Author Topic: Okafor - The Ringer (article)  (Read 30225 times)

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Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #120 on: July 20, 2016, 04:22:12 AM »

Offline Future Celtics Owner

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Try to make a note of the people that would rather KO or Marcus Smart over Okafor. It makes things easier in the future to poop on them when they say your nuts.

Not nuts.  But those two players are better fits for the way that Boston plays than Okafor is.  That he's got glaring weaknesses when it comes to keeping the ball moving and playing acceptable team defense doesn't help.

BUT NBA PLAYERS ARE NOT SOLELY JODGED ON THEIR ROOKIE SEASONS, and Okafor has physical advantages and skills that the others do not have.

Very true on all points.  Probably he'll be better this upcoming season.

Towns/KP/Turner: all adjusted better to certain NBA styles bc they are not as physically strong as Okafor and so their ages and weaknesses were better suited for the first year in the league. Also they each had better teams and legit scorers on each team.

Can't understand your argument here.  He sucked, frankly; even though they designed the offense around him, they were a better offensive team with him on the bench (they were also a better defensive team with him on the bench, but presumably you would concede that).
I pm'd you. I can't force anyone that has already made their minds up to see that Okafor is extremely undervalued. It would be nice to talk and answer any questions you might have through the PM.

I'd quibble with "extremely", but I bet he is undervalued - being unable to help an epically bad team win will do that.

I love scouting and I may love it more than watching a semi decent Celtic's squad filled with USURPERS LOL.

Well, bless the scouts, so say I. The worst life and the best all rolled into one.

Can't tell what you mean by "usurpers"; maybe you're using the word wrong. I think that this Boston team has undervalued players who play with great heart and courage and have outstanding internal leadership.  That they play such good team defense despite being so young is really remarkable; it's why I started following them and posting on this board.
USURPERS= (must be capitalized) Evan Turner, Sully, Zeller, Bass, Hump, and anyone that is using us to fatten their wallets, inflate our wins, hurt our pick, take time away from developing players, and are in no way any part of our future and are using us as a springboard for that last contract or next to last.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #121 on: July 20, 2016, 07:33:32 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
USURPERS= (must be capitalized) Evan Turner, Sully, Zeller, Bass, Hump, and anyone that is using us to fatten their wallets,

Sully hurt his value here, sadly his wallet is not what fattened.  He got considerably less than most thought he would.

Quote
Usurp is to verb (used with object)
1.  to seize and hold (a position, office, power, etc.) by force or without legal right:
The pretender tried to usurp the throne.
2.   to use without authority or right; employ wrongfully:
The magazine usurped copyrighted material.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/usurper


How does that apply here?  Hint it doesn't.   Are you channeling Bluto Blutarsky, perhaps?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8lT1o0sDwI

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #122 on: July 20, 2016, 09:59:38 AM »

Offline Eddie20

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Try to make a note of the people that would rather KO or Marcus Smart over Okafor. It makes things easier in the future to poop on them when they say your nuts.

Not nuts.  But those two players are better fits for the way that Boston plays than Okafor is.  That he's got glaring weaknesses when it comes to keeping the ball moving and playing acceptable team defense doesn't help.

BUT NBA PLAYERS ARE NOT SOLELY JODGED ON THEIR ROOKIE SEASONS, and Okafor has physical advantages and skills that the others do not have.

Very true on all points.  Probably he'll be better this upcoming season.

Towns/KP/Turner: all adjusted better to certain NBA styles bc they are not as physically strong as Okafor and so their ages and weaknesses were better suited for the first year in the league. Also they each had better teams and legit scorers on each team.

Can't understand your argument here.  He sucked, frankly; even though they designed the offense around him, they were a better offensive team with him on the bench (they were also a better defensive team with him on the bench, but presumably you would concede that).
I pm'd you. I can't force anyone that has already made their minds up to see that Okafor is extremely undervalued. It would be nice to talk and answer any questions you might have through the PM.

