Author Topic: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick  (Read 11566 times)

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Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #60 on: June 28, 2016, 10:01:08 AM »

Offline BitterJim

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Can't blame him for asking.  Can't blame Philly for turning it down.

I actually agree with you 100% there.

If I were the Sixers, I wouldn't do that deal.  That would be incredibly one-sided in Boston's favour - perhaps Ainge thought that Philly were so desperate for Dunn that they would be willing to make a massive overpay in order to get him...if so, then I guess they called his bluff.
It could have been or the Lakers might be a good team and make the playoffs which makes it a mid 1st round pick and Noel.  Until free agency happens there is no real way to know how good the Lakers will be.  I mean they could land DeRozan and a couple of other players in DeRozan's ilk and put together a pretty nice team and still have all the young players (or maybe they trade some of the young guys for a guy like Cousins).  The Lakers pick has as much uncertainty as the Nets pick.  It could be great or it could be another blah level pick.

I think the Lakers will be a pretty good team next year.  They're not gonna make the playoffs, but they're not gonna be a bottom-5 team either.  I think that pick will be solidly in the late lottery, probably around the 7-to-10 range.  With a good FA period (like, really, really good) or a few couple big trades I could even see them making the playoffs
I'm bitter.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #61 on: June 28, 2016, 10:10:33 AM »

Offline ThePaintedArea

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #62 on: June 28, 2016, 10:23:23 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
I fully expect Covington to outperform Brown next year at a minimum.  Covington is a pretty solid player.  Good enough outside shooter, + defender, etc.  Not a world beater, but a pretty solid overall player that would have helped Boston. 

Now if Boston is going to go into full bore rebuilding, Brown makes a lot of sense, but if Boston is really going to try and take a step up, then acquiring Noel and Covington would have made more sense.  You get a significant upgrade at center (a position of need) and a nice solid wing for your bench (plus two more firsts for stashing or packing to move up).

I actually hypothesized that Boston might have been able to acquire Noel/Covington for 3 and then acquire 8 from Sacto to draft Brown and ended up with the player they wanted as well as the upgrade at center and back-up SF.
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Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #63 on: June 28, 2016, 10:33:17 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #64 on: June 28, 2016, 10:49:25 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
Covington would be a good rotation 3-and-D player.  His percentage is that low because nearly 70% of his shots are 3pt shots. 

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #65 on: June 28, 2016, 11:02:22 AM »

Offline BornReady

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I proposed this trade before

Philly overvalues Noel
Which rightfully they should when trying to win in a trade

But Noel value should drop as he will share playing time this season with a bunch of other talented young players
Plus the spacing issue offensively may drop his rebound and post points numbers

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #66 on: June 28, 2016, 11:05:46 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
Covington would be a good rotation 3-and-D player.  His percentage is that low because nearly 70% of his shots are 3pt shots.
right.  his TS% is 55% on his career, which is significantly better than Avery Bradley and many other players.  Bradley for example, only had a TS% of 54% this year and his career average is just 51%.
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Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #67 on: June 28, 2016, 11:21:32 AM »

Offline ThePaintedArea

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
Covington would be a good rotation 3-and-D player.  His percentage is that low because nearly 70% of his shots are 3pt shots.
right.  his TS% is 55% on his career, which is significantly better than Avery Bradley and many other players.  Bradley for example, only had a TS% of 54% this year and his career average is just 51%.

He also gets to the line at a nice rate and makes his ft's - .791 last year, approximately grade-A. But his biggest asset is his defense. He's a rotation player on most teams, just not such a good fit for the Celtics.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #68 on: June 28, 2016, 11:22:36 AM »

Offline BitterJim

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
Covington would be a good rotation 3-and-D player.  His percentage is that low because nearly 70% of his shots are 3pt shots.
right.  his TS% is 55% on his career, which is significantly better than Avery Bradley and many other players.  Bradley for example, only had a TS% of 54% this year and his career average is just 51%.

Yet Bradley shot better than Covington on 2 pointers (50.5% vs 45.2%) and 3 pointers (36.1% vs 35.3%).  Covington only beat him on FT% (79.1% vs 78.0%).  For eFG%, Bradley had him beat (52.0% vs 50.4%)

Changing his shot selection would definitely help his shooting percentage (he takes over 7 threes a game!), but he's not a better shooter than Bradley.  I'd love him for 3-and-D, but not at the price of that Philly deal
I'm bitter.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #69 on: June 28, 2016, 11:25:53 AM »

Offline slamtheking

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Can't blame him for asking.  Can't blame Philly for turning it down.

