Mannix on CSNNE/Toucher & Rich: Speculating Westbrook will be traded

[Fafnir]

I never understand the logic of not giving up drafts for perennial MVP candidates that are in their prime.

We're talking about Westbrook on a 1 year deal, not worth it.

Nor is he a perennial MVP candidate, the OKC had one of those, Durant.

[Moranis]

I never understand the logic of not giving up drafts for perennial MVP candidates that are in their prime.

We're talking about Westbrook on a 1 year deal, not worth it.

Nor is he a perennial MVP candidate, the OKC had one of those, Durant.

Sure he is.  He is a better all around player than Durant.  not a better scorer though and scoring is important for a MVP, as is media likeability, but here is the thing, the last two years Westbrook finished 4th in MVP voting.  Each year he was ahead of Durant. 

[Dedalus]

He should go to Houston.

[jpotter33]

1) It's already came out of Westbrook's camp that there's absolutely no way he's signing an extension with the Warriors, and it can be expected that goes the same for any extend-and-trade scenario. https://twitter.com/daldridgetnt/status/750092405626380288

2) Essentially, this forces OKC's hand to trade him. They absolutely cannot let this happen again, especially fresh off the KD situation. They're going to open up a market for him and get as much as they can for him. Further, they have no interest in waiting until the trade deadline to do so. That only lessens his value and wins them unnecessary games that they will want to avoid for a better draft pick next summer.

3) The Lakers situation has changed. Beforehand, they had all of this open space, and it was thought that they would do a Celtics situation and be patient for one more year utilizing one and two year contracts to have maximum cap space in 2017. However, they went out and signed a ton of money in multiyear contracts in average free agents in Mozgov, Deng, and Clarkson, so they no longer have space for two max contracts next year. To get him, LA is going to have to trade both Ingram and Russell, so that would leave Westbrook with Clarkson, Deng, Mozgov, and Randle as the primary components of that team moving forward with space to take another big free agent. So, yeah, if Westbrook wants to be in a winning situation, then the Lakers aren't necessarily going to be that, so they're definitely not nearly the threat that they once were to sign him next summer.

We'd really have to talk to his guys to see where his head is at regarding next summer. I doubt that he will give anyone even a "handshake agreement" that he'll re-sign with them, but it might not require that much to take that chance. You'd have his Bird Rights and be able to sign him to the most money for the longest. So if you'd ask him if Boston would be a place that he could see himself long-term on a max contract in a winning situation and he said yes, then that might be enough to take a chance on someone as talented as Westbrook.

Though I certainly understand the uneasiness of the whole situation and not wanting to take that chance, but people are being ridiculously picky if you don't want him because he's not exactly fitting your style or something. He's an MVP-level talent, and every team should want a talent like Westbrook, especially a team that is seemingly perfectly built with defensive 3 and D guys surrounding him.

[TheSlipperyWhistle]

1. These guys literally know nothing, Jon Snow.

2. OKC isn't going to trade Westbrook. They don't have a pedigree like the Celtics. They need butts in seats, and draft picks and mediocre (next to Westbrook) players are not going to keep people coming to games. The reason this franchise has thrived is KD and Westbrook.

3. They will hold on to hope that they can bring in someone else that helps him consider re-signing, but they will fail and lose him for nothing.

[CoachBo]

1) It's already came out of Westbrook's camp that there's absolutely no way he's signing an extension with the Warriors, and it can be expected that goes the same for any extend-and-trade scenario. https://twitter.com/daldridgetnt/status/750092405626380288

2) Essentially, this forces OKC's hand to trade him. They absolutely cannot let this happen again, especially fresh off the KD situation. They're going to open up a market for him and get as much as they can for him. Further, they have no interest in waiting until the trade deadline to do so. That only lessens his value and wins them unnecessary games that they will want to avoid for a better draft pick next summer.

3) The Lakers situation has changed. Beforehand, they had all of this open space, and it was thought that they would do a Celtics situation and be patient for one more year utilizing one and two year contracts to have maximum cap space in 2017. However, they went out and signed a ton of money in multiyear contracts in average free agents in Mozgov, Deng, and Clarkson, so they no longer have space for two max contracts next year. To get him, LA is going to have to trade both Ingram and Russell, so that would leave Westbrook with Clarkson, Deng, Mozgov, and Randle as the primary components of that team moving forward with space to take another big free agent. So, yeah, if Westbrook wants to be in a winning situation, then the Lakers aren't necessarily going to be that, so they're definitely not nearly the threat that they once were to sign him next summer.

We'd really have to talk to his guys to see where his head is at regarding next summer. I doubt that he will give anyone even a "handshake agreement" that he'll re-sign with them, but it might not require that much to take that chance. You'd have his Bird Rights and be able to sign him to the most money for the longest. So if you'd ask him if Boston would be a place that he could see himself long-term on a max contract in a winning situation and he said yes, then that might be enough to take a chance on someone as talented as Westbrook.