BTW I really put myself out there when Myles Turner was undervalued at UT for some of the very same things. Again I was called nuts and reminded this was not nba2k whatever. I can say without bias that over the last 3-5 seasons I've picked better than most scouts and people that get paid. I love scouting and I may love it more than watching a semi decent Celtic's squad filled with USURPERS LOL.

Didn't you want to select Upshaw at #16?

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #123 on: July 29, 2016, 12:29:58 PM »

Offline ManUp

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A couple articles at Liberty Baller that I must admit are changing my perspective on Okafor.


Breakdown of Okafor's Defense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/29/12317906/okafor-defense-video-analysis

Breakdown of Okafor's Offense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/28/12310140/jahlil-okafor-offensive-video-analysis-sixers

I would definitely still like to have a chance at him, but he definitely has a long way to go. I can understand why Danny isn't willing to give up much. He seems to lack conditioning and trust between himself and teammates. I could be wrong but from my own experience a lack of condition can sometimes come across as poor effort and the lack of trust between himself and his teammates seems to result in his indecisiveness on the court. Of course I could be wrong and he's just lazy and has a low BBIQ/poor feel for the game.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #124 on: July 29, 2016, 12:57:41 PM »

Offline ChillyWilly

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A couple articles at Liberty Baller that I must admit are changing my perspective on Okafor.


Breakdown of Okafor's Defense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/29/12317906/okafor-defense-video-analysis

Breakdown of Okafor's Offense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/28/12310140/jahlil-okafor-offensive-video-analysis-sixers

I would definitely still like to have a chance at him, but he definitely has a long way to go. I can understand why Danny isn't willing to give up much. He seems to lack conditioning and trust between himself and teammates. I could be wrong but from my own experience a lack of condition can sometimes come across as poor effort and the lack of trust between himself and his teammates seems to result in his indecisiveness on the court. Of course I could be wrong and he's just lazy and has a low BBIQ/poor feel for the game.

TP. I'm sure Danny's team broke this guy down 200 different ways and they are very well aware of what he is and what he can and what he can't be. My thinking is this kid didn't blow Danny's team away but there was enough there to say hey lets keep the door open if Colangelo can't fleece someone else. Danny will pay below spot value for him.
ok fine

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #125 on: July 29, 2016, 01:47:53 PM »

Offline The One

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He would be a lethal 6th man...destroying subs with his post game.

And if he progresses defensively along with rebounding and can pass again...he's a good starting center.



Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #126 on: July 29, 2016, 02:09:10 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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He would be a lethal 6th man...destroying subs with his post game.

And if he progresses defensively along with rebounding and can pass again...he's a good starting center.

He could be a solid big off the bench. Unfortunately it will probably be on a second team that he gains that role because of his draft slot.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #127 on: July 29, 2016, 02:53:39 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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A couple articles at Liberty Baller that I must admit are changing my perspective on Okafor.


Breakdown of Okafor's Defense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/29/12317906/okafor-defense-video-analysis

Breakdown of Okafor's Offense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/28/12310140/jahlil-okafor-offensive-video-analysis-sixers

I would definitely still like to have a chance at him, but he definitely has a long way to go. I can understand why Danny isn't willing to give up much. He seems to lack conditioning and trust between himself and teammates. I could be wrong but from my own experience a lack of condition can sometimes come across as poor effort and the lack of trust between himself and his teammates seems to result in his indecisiveness on the court. Of course I could be wrong and he's just lazy and has a low BBIQ/poor feel for the game.
It will be interesting to see how much he improves over the next several years.  He's a 20 year old with raw skill.  He has the potential to be great on both sides of the ball if he gets in the right situation.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #128 on: July 29, 2016, 03:00:59 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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A couple articles at Liberty Baller that I must admit are changing my perspective on Okafor.