I actually agree with you 100% there.

If I were the Sixers, I wouldn't do that deal.  That would be incredibly one-sided in Boston's favour - perhaps Ainge thought that Philly were so desperate for Dunn that they would be willing to make a massive overpay in order to get him...if so, then I guess they called his bluff.
It could have been or the Lakers might be a good team and make the playoffs which makes it a mid 1st round pick and Noel.  Until free agency happens there is no real way to know how good the Lakers will be.  I mean they could land DeRozan and a couple of other players in DeRozan's ilk and put together a pretty nice team and still have all the young players (or maybe they trade some of the young guys for a guy like Cousins).  The Lakers pick has as much uncertainty as the Nets pick.  It could be great or it could be another blah level pick.

I think the Lakers will be a pretty good team next year.  They're not gonna make the playoffs, but they're not gonna be a bottom-5 team either.  I think that pick will be solidly in the late lottery, probably around the 7-to-10 range.  With a good FA period (like, really, really good) or a few couple big trades I could even see them making the playoffs
agreed.  LA has a better chance to draw FA's than Brooklyn IMHO.

LA has weather and Hollywood as enticements.  Lakers are the second-most heralded franchise in terms of history.  LA seems to be more of a 'home' for players in terms of guys that grew up on So Cal liking the idea of playing closer to home.  They don't have the vet players to draw any other vets so there's little worry of them climbing into the playoffs with whomever they sign.

Brooklyn doesn't have that same package to offer other than being in NYC (but not playing in MSG).  Only player of note left on their roster is Brook Lopez who's unlikely to have back-to-back years of good health.  They'll have to pay through the nose to get players of moderate talent to consider them --> anyone who's talented will sign with a franchise in better shape talent-wise since every team will have money to spend on the best players available.

Lakers will likely improve to 30 wins next year putting them between 7-10 and losing their pick becomes more palatable to them.  Nets are strong contenders for worst team in the league going into next year and I'd be very surprised if they dont' ship out Lopez in a deal at the trade deadline.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #70 on: June 28, 2016, 11:49:10 AM »

Offline BitterJim

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Can't blame him for asking.  Can't blame Philly for turning it down.

I actually agree with you 100% there.

If I were the Sixers, I wouldn't do that deal.  That would be incredibly one-sided in Boston's favour - perhaps Ainge thought that Philly were so desperate for Dunn that they would be willing to make a massive overpay in order to get him...if so, then I guess they called his bluff.
It could have been or the Lakers might be a good team and make the playoffs which makes it a mid 1st round pick and Noel.  Until free agency happens there is no real way to know how good the Lakers will be.  I mean they could land DeRozan and a couple of other players in DeRozan's ilk and put together a pretty nice team and still have all the young players (or maybe they trade some of the young guys for a guy like Cousins).  The Lakers pick has as much uncertainty as the Nets pick.  It could be great or it could be another blah level pick.

I think the Lakers will be a pretty good team next year.  They're not gonna make the playoffs, but they're not gonna be a bottom-5 team either.  I think that pick will be solidly in the late lottery, probably around the 7-to-10 range.  With a good FA period (like, really, really good) or a few couple big trades I could even see them making the playoffs
agreed.  LA has a better chance to draw FA's than Brooklyn IMHO.

LA has weather and Hollywood as enticements.  Lakers are the second-most heralded franchise in terms of history.  LA seems to be more of a 'home' for players in terms of guys that grew up on So Cal liking the idea of playing closer to home.  They don't have the vet players to draw any other vets so there's little worry of them climbing into the playoffs with whomever they sign.

Brooklyn doesn't have that same package to offer other than being in NYC (but not playing in MSG).  Only player of note left on their roster is Brook Lopez who's unlikely to have back-to-back years of good health.  They'll have to pay through the nose to get players of moderate talent to consider them --> anyone who's talented will sign with a franchise in better shape talent-wise since every team will have money to spend on the best players available.

Lakers will likely improve to 30 wins next year putting them between 7-10 and losing their pick becomes more palatable to them.  Nets are strong contenders for worst team in the league going into next year and I'd be very surprised if they dont' ship out Lopez in a deal at the trade deadline.

Brooklyn's best hope for signing FAs is to offer them more than anybody else, which instantly takes max FAs off the table.  But after that they'll be overpaying players, either on short deals or long deals.  Long-term deals would destroy any flexibility they have after they have picks again, so I doubt Marks gives out many/any big deals over 2 years.  That makes me think short (2 or 2+1) deals are much more likely.  It will come down to whether players want the larger salary short term (possible, especially if they want to bet on themselves), or the added security off a longer-term contract.  Even then, though, there are better destinations, like the Lakers, Knicks (unless they blow their cap space on one player *cough* Howard *cough*), etc.
I'm bitter.