Though I certainly understand the uneasiness of the whole situation and not wanting to take that chance, but people are being ridiculously picky if you don't want him because he's not exactly fitting your style or something. He's an MVP-level talent, and every team should want a talent like Westbrook, especially a team that is seemingly perfectly built with defensive 3 and D guys surrounding him.

Good assessment. TP.

[jpotter33]

1. These guys literally know nothing, Jon Snow.

2. OKC isn't going to trade Westbrook. They don't have a pedigree like the Celtics. They need butts in seats, and draft picks and mediocre (next to Westbrook) players are not going to keep people coming to games. The reason this franchise has thrived is KD and Westbrook.

3. They will hold on to hope that they can bring in someone else that helps him consider re-signing, but they will fail and lose him for nothing.

They've already said that they're going to listen to offers for him, i.e. they're going to trade him for the best package that has a reasonable shot of keeping him next year.

I would bet you a million TP's that they trade him. Presti would get fired if he let two MVP-type talents walk out on him in two consecutive summers without getting anything from them, especially with Westbrook who is almost guaranteed to leave for a bigger market somewhere.

[Moranis]

Westbrook to LA, Paul to Cleveland, Irving to OKC.

Westbrook is then in LA but on a championship level team.  Paul gets to play with his friend in Cleveland and it makes Cleveland a bit better next year thus increasing the chances to repeat.  OKC gets a young stud PG that fits better in their new youth movement, who can still sell tickets, but won't take OKC out of a lottery pick in the next draft. 

[LarBrd33]

There was a poll on twitter that Jeff retweeted from some Celtics media:

Smart, Brown, and both 2017/2018 BKN picks for Westbrook yes/no?

 

potentially horrible trade.  I really don't think Westbrook would be a good fit here.  His stats are inflated for a number of reasons.  Even durant hated playing with him.

[RJ87]

Westbrook to LA, Paul to Cleveland, Irving to OKC.

Westbrook is then in LA but on a championship level team.  Paul gets to play with his friend in Cleveland and it makes Cleveland a bit better next year thus increasing the chances to repeat.  OKC gets a young stud PG that fits better in their new youth movement, who can still sell tickets, but won't take OKC out of a lottery pick in the next draft.

Okay. I don't understand why people still think Cleveland will trade Irving for CP3. It'd make more sense if they didn't just win it all with Irving as a vital piece, but there's no reason for them to get older with Irving proving he's a championship level player. Now you have Irving playing in the Olympics and that always seems to push players forward when the season starts.

I do think if he does hit the market, we could make a good offer. But now here comes the question, what would it mean for IT? He's been a big recruiter for us this offseason and a big part in our turnaround.

[jpotter33]

Westbrook to LA, Paul to Cleveland, Irving to OKC.

Westbrook is then in LA but on a championship level team.  Paul gets to play with his friend in Cleveland and it makes Cleveland a bit better next year thus increasing the chances to repeat.  OKC gets a young stud PG that fits better in their new youth movement, who can still sell tickets, but won't take OKC out of a lottery pick in the next draft.

That does make some sense for all the teams considered. However, it seems like you never see stars traded for each other, let alone in a three-way trade.

[loco_91]

http://nesn.com/2016/07/nba-rumors-no-chance-russell-westbrook-does-renegotiation-or-extension-of-contract/

"No chance" Westbrook signs an extension this summer.

That's basically a trade demand.

[biggs]

Can't he only verbally commit to re signing ala KG when we traded for him?

I would take him, but you can't trade the farm without that commitment to re sign

[Moranis]

Westbrook to LA, Paul to Cleveland, Irving to OKC.

Westbrook is then in LA but on a championship level team.  Paul gets to play with his friend in Cleveland and it makes Cleveland a bit better next year thus increasing the chances to repeat.  OKC gets a young stud PG that fits better in their new youth movement, who can still sell tickets, but won't take OKC out of a lottery pick in the next draft.

Okay. I don't understand why people still think Cleveland will trade Irving for CP3. It'd make more sense if they didn't just win it all with Irving as a vital piece, but there's no reason for them to get older with Irving proving he's a championship level player. Now you have Irving playing in the Olympics and that always seems to push players forward when the season starts.

I do think if he does hit the market, we could make a good offer. But now here comes the question, what would it mean for IT? He's been a big recruiter for us this offseason and a big part in our turnaround.

Paul is better than Irving and very good friends with James.  The Cavs championship window is exactly as long as James' championship window.  Improving the chances of winning during James' window and keeping James happier and thus longer makes it a good trade for the Cavs. 

[snively]

There was a poll on twitter that Jeff retweeted from some Celtics media:

Smart, Brown, and both 2017/2018 BKN picks for Westbrook yes/no?

 

potentially horrible trade.  I really don't think Westbrook would be a good fit here.  His stats are inflated for a number of reasons.  Even durant hated playing with him.

Horrible or not, I think that's about what it would take.