Breakdown of Okafor's Defense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/29/12317906/okafor-defense-video-analysis

Breakdown of Okafor's Offense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/28/12310140/jahlil-okafor-offensive-video-analysis-sixers

I would definitely still like to have a chance at him, but he definitely has a long way to go. I can understand why Danny isn't willing to give up much. He seems to lack conditioning and trust between himself and teammates. I could be wrong but from my own experience a lack of condition can sometimes come across as poor effort and the lack of trust between himself and his teammates seems to result in his indecisiveness on the court. Of course I could be wrong and he's just lazy and has a low BBIQ/poor feel for the game.
It will be interesting to see how much he improves over the next several years.  He's a 20 year old with raw skill.  He has the potential to be great on both sides of the ball if he gets in the right situation.

Can you provide an example of a big that was horrible at D, like Okafor, and improved so much that he became at least average? Okafor is a lot like Kanter, but a better post scorer and worse rebounder.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #129 on: July 29, 2016, 03:20:54 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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A couple articles at Liberty Baller that I must admit are changing my perspective on Okafor.


Breakdown of Okafor's Defense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/29/12317906/okafor-defense-video-analysis

Breakdown of Okafor's Offense:
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/7/28/12310140/jahlil-okafor-offensive-video-analysis-sixers

I would definitely still like to have a chance at him, but he definitely has a long way to go. I can understand why Danny isn't willing to give up much. He seems to lack conditioning and trust between himself and teammates. I could be wrong but from my own experience a lack of condition can sometimes come across as poor effort and the lack of trust between himself and his teammates seems to result in his indecisiveness on the court. Of course I could be wrong and he's just lazy and has a low BBIQ/poor feel for the game.
It will be interesting to see how much he improves over the next several years.  He's a 20 year old with raw skill.  He has the potential to be great on both sides of the ball if he gets in the right situation.

Can you provide an example of a big that was horrible at D, like Okafor, and improved so much that he became at least average? Okafor is a lot like Kanter, but a better post scorer and worse rebounder.
Most bigs aren't at their peak defensively as rookies.  There are plenty who improved over time.  A lot of them weren't skilled enough to get the type of minutes Okafor got as a raw rookie.  Off the top of my head, I can think of guys like Cousins and Zach Randolph who were considered pretty terrible defensively early on and showed improvement over time.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #130 on: July 29, 2016, 03:21:58 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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This is a pretty interesting excerpt from the article based on pretty in depth analysis

"[The author] concluded that big men like Okafor tend to remain in the negatives in terms of defensive impact," Nick wrote. "[He] also noted that Okafor's best-case scenario is about average defensive production. The first development that needs to happen with Okafor would be an increase in effort if he is to become passable on defense."

"However, I'm a little wary about that happening," Nick continued. "Brett Brown gets his guys to play their tails off. Jah is a clear outlier in that regard."


Nick then moved to Okafor's rebounding to finish his scouting report. Okafor has deep-seated issues rebounding to, and they "revolve around poor and poor technique" according to Nick.

He cited my piece from February that concluded that Okafor's rebounding vis-a-vis his rookie peers was concerningly low. While his raw, per game rebounding totals look strong, the better statistic that determines what percentage of available rebounds he corrals sold him far short of future All-Star and All NBA players.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #131 on: July 29, 2016, 03:30:13 PM »

Offline tankcity!

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Smart for Okafor would be a ante up from the celtics. They should offer it imo.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #132 on: July 29, 2016, 03:30:55 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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Smart for Okafor would be a ante up from the celtics. They should offer it imo.
probably already did and were turned down.   Smart doesn't seem like he would be a good fit there.  They need elite shooting.

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #133 on: July 29, 2016, 03:36:54 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Smart for Okafor would be a ante up from the celtics. They should offer it imo.
probably already did and were turned down.   Smart doesn't seem like he would be a good fit there.  They need elite shooting.

please they would take that in a second and you know it

Re: Okafor - The Ringer (article)
« Reply #134 on: July 29, 2016, 03:47:19 PM »

Offline 86MaxwellSmart

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Wasn't Okafor on the bench, when his college team came back and won the title--?
Larry Bird was Greater than you think.