Can someone explain the hype of Marcus Smart to me

[dreamgreen]

I would like to get excited about Smart but so far it's been limited. Think most of us agree he's very good on defense. I will disagree with most on his PG skills (which in a ball movement offense is not as important), I think he is decent and getting and will get better. What worries me is his offensive game of lack there of. Today's NBA is really reliant on guards that can shoot and take to to the rim. He struggles at both along with taking to many 3's when he shoots so poorly. I'll add that I'm a little concerned for such a big kid that he has so many injuries that keep him off the court.

I'm not big on trading young undeveloped talent (Billups and Joe Johnson still haunt me) but in the right package I'd do it. Along with the fact I'm high on Rozier!

[green_bballers13]

Smart fits the eye test on defense. He makes numerous winning basketball plays, esp. near the end of games. tony allen type player already with 2 years of experience.

He has the potential to become a decent scorer/penetrator over the next couple of years before he hits his prime. Smart has an impact on the defensive end during poor shooting nights, and looks like an all star when he scores and hits clutch 3's. Every team would gladly welcome Smart, and some might trade something of value for him.

Look at the picks in the 2014 draft around him:
4 Gordon, 5 Exum, 6 Smart, 7 Randle, 8 Stauskas, 9 Vonleh

I would expect most fans would pick him out of this group.

[bdm860]

Because people love young prospects.  Just look at all the Mickey love and how many people are holding out hope in James Young.  It doesn't matter who you are, if you're a young player on the Celtics, there will be tons of people who will become instantly attached to you and believe you can become an All-Star/All-NBA player if just given enough minutes.

With Avery, he's a known quantity at this point.  People have moved on from him developing much more at this point and believe what you see is what you get.  Smart on the other hand, people have yet to accept what we see is his ceiling.

And it also helps that Marcus Smart is to defense what Gerald Green was to offense.  Just like Gerald would break out some crazy highlight reel dunk that makes you say, "wow if he can just develop the rest of his game he'll be an All-Star for sure,"  well Marcus is the same way on defense, making a spectacular play on D that makes everyone say, "wow if he can just develop the rest of his game he'll be an All-Star for sure."

I can't take you seriously if you think Marcus has hit his ceiling at age 22.

Same here. I think people just get incredibly impatient with our players. Smart is younger than a couple of people that will be drafted this year.

Yeah. Like, some people want the 22 year old Hield but not Marcus.  Smh

See, you guys make my point.

I've never said what I think Marcus's ceiling is, but people want to believe it's higher than what we currently see.  Though, I do see how I framed my sentences could make it seem like I'm saying something like "this is the best we can get from Marcus, time to move on," that is not what I'm saying at all.  I love Marcus and hope to see continued improvement.

But it goes with:

I think people just get incredibly impatient with our players.

There should be no "our players" when it comes to talent evaluation.  We shouldn't have more (or less) patience with a player just because he's on the C's.  But this isn't limited to the C's, it's pretty much the same for all passionate fans of most teams.  If I said we should trade Marcus Smart straight up to the Magic for Aaron Gordon, Elfrid Payton, or Mario Hezonja or to the Lakers for Julius Randle, D'Angelo Russell, or Jordan Clarkson, I think most people here would be against any of those trades.  But I bet if I went over to a Lakers or Magic forum, they'd be equally against those trades too.  How can every fan base be so right about their own players?

It's because people get attached to the young players on their teams and they dream of their potential.  Once those players stop being so young (as the case with Avery) that dream of potential turns into the reality of this is who this player is for better or worse.

Sometimes those feelings of attachment and the let's-see-this-through mentality are justified (like with players such as C.J. McCullom, Jimmy Butler, Draymond Green, Steph Curry, Gordon Hayward, etc.), sometimes they aren't (with players like Fab Melo, Dion Waiters, Austin Rivers, Hasheem Thabeet, Wesley Johnson, Ekpe Udoh, Derrick Williams, Gerald Green, Anthony Bennett, etc.).

[mmmmm]

With his defense and peripheral attributes, Smart need only become a 12-14 point per game scorer (e.g. average for a shooting guard) with an outside shot that merits defending and an ability to get to the rim occasionally, and acceptable efficiency (e.g. 40 / 33 / 70) to be a top 10-15 player at his position.

Doesn't that beg a couple of questions?

1) What is his position?  Point guard?  Shooting guard?  Combo?  Generic "wing"?   If we are going to say he is "top 10-15 at his position", then who are the players we are comparing him to?