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #71 on: June 28, 2016, 12:08:03 PM »

Offline PaulAllen

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Im sort of shocked the Sixers didnt bite on this.. For one Noel is a RFA next year coupled the pick is quite an uncertainty... LAL could kill the FA market in any given year... Plus Philly really cant go in figuring they will just stock pile young unexperienced talent year after year...

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #72 on: June 28, 2016, 01:22:06 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Good. The other deal was horrendous. Who wants a D leaguer and 2 late first round picks? What exactly are the C's going to do with those?
The story on the main page called Noel/Covington/24/26 as a "kings ransom". I say hardly, it's still basically Noel.
Covington was a d leaguer and is at best a bench player.

I think that you're underestimating him. He could be a rotation player on most teams. On the other hand, small forward looks like a strength for the Celtics right now.
He had his moments, but on the balance he's shot below .400 since he entered the league. Strictly a player for a limited role, it seems.
Covington would be a good rotation 3-and-D player.  His percentage is that low because nearly 70% of his shots are 3pt shots.
right.  his TS% is 55% on his career, which is significantly better than Avery Bradley and many other players.  Bradley for example, only had a TS% of 54% this year and his career average is just 51%.

Yet Bradley shot better than Covington on 2 pointers (50.5% vs 45.2%) and 3 pointers (36.1% vs 35.3%).  Covington only beat him on FT% (79.1% vs 78.0%).  For eFG%, Bradley had him beat (52.0% vs 50.4%)

Changing his shot selection would definitely help his shooting percentage (he takes over 7 threes a game!), but he's not a better shooter than Bradley.  I'd love him for 3-and-D, but not at the price of that Philly deal
Bradley was also on a much better team.  Shooting percentage is effected a great deal by your teammates. 
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Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #73 on: June 28, 2016, 01:29:14 PM »

Offline mef730

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Can't blame him for asking.  Can't blame Philly for turning it down.

I actually agree with you 100% there.

If I were the Sixers, I wouldn't do that deal.  That would be incredibly one-sided in Boston's favour - perhaps Ainge thought that Philly were so desperate for Dunn that they would be willing to make a massive overpay in order to get him...if so, then I guess they called his bluff.
It could have been or the Lakers might be a good team and make the playoffs which makes it a mid 1st round pick and Noel.  Until free agency happens there is no real way to know how good the Lakers will be.  I mean they could land DeRozan and a couple of other players in DeRozan's ilk and put together a pretty nice team and still have all the young players (or maybe they trade some of the young guys for a guy like Cousins).  The Lakers pick has as much uncertainty as the Nets pick.  It could be great or it could be another blah level pick.

I think the Lakers will be a pretty good team next year.  They're not gonna make the playoffs, but they're not gonna be a bottom-5 team either.  I think that pick will be solidly in the late lottery, probably around the 7-to-10 range.  With a good FA period (like, really, really good) or a few couple big trades I could even see them making the playoffs
agreed.  LA has a better chance to draw FA's than Brooklyn IMHO.

LA has weather and Hollywood as enticements.  Lakers are the second-most heralded franchise in terms of history.  LA seems to be more of a 'home' for players in terms of guys that grew up on So Cal liking the idea of playing closer to home.  They don't have the vet players to draw any other vets so there's little worry of them climbing into the playoffs with whomever they sign.

Brooklyn doesn't have that same package to offer other than being in NYC (but not playing in MSG).  Only player of note left on their roster is Brook Lopez who's unlikely to have back-to-back years of good health.  They'll have to pay through the nose to get players of moderate talent to consider them --> anyone who's talented will sign with a franchise in better shape talent-wise since every team will have money to spend on the best players available.

Lakers will likely improve to 30 wins next year putting them between 7-10 and losing their pick becomes more palatable to them.  Nets are strong contenders for worst team in the league going into next year and I'd be very surprised if they dont' ship out Lopez in a deal at the trade deadline.

Actually, it would be back-back-back. If BKN didn't sign any good free agents, I wonder if they could go 0-82?

Mike

Re: Rumor- Ainge wanted Noel & Lakers pick
« Reply #74 on: June 28, 2016, 02:44:31 PM »

Offline flybono

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Noel for the #3 was all you needed. Good Night.

Thanks Danny your doing a great job!