Bender vs Sabonis

[ederson]

@alldaboston
OK fair enough.

I believe Pau avg 4/2 in 26 games at age 19 for Barcelona.

Prior to getting picked 3rd overall in 2001, gasol accomplished :

-In his final season in the ACB, Gasol averaged 12.4 points and 5.8 rebounds in 24.7 minutes per game.[5] Barcelona was victorious in the Spanish National Cup championship game in 2001, and Gasol was named Most Valuable Player-

Gasol  didn't come to the states until he was 21, so compare their 18/19 year stats. Pretty similar.

pau gasol was 20 years old in the year 2000.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/pau-gasol-1.html#per_game::none

in the 1999-2000 season (i believe the season he was between 19 and 20 years of age) he averaged 4.2 ppg and 2.6 rpg in 14.8 minutes per game.  (close to bender's current numbers, and bender is 18)

the following season (when he was between 20 and 21 years old -> also the age that Porzingis was when he got drafted) pau averaged 11.4 ppg and 5.2 rpg in 23.9 minutes per game.

The very small detail you left out is that Israeli league compared to league acb is like nbdl to NBA.

A smaller detail that you left out is that the international game is much tougher now than it was back 15-16 years ago when Pau played. It literally is a global game now and the talent throughout has risen exponentially.

I m not missing anything.
The Israeli league today is weaker than acb 20years ago.  The Israeli league is below even the Polish league.

[alldaboston]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

[Tr1boy]

more Sabonis highlights

vs San Francisco

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_0RMk_wJpQ

vs Portland

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7plcpi9vyY

vs Pepperdine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_0RMk_wJpQ

vs PAcific

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpiduToxKzk

vs Loyola Marymount

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqSIqO3WuAU

Dude, those teams suck.

A for effort. F for execution.

There are more and more highlights.   Sabonis rarely had a bad game last season. And he didn't face all sucky teams.   Getting to the sweet 16, you are not facing sucky teams left and right

I just want people to see for themselves if we draft Sabonis, what kind of player he is.   High IQ, High Motor,  good touch around the rim (his FG per was top 5)  and top level rebounder (top 3).

I respect his relentless pursuit of the ball.  Reminds me of how badly Tristant Thompson (even though he is only 6' wants the ball

I like Sabonis, but you putting highlight after highlight vs inferior talent doesn't change what he is and what his shortcomings are. He played in a mid major conference and simply didn't face the level of competition players in power conferences. This is the reality of it. He has the potential to be a solid rotation player, but he needs to improve his perimeter game A LOT and extend his range out to the 3pt line. He hit 5 3pt shots all season and there is a 4 foot difference between NBA 3's and college 3's.

at what clip did Bender hit the three last season?  Yeah thats right, the answer is incomplete stat

It is not Sabonis fault Gonzaga needed him to play on the inside exclusively. And why wouldn't you want that (top 5 FG percentage)

Until he starts to struggle around the post  at the nba level you still let him play there.   He will have to resort to shooting the ball more no doubt.  But it doesn't have to be 3 pt shooting.  Look at what happened with Sullinger

[Eddie20]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

Interesting. Didn't Sullinger post superior numbers in his 2 years playing in the Big Ten (elite conference) and had way more individual accolades (2x first team all-american, 2x wooden finalist, freshman of the year)?

[Tr1boy]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) ,  is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

[Eddie20]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

[Tr1boy]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

I'm seeing more 6-11 w/shoes stats for Sabonis.  Sabonis is quicker off the ground 1st/2nd jumps

you want to dispute this also?

[Eddie20]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

I'm seeing more 6-11 w/shoes stats for Sabonis.  Sabonis is quicker off the ground 1st/2nd jumps

you want to dispute this also?

You can "see" anything you want. However, that's an actual measurement taken at a camp. Everything else is just conjecture.

[rondohondo]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

I'm seeing more 6-11 w/shoes stats for Sabonis.  Sabonis is quicker off the ground 1st/2nd jumps

you want to dispute this also?

there is no way Sabonis is 6'11

[Tr1boy]

hoopshype has Bender compared to Toni Kukoc...

Bender is not your typical PF .  He is like a tall SF that can only play the PF spot at the next level

So if you have him out (as your only big guy)  don't expect him to be a vacuum and grab all the necessary rebounds.  Be able to handle the likes of Tristant Thompson, Draymond Green and be able to keep them out of the interior.