2) Is a top 10-15 player at a position an acceptable result for a #6 pick that was the result of tanking?   I feel that's a decent return for such a pick, but nothing to get too overly excited about.  Others may expect more.

[celticsclay]

Because people love young prospects.  Just look at all the Mickey love and how many people are holding out hope in James Young.  It doesn't matter who you are, if you're a young player on the Celtics, there will be tons of people who will become instantly attached to you and believe you can become an All-Star/All-NBA player if just given enough minutes.

With Avery, he's a known quantity at this point.  People have moved on from him developing much more at this point and believe what you see is what you get.  Smart on the other hand, people have yet to accept what we see is his ceiling.

And it also helps that Marcus Smart is to defense what Gerald Green was to offense.  Just like Gerald would break out some crazy highlight reel dunk that makes you say, "wow if he can just develop the rest of his game he'll be an All-Star for sure,"  well Marcus is the same way on defense, making a spectacular play on D that makes everyone say, "wow if he can just develop the rest of his game he'll be an All-Star for sure."

I can't take you seriously if you think Marcus has hit his ceiling at age 22.

Same here. I think people just get incredibly impatient with our players. Smart is younger than a couple of people that will be drafted this year.

Yeah. Like, some people want the 22 year old Hield but not Marcus.  Smh

See, you guys make my point.

I've never said what I think Marcus's ceiling is, but people want to believe it's higher than what we currently see.  Though, I do see how I framed my sentences could make it seem like I'm saying something like "this is the best we can get from Marcus, time to move on," that is not what I'm saying at all.  I love Marcus and hope to see continued improvement.

But it goes with:

I think people just get incredibly impatient with our players.

There should be no "our players" when it comes to talent evaluation.  We shouldn't have more (or less) patience with a player just because he's on the C's.  But this isn't limited to the C's, it's pretty much the same for all passionate fans of most teams.  If I said we should trade Marcus Smart straight up to the Magic for Aaron Gordon, Elfrid Payton, or Mario Hezonja or to the Lakers for Julius Randle, D'Angelo Russell, or Jordan Clarkson, I think most people here would be against any of those trades.  But I bet if I went over to a Lakers or Magic forum, they'd be equally against those trades too.  How can every fan base be so right about their own players?

It's because people get attached to the young players on their teams and they dream of their potential.  Once those players stop being so young (as the case with Avery) that dream of potential turns into the reality of this is who this player is for better or worse.

Sometimes those feelings of attachment and the let's-see-this-through mentality are justified (like with players such as C.J. McCullom, Jimmy Butler, Draymond Green, Steph Curry, Gordon Hayward, etc.), sometimes they aren't (with players like Fab Melo, Dion Waiters, Austin Rivers, Hasheem Thabeet, Wesley Johnson, Ekpe Udoh, Derrick Williams, Gerald Green, Anthony Bennett, etc.).

I will reiterate that I think it is pretty logical for fans to have less patience for there own young players than they do for young players on every team. We see them every game, 80 games a season and after watching them for 2 years it is easy to sit back and think, well I know what this guy is now. We see someone like Aaron Gordon maybe 8 times in two years playing the Celtics and maybe a few extra nationally televised games and think.. wow this guy can really become something. I am not bagging on you by any stretch for this, I do the same time. I was pretty shocked to realize in a different thread that Marcus Smart is still younger than Gary Payton II coming out of Oregon State in this years draft.

I don't discount Smart shooting like he did in a couple of the Atlanta games more consistently as he enters his prime.  Theoretically he could improve every single season for the next 4-5 seasons. If he can do that, he is really a stud.

[D Dub]

With his defense and peripheral attributes, Smart need only become a 12-14 point per game scorer (e.g. average for a shooting guard) with an outside shot that merits defending and an ability to get to the rim occasionally, and acceptable efficiency (e.g. 40 / 33 / 70) to be a top 10-15 player at his position.

Doesn't that beg a couple of questions?

1) What is his position?  Point guard?  Shooting guard?  Combo?  Generic "wing"?   If we are going to say he is "top 10-15 at his position", then who are the players we are comparing him to?

2) Is a top 10-15 player at a position an acceptable result for a #6 pick that was the result of tanking?   I feel that's a decent return for such a pick, but nothing to get too overly excited about.  Others may expect more.

we get so caught up in stats and categories we often the forget the most important one, wins.

that's what makes Marcus special, his desire to win is greater than most.  its on display every time he plays, but difficult to quantify.  deflections, jump balls, box outs, keep guys off their spots, relentlessly going over screens, finding ways to get loose balls, taking charges, and the list goes on and on.     

despite his streaky shooting, he's still fearless in the clutch & capable of guarding five positions at a high level.  who else in the league can you say that about? 

now that his ankle is fully healed, we'll start to see the three fall more.  still, for how Brad plays, he's indispensable to what we are doing even while his offense is a work in progress. 

and yes -- I'd much rather have him that Randle or anyone else we could have drafted #6 in that draft. 

