gordon that closely, so I don't feel equipped to weigh in on how he's performed thus far or on his upside. But as someone already mentioned, the fact that he's got 2 fewer years left on his rookie deal is important. This is also the reason why you don't trade a lot to get someone like Nerlens Noel, unless your plan is to pay him the max and prevent anyone from stealing him when he gets to restricted free agency.

On Brown, I do think his potential upside is tremendous. I suppose he could bottom out as a sort of Jeff Green type in a worst-case scenario. But already he has a unique combination of ball handling, knack for getting to the hoop, and physical ability. Defensively, he could develop into a Kawhi Leonard-type defender who could guard multiple positions, though I guess Gordon also fits that mold. In any case, it would take a lot for me to feel comfortable not seeing that through.
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Offline incoherent

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Guys... This makes absolutely no sense for Orlando.  Why still being discussed?  We are hitting a serious low for realism around here. 

Offline kozlodoev

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Trade Crowder , Zizic and future 1st for Gordon.

That would be an embarrassingly bad trade for Boston, and Orlando would be rolling on the floor laughing at Danny Ainge for the next 5 or so years.

Crowder on his own is a much better player then Gordon is - trading him for Gordon straight up would be a bad trade.  Throwing in a prospect and a 1st rounder as well?  Terrible, and no way Danny would even contemplate doing that trade.

Are you serious?

Gordon is a better talent than Crowder
Yeah, in the same way Gay was a better talent than Battier. And yet, that trade was a win for the Rockets.

Battier was better than Gay and Gordon is better than Crowder. Most NBA would take Gordon over Crowder. Even if Crowder overachieved last season. Gordon is 5 years younger and had a nice 2nd year in the league last season. He is only going to get better
I guess Gordon is "developing", but Crowder is "overachieving". I imagine this is not confirmation bias at all.
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Offline hwangjini_1

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Guys... This makes absolutely no sense for Orlando.  Why still being discussed?  We are hitting a serious low for realism around here.
ah, glad to hear it us and not you bottoming out.  ;D
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Offline Tr1boy

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Trade Crowder , Zizic and future 1st for Gordon.

That would be an embarrassingly bad trade for Boston, and Orlando would be rolling on the floor laughing at Danny Ainge for the next 5 or so years.

Crowder on his own is a much better player then Gordon is - trading him for Gordon straight up would be a bad trade.  Throwing in a prospect and a 1st rounder as well?  Terrible, and no way Danny would even contemplate doing that trade.

Are you serious?

Gordon is a better talent than Crowder
Yeah, in the same way Gay was a better talent than Battier. And yet, that trade was a win for the Rockets.

Battier was better than Gay and Gordon is better than Crowder. Most NBA would take Gordon over Crowder. Even if Crowder overachieved last season. Gordon is 5 years younger and had a nice 2nd year in the league last season. He is only going to get better
I guess Gordon is "developing", but Crowder is "overachieving". I imagine this is not confirmation bias at all.

Crowder has hit the ceiling.

Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better

Offline kozlodoev

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
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Offline LarBrd33

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Offline Eddie20

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.

Offline LarBrd33

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.
You don't know what you're talking about.

They traded Tobias Harris and benched Oladipo so they could give Gordon starter minutes.

Gordon is a small forward.  The premise of this thread makes no sense.  Gordon plays the same position and is better than Brown right now.

Offline Tr1boy

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.
You don't know what you're talking about.

They traded Tobias Harris and benched Oladipo so they could give Gordon starter minutes.

Gordon is a small forward.  The premise of this thread makes no sense.  Gordon plays the same position and is better than Brown right now.

Exactly. Gordon can play both fwd positions.


Offline LarBrd33

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.
You don't know what you're talking about.

They traded Tobias Harris and benched Oladipo so they could give Gordon starter minutes.

Gordon is a small forward.  The premise of this thread makes no sense.  Gordon plays the same position and is better than Brown right now.

Exactly. Gordon can play both fwd positions.

He's widely expected to be their starting SF this season.

July 7th: 

Quote
Frank Vogel said that he expects Aaron Gordon to start at small forward for the Magic and play "a lot at the backup four" this upcoming season.
This is excellent news for Gordon as his fantasy value was headed in the wrong direction upon the arrival of Serge Ibaka. It sounds like Vogel would like to give Gordon a significant role during his third NBA season, and he'll make for an intriguing late mid-round selection on draft day after putting in averages of 12.0 points, 7.3 boards, 2.0 assists and 1.1 steals per game after the break last season. This news, however, isn't great for Mario Hezonja's outlook.

July 11th:

Quote
Magic GM Rob Hennigan said that Aaron Gordon can play both small forward and power forward.
"We see Aaron as an extremely important piece to what we're doing," he said. "It's about his versatility...he can really impact the game in a lot of different ways." Hennigan specifically mentioned Gordon's "defensive range and athleticism," and he's expected to start the season as Orlando's starting SF while also backing up Serge Ibaka at PF.

Is that the ringing endorsements Eddie is looking for?  Both the coach and GM praise him and say he's going to start at small forward.

