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Trade with Chicago idea
« on: June 14, 2016, 03:47:27 PM »

Offline timriffic

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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2016, 03:49:00 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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I hate it. Big overpay.
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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2016, 03:50:51 PM »

Offline timriffic

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we take  Rose off their hands  , keep him or move him.
bottom line we get butler and a piece  to keep or move

Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2016, 03:55:52 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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we take  Rose off their hands  , keep him or move him.
bottom line we get butler and a piece  to keep or move
Rose is not a piece. We also give up Isaiah Thomas Avery Bradley and the #3 overall pick. I think this is a major overpay, but Im interested to see what others think.
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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2016, 04:02:29 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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Trading Thomas to get Butler is a bad idea. We need Butler because no one else can create shots, if we trade our one guy who can create for another guy that can create we still only have one guy that can create, aka the same problem.

Rose is absolutely washed up. He's never going to be the same player he was. If we are getting him, then that should count as us giving up an asset (of cap space) not gaining an asset.
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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2016, 04:15:24 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Derek Rose for a second round pick would be a bad trade for the Celtics.
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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2016, 04:23:09 PM »

Offline Granath

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we take  Rose off their hands  , keep him or move him.
bottom line we get butler and a piece  to keep or move

Bottom line that is an idiotic trade idea because Rose isn't a piece to "keep or move". He's a piece you're stuck with until his contract is up (thankfully next year) aka Vin Baker or Raef LaFrentz.

IT is at least as good as Butler on the offensive end of the floor (PER 36 works well here):
IT: 24.8 ppg / 3.3 rpg / 6.9 apg / .562 TS%
Butler: 20.4 / 5.2 / 4.7 / .562 TS%

So the only advantage to Butler is position and defensive end of the floor. While significant, that's not huge especially when you factor in IT's significant difference in salary. Call this part a medium edge to Chicago - and that's being generous to them.

Then you're also sending over Bradley (1st Team Defense + low salary) and JJ/Amir (both whose non-guaranteed salaries are worth something) for an oft-injured Rose. I wouldn't make that trade straight up. Rose is a high-priced shell of his former self, scored only 1 ppg more than Bradley and was absolutely horrid last season. While Chicago had a winning record, the difference between Rose's Ortg and Drtg was NEGATIVE 14. His +/- was -3.3. He was -.7 in VORP, which means he was worse than a replacement player! Rose is now the kind of player who gets moved for a top-55 protected 2nd round pick, not for a 1st team defensive stud on a below-market contract.

Then you want to give up 3 + 16 for 14? You only do this deal without any picks, never mind giving up the #3 in the draft. This trade isn't remotely close for the Cs. People need to look past names of washed-up players and look at their current on-the-court play.
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Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2016, 04:48:57 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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http://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6693839
throw in #3 and 16   for chicagos #14

I had proposed this exact trade on April 20th http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=83872.msg2070934#msg2070934

Quote
To Boston:  Rose ($21.3M), Butler ($16.4M)
To Chicago: Thomas ($6.7M), Bradley ($8.3M), Amir ($12.0M), Jerebko ($5.0M)

Add to that draft pick(s); possibly one of the Nets, maybe the future Memphis pick.

I think taking on Rose is a great way to entice Chicago.  Now in thinking about it, we are giving really good value and now that we know the BKN 2016 pick is #3, I don't think I include that pick.  Maybe we offer #23 and #35 but get back #14.  They are getting Thomas and Bradley, valuable players.  We get Butler who is better than Thomas or Bradley but not a "the guy" player.

I don't mind taking Rose but his salary is so high, it makes this deal very hard.  I would rather keep Thomas and include better draft picks but then the salaries don't match.  It is a tough deal.

Re: Trade with Chicago idea
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2016, 05:02:06 PM »

Offline nostar

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I'm a no on the OP trade. I would help them move Rose to get  Butler though:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=jrru4ox along with #3 overall pick and #35

Then send #23 and #35 to Philly to take on Rose's contract this year. He's an expiring so it shouldn't be a huge investment for them. I'm assuming Philly isn't signing any big FAs this off season. I think #23/35 should more than get it done.

We keep #16 and #31, add Korkmaz/Maker, stash Cornelie or Papagiannis in the late 2nd. Start:

IT
Butler
Crowder
KO
Horford

Ok, so we signed Horford :) if we sign Durant Kelly can come off of the bench!