[Ilikesports17]

There was an article a while back, I think from the globe that LarBrd posted about Smart. There was a lot of backlash, I think largely because it was LarBrd and it was viewed as him just jumping onto any opportunity to trash Smart, but the key part of the article is that the Cs really branded him as the savior type. There was the whole "Education of Marcus Smart" all the losing was directed towards his eventual selection. the 2014 draft was supposed to be generational and while the ping pong balls kept us from getting our lebron James we could still nab our D Wade or Melo.

Marcus isnt that type of Superstar. Marcus doesnt project to be any kind of superstar. I love the guy and think hes gonna be really really good, but I think a lot of people were led to believe he was going to come in and put up 20 and 6 from day one, when in reality hes probably never putting up those numbers. That led to a group that was so dissapointed in his lack of immediate stardom, they think he sucks, and a group still thinking hes gonna some day wake up and be Russell Westbrook with elite defense.

To answer your actual question, its because hes the perfect Celtic. He makes big plays, hed rather die than lose, and he brings an absurd amount of intensity to the game. People want Smart to be a star because hed be great as a star.

[knuckleballer]

Regarding his poor shooting last year, let's not forget that this happened to him last July.



I think a lot of people forget about that injury or how bad it was.  I'm looking forward to see if he can make significant improvements after a healthy offseason.

[jpotter33]

There was an article a while back, I think from the globe that LarBrd posted about Smart. There was a lot of backlash, I think largely because it was LarBrd and it was viewed as him just jumping onto any opportunity to trash Smart, but the key part of the article is that the Cs really branded him as the savior type. There was the whole "Education of Marcus Smart" all the losing was directed towards his eventual selection. the 2014 draft was supposed to be generational and while the ping pong balls kept us from getting our lebron James we could still nab our D Wade or Melo.

Marcus isnt that type of Superstar. Marcus doesnt project to be any kind of superstar. I love the guy and think hes gonna be really really good, but I think a lot of people were led to believe he was going to come in and put up 20 and 6 from day one, when in reality hes probably never putting up those numbers. That led to a group that was so dissapointed in his lack of immediate stardom, they think he sucks, and a group still thinking hes gonna some day wake up and be Russell Westbrook with elite defense.

To answer your actual question, its because hes the perfect Celtic. He makes big plays, hed rather die than lose, and he brings an absurd amount of intensity to the game. People want Smart to be a star because hed be great as a star.

I think most of the people who are very critical of Smart here had unrealistic expectations of him coming in anyways. While his first two years of defense have been better than any incoming player that I can remember in recent history, especially guards, his offense was always a work in progress. Exacerbating that is the fact that we've almost primarily played him out of position/role in the offense in his two years. He's much better offensively with the ball in his hands than playing off the ball as a spot-up shooter, but with him almost exclusively playing with Turner, in addition to IT and Rozier, he's not been placed in a position to succeed offensively, which is offset by us being much better than we were supposed to be at this point.

[Chief Macho]

I was getting skeptical,  but he showed me something in the playoffs.  I wouldn't trade him.  I think he gets there.

[LarBrd33]

He was drafted high and he's young.  If he played in Philly or LA, nobody here would want anything to do with him.

That said, he still might have potential so we have some hope he might live up to his draft position.  So far, he's been very disappointing, but he still has time.  This season is an important one for him.  If he doesn't make a leap, the "next Tony Allen" talk will start to set in.

[Who]

Top young defensive guard in the league. Hope is that Smart can become a 14-15ppg threat to become a two-way player. Mostly through improved perimeter shooting.

[LarBrd33]

Top young defensive guard in the league. Hope is that Smart can become a 14-15ppg threat to become a two-way player. Mostly through improved perimeter shooting.

I still think a hybrid of Tony Allen/Rodney Stuckey is in play for him if he improves his offensive game significantly.

[fandrew]

I see Smart as a guy that could become a 1-2 combo version of Jimmy Butler as his ceiling if he ever has a healthy enough offseason to work on his shot (he had the dislocated fingers last summer).

[dannyboy35]

It's the media's fault. They pumped him up to be the leader of the team and heir to rondo before he played a single minute and the only guy they wouldn't criticise for a long time when he took a terrible shot in the offense.