Rumor: Timberwolves to offer pick number 5 and players for Butler

[PickNRoll]

No chance it's Wiggins....

More likely its lavine plus 5.  But also pekovic or anybody else not named towns , wiggins

Once again Pekovic has negative value.  It would need to be Levine and Dieng plus the #5

Lavine, Dieng and 5 is a HOME RUN for the Wolves.  The only way CHI can even consider this trade is if Wiggins is included, or alternately 2-3 first round picks.  If I'm MN, I'd do Wiggins, filler and 5 for Butler, no questions asked.  Butler's contract of 16, 17, 18M over the next 3 years is such a sweet deal.

Just because I like accuracy, Butler's contract is $18.4-$20.7 mil over the next three years if he's traded.  Still a nice deal, but a bit more than you suggest.

Ahh, thanks.  I didn't realize there was a trade kicker.  Nonetheless, Butler is a clear max player, so you're getting a premium discount for 3 years.

[PickNRoll]

I doubt they give up wiggins, maybe something like Rubio and #5.

Rubio has negative value so that won't happen.

This is so wrong.

No it's not.  Read what Woj Kyler, Stein and the other experts  say.  He's got a big contract and still hasn't learned how to hit a jumper.  Nobody wants him as a starter.  The Twolves tried to trade him at the deadline and found no takers.  Read the articles.

Correct.  Rubio at 15M IS a net negative for a lot of teams.  You just can't play him alongside so many guys in the league, namely non-shooters.  Rubio's contract is partially a business play.  He was the face of the Wolves for a couple years and he's marketable.  He's a better Jeremy Lin in a way.  Sells tickets and jerseys, but is a coaching nightmare.

Not true at all. Rubio makes the Timberwolves noticeably better. They have played ~.500 ball over the past two years when he plays, and they have been generally abyssal when he doesn't. He's a fantastic defender who has evolved from being a gambler to being a great positional and opportunistic defender. His vision is off the charts, and his three-point jumper has really improved. Rubio's problem is finishing around the basket. He's basically prime Rondo minus the 55%+ inside 3 feet and the freakish ability to absolutely go off.

15mill for Rubio with the rising cap is a bargain.

What?!  Wolves were 26-50 with Rubio last year.  I'm not understanding.

[GetLucky]

I doubt they give up wiggins, maybe something like Rubio and #5.

Rubio has negative value so that won't happen.

This is so wrong.

No it's not.  Read what Woj Kyler, Stein and the other experts  say.  He's got a big contract and still hasn't learned how to hit a jumper.  Nobody wants him as a starter.  The Twolves tried to trade him at the deadline and found no takers.  Read the articles.

Correct.  Rubio at 15M IS a net negative for a lot of teams.  You just can't play him alongside so many guys in the league, namely non-shooters.  Rubio's contract is partially a business play.  He was the face of the Wolves for a couple years and he's marketable.  He's a better Jeremy Lin in a way.  Sells tickets and jerseys, but is a coaching nightmare.

Not true at all. Rubio makes the Timberwolves noticeably better. They have played ~.500 ball over the past two years when he plays, and they have been generally abyssal when he doesn't. He's a fantastic defender who has evolved from being a gambler to being a great positional and opportunistic defender. His vision is off the charts, and his three-point jumper has really improved. Rubio's problem is finishing around the basket. He's basically prime Rondo minus the 55%+ inside 3 feet and the freakish ability to absolutely go off.

15mill for Rubio with the rising cap is a bargain.

What?!  Wolves were 26-50 with Rubio last year.  I'm not understanding.

My bad, it was a thing from the previous year. The Wolves are still noticeably better with Rubio running the team (although that may have something to do with their only other point guards being Tyus Jones and Andre Miller for a few months). I can guarantee there are some stats to back me up (whether advanced or simple +/-)

[PickNRoll]

I doubt they give up wiggins, maybe something like Rubio and #5.

Rubio has negative value so that won't happen.

This is so wrong.

No it's not.  Read what Woj Kyler, Stein and the other experts  say.  He's got a big contract and still hasn't learned how to hit a jumper.  Nobody wants him as a starter.  The Twolves tried to trade him at the deadline and found no takers.  Read the articles.

Correct.  Rubio at 15M IS a net negative for a lot of teams.  You just can't play him alongside so many guys in the league, namely non-shooters.  Rubio's contract is partially a business play.  He was the face of the Wolves for a couple years and he's marketable.  He's a better Jeremy Lin in a way.  Sells tickets and jerseys, but is a coaching nightmare.

Not true at all. Rubio makes the Timberwolves noticeably better. They have played ~.500 ball over the past two years when he plays, and they have been generally abyssal when he doesn't. He's a fantastic defender who has evolved from being a gambler to being a great positional and opportunistic defender. His vision is off the charts, and his three-point jumper has really improved. Rubio's problem is finishing around the basket. He's basically prime Rondo minus the 55%+ inside 3 feet and the freakish ability to absolutely go off.