Like someone said , you are getting a "jack of all trades, master of none" type of player.   

If Bender had some special go to moves and was known as a deadly scorer (Dirk).  Hey the 76ers would take him #1 (regardless of his lack of strength). Many of those highlights on youtube was against inferior level of talent (not very strong nor explosive).  He is just using his reach to score over them.  He is driving by guys in the perimeter but has no mid range game. No floater. At the NBA level all he is going to do is run into smart defenders and get called for a charge

He will get his tip ins using length,  he will make some 3s, he will make some layups. But where are clips of him making clutch shots?  or playing against top level talent?   Or carrying his team into some type of tourney?   there aren't many if any

[Tr1boy]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

I'm seeing more 6-11 w/shoes stats for Sabonis.  Sabonis is quicker off the ground 1st/2nd jumps

you want to dispute this also?

there is no way Sabonis is 6'11

these reputable sites prove otherwise.  All list 6'11

http://www.gozags.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/domantas_sabonis_952372.html

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/players/playerpage/2152455/domantas-sabonis

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/3155942/domantas-sabonis

[Eddie20]

Many of those highlights on youtube was against inferior level of talent (not very strong nor explosive).

Careful now, you're also including Sabonis in that statement. Since he after all dominated him to the tune of 36 pts and 14 rebounds.

[Eddie20]

Triboy what will you do if Sabonis materializes into nothing in the NBA and ends up being a bust?

He won't.  Worst case he is going to be a better Sullinger. 

And if he is a bust (after 2-3 seasons at the NBA level) I will be the 1st one to admit it.    You can add Aaron Gordon and Jordan Mickey on this list

That's a [dang] good worst case. I honestly don't see it happening.

You think Sabonis who looks like is just strong as Sullinger  (give or take) , is 2-3 inches taller , quicker and more athletic,  just as good rebounding instincts ,  IQ   is going to be worst than Sullinger ?? 

likely not

Where do you gather your information? I'm curious.


Sullinger 2012 Combine
6-9 w/shoes
7-1.25 wingspan

Sabonis 2015 Nike Academy
6-10 w/shoes
6-10.5 wingpan

I'm seeing more 6-11 w/shoes stats for Sabonis.  Sabonis is quicker off the ground 1st/2nd jumps

you want to dispute this also?

there is no way Sabonis is 6'11

these reputable sites prove otherwise.  All list 6'11

http://www.gozags.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/domantas_sabonis_952372.html

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/players/playerpage/2152455/domantas-sabonis

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/3155942/domantas-sabonis

Triboy, why do you refuse to listen to anything? It would make things so much more enjoyable if you could admit that you didn't know certain things. Drawing a line in the sand does little for the sake of friendly debate . Again, the sites there mean nothing. Draft express has his actual measurement. It's not a guess. It's not an estimate. It's his exact height. 6-10 with shoes, so that'll be approximately sub 6-9 without. If you want to think he's 6-11 or 7-3 like his dad be my guest, but you're only making yourself look stubborn amongst other things.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Domantas-Sabonis-62889/

[TwinTower14]

Many of those highlights on youtube was against inferior level of talent (not very strong nor explosive).

Careful now, you're also including Sabonis in that statement. Since he after all dominated him to the tune of 36 pts and 14 rebounds.

You left out while Bender was a high school sophomore and Sabonis a college freshman. Huge difference in development there.

[Tr1boy]

Many of those highlights on youtube was against inferior level of talent (not very strong nor explosive).

Careful now, you're also including Sabonis in that statement. Since he after all dominated him to the tune of 36 pts and 14 rebounds.

you are foolish my friend.  it was 2 years ago. Do you not get the fact players (crucial stage of development)  change/develop?

Bender looks like he is in Idle mode at the moment bc  all he is doing is warming up the bench.  We have little to go by

sabonis on the other hand did all he could at the college level

I ask you again to look back at what happened with Poeltl vs Sabonis last off season (Lithuania team is not very good btw) . Poeltl had the better game.  And what happened in the round of 32 .  It is the recent or now that counts not 2 , 3 years ago

why don't you also prop up a clip of Ingram In high school (earlier days) getting beat up by 2nd round talents??     This would have little/nothing to do with what is happening today