What does Gordon say about his NBA position?  Let's check this interview from July 19th:

Quote
Now, what position do you play?

"Small forward. I can play all of them but I’m a small forward."

Ok. Because that was the big thing coming out of college and going to the draft, people didn’t know your position they just knew you were a crazy athlete and a lot of game but you didn’t have a position. What position do you prefer?

"All of them! I like the small forward, I’m going to be playing the small forward with the Magic this year so that will be my positon with Orlando but I’ll be doing a little bit of everything."

Yeah, he's a bit of a position-less player which makes him interesting.  He can play SF.  He can play PF.  They even expect to play him a little at point forward this season.   

Anyways... the answer is no... trading Gordon for Brown doesn't make sense for Orlando.

Offline Eddie20

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.
You don't know what you're talking about.

They traded Tobias Harris and benched Oladipo so they could give Gordon starter minutes.

Gordon is a small forward.  The premise of this thread makes no sense.  Gordon plays the same position and is better than Brown right now.

They tried that, but Gordon is such a pathetic shooter that it absolutely destroyed their spacing. So the Magic moved him to the PF spot in order to go with Fournier at the 3 at not have D's clog the lane.

The Magic also just signed Jeff Green, so it appears as though Fournier will slide back to the 2, and Gordon will be splitting time at both the 3/4 spots with Ibaka and Green. So the Magic so impressed with Gordon's abilities acquired two guys that will take many of his minutes.



Quote
April 3, 2016

ORLANDO – When Aaron Gordon was coming out of college and preparing for the 2014 NBA Draft, his monstrous talents were quite apparent, but one question always followed him: Is he a small forward or a power forward?

For the Orlando Magic, Gordon has been both because of his diverse physical gifts and his ability to guard several different sized opposing players. Of late, however, he’s played strictly at the power forward position and he’s more than held his own.

Offline Eddie20

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I guess Gordon can be called a "position less player", but it's only because he's too small and a poor rebounder at the 4 and a non-shooter at the 3. So it's the dilemma of what do you do with him?

Gordon shot the following, which makes him playing the SF, especially alongside a non-shooter like Payton, a spacing nightmare.

3-10 ft  34%
10-16 ft  34%
16-23 ft  33%
3pt  29%


Offline LarBrd33

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Gordon is bigger, more explosive, just as high iq, versatile defender .  Open jump shot looking better and better
That's all true. Maybe one day he will even be as good as Crowder is right now.
And maybe one day Jaylen Brown will even be as good as Aaron Gordon is right now.

Gordon, a player so good that the Magic traded away a lottery pick and Oladipo (a top 5 pick a few years ago) to upgrade the position he plays. Ringing endorsement.
You don't know what you're talking about.

They traded Tobias Harris and benched Oladipo so they could give Gordon starter minutes.

Gordon is a small forward.  The premise of this thread makes no sense.  Gordon plays the same position and is better than Brown right now.

They tried that, but Gordon is such a pathetic shooter that it absolutely destroyed their spacing. So the Magic moved him to the PF spot in order to go with Fournier at the 3 at not have D's clog the lane.

The Magic also just signed Jeff Green, so it appears as though Fournier will slide back to the 2, and Gordon will be splitting time at both the 3/4 spots with Ibaka and Green. So the Magic so impressed with Gordon's abilities acquired two guys that will take many of his minutes.



Quote
April 3, 2016

ORLANDO – When Aaron Gordon was coming out of college and preparing for the 2014 NBA Draft, his monstrous talents were quite apparent, but one question always followed him: Is he a small forward or a power forward?

For the Orlando Magic, Gordon has been both because of his diverse physical gifts and his ability to guard several different sized opposing players. Of late, however, he’s played strictly at the power forward position and he’s more than held his own.

This thread is suggesting Jaylen Brown is equal value for Aaron Gordon.  You pointing out Gordon's flaws as a shooter isn't going to do much to support that premise.   Gordon was 48% from FG and 30% from three last season.   Based on Summer-league, we'll be lucky if Jaylen Brown puts up shooting percentages as high as Marcus Smart.  Jaylen just shot 32% from FG and 22% from three in Summer League.   Gordon shot 50%/50% in that league.   Based on Jaylen's summer league performance, it incredibly unlikely to see him put up 48%/30% shooting next season. 

Offline LarBrd33

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I guess Gordon can be called a "position less player", but it's only because he's too small and a poor rebounder at the 4 and a non-shooter at the 3. So it's the dilemma of what do you do with him?

Gordon shot the following, which makes him playing the SF, especially alongside a non-shooter like Payton, a spacing nightmare.

3-10 ft  34%
10-16 ft  34%
16-23 ft  33%
3pt  29%
Neat.  Let's see if Jaylen can even shoot 30% before we start pretending he's anywhere near as good as Gordon right now.  He put up worst shooting percentages than that in the children's league.  It's not looking good.

Long term, who knows.  Right now, I'm not sure how anyone could realistically argue that Brown is better than GOrdon at anything.