15mill for Rubio with the rising cap is a bargain.

What?!  Wolves were 26-50 with Rubio last year.  I'm not understanding.

My bad, it was a thing from the previous year. The Wolves are still noticeably better with Rubio running the team (although that may have something to do with their only other point guards being Tyus Jones and Andre Miller for a few months). I can guarantee there are some stats to back me up (whether advanced or simple +/-)

I live in Minneapolis incidentally, and went to about 30 home games this year.  Rubio is all of the things you say. Nice defender, great passer.  But his basketball value is submarined by his shooting.  You literally can't play him in most lineups.  I equate him to Rondo.  If you have Pierce, Allen and Garnett next to him, fine.  Otherwise, coaches will just make you play 4 on 5.  Can you imagine playing him next to Smart, Turner, and Amir Johnson?  Good luck ever scoring.  That's why his value is diminished.

[tarheelsxxiii]

That sucks. They're in a position to crush any offer we make unless we grossly overpay.

[86MaxwellSmart]

No chance it's Wiggins....

More likely its lavine plus 5.  But also pekovic or anybody else not named towns , wiggins

Once again Pekovic has negative value.  It would need to be Levine and Dieng plus the #5

Lavine, Dieng and 5 is a HOME RUN for the Wolves.  The only way CHI can even consider this trade is if Wiggins is included, or alternately 2-3 first round picks.  If I'm MN, I'd do Wiggins, filler and 5 for Butler, no questions asked.  Butler's contract of 16, 17, 18M over the next 3 years is such a sweet deal.

Just because I like accuracy, Butler's contract is $18.4-$20.7 mil over the next three years if he's traded.  Still a nice deal, but a bit more than you suggest.

I read the trade kicker only happens if he is dealt after July 1st...which means draft night is a good time to deal him.

[Geo123]

No chance it's Wiggins....

More likely its lavine plus 5.  But also pekovic or anybody else not named towns , wiggins

Once again Pekovic has negative value.  It would need to be Levine and Dieng plus the #5

You cant. Salaries dont match

Yes you can just add a filler...

[KG Living Legend]

What players?

 I would say Lavine makes the most sense.

[KG Living Legend]

 I'm asking for The #5 pick Lavine, Muhammed and can Pekovic because his contract is up a year early.

 Then you can Draft Hield, Murray or Brown. Might be able to get Bender.

[BDeCosta26]

That sucks. They're in a position to crush any offer we make unless we grossly overpay.

You think so? I don't think so unless one of Wiggins or Towns is on the table, which I'm pretty sure they're not. #5, LaVine and Dieng isn't really a better offer than #3, Smart /Bradley and Olynyk or Rozier. When you add in the fact that we can add mid 1sts, early. 2nds, Rozier (who the bulls love and were gonna take last year, hence his selection at 16), Mickey and especially the future Brooklyn picks I just don't see a way they can top us.

#3, Bradley, Rozier and the 2018 BRK pick easily beats that Minny offer.

[jambr380]

That sucks. They're in a position to crush any offer we make unless we grossly overpay.

You think so? I don't think so unless one of Wiggins or Towns is on the table, which I'm pretty sure they're not. #5, LaVine and Dieng isn't really a better offer than #3, Smart /Bradley and Olynyk or Rozier. When you add in the fact that we can add mid 1sts, early. 2nds, Rozier (who the bulls love and were gonna take last year, hence his selection at 16), Mickey and especially the future Brooklyn picks I just don't see a way they can top us.

#3, Bradley, Rozier and the 2018 BRK pick easily beats that Minny offer.

Then Minny can have him. No way on future BKN or MEM picks and no reason to include Rozier, either, when they are already getting Bradley and Dunn - they can have Young/Hunter and a mid-2nd rounder. If not, we can continue building our young core - I understand we need to consolidate to get more top talent, but that package should get you Cousins or George.

[Granath]

That sucks. They're in a position to crush any offer we make unless we grossly overpay.

Not really. The Cs have the better picks (now and in the future) and the better prospects. If they "crush"our offer then they grossly overpaid. Especially when you consider they're not going to give up Wiggins or Towns.

[PickNRoll]

If they include Wiggins, they can trump our offer.  If not, we win.

[CoachBo]

Not if we tell them they can take our offer or we draft Dunn.

[ssspence]

It makes less than zero sense that Wiggins would be 'included' in the deal -- totally lopsided, unrealistic trade.

Besides, if that were the case, the rumor would be "Timberwolves willing to give up Wiggins in trade for Butler". He's far more valuable that then #5 pick.