Bender vs Sabonis

[Vermont Green]

I am not against Bender and I have no idea how he will compare to Sabonis in say 4 years.  No one knows, not even scouts and GMs.

The irony of Bender is that his greatest strength or advantage is also his biggest risk.  He is a high school senior.  That is very enticing if you take the position that he is only 18 and he will out grow all his flaws.  He is that good at 18 compared to player y at 20 so he will be even better when he is 20.

On the other hand, because he is only 18, he hasn't had the chance to prove anything as compared to say Okafor who has a year of college and a year of NBA to look at.  With Bender, it is all a projection of who he is now to what you think he will be.  Huge uncertainty there.

I don't think it is the end of the world if we take him but  I also prefer to trade either down in the draft or for a more proven player like Okafor.  Any trade has to be a good trade so the specifics matter significantly.

Sabonis?  Who knows.  Maybe we trade down to a point where it makes sense to take him.  I don't think Sabonis is going to be that big of a deal but we need more size so why not.

[Tr1boy]

Alot can happen in 2 years.

All we can go by recently is that Sabonis carried his ncaa team to the sweet sixteen, while bender got the bench warm  for his

[number_n9ne]

These two have often been talked about and compared vs each other. However, it looks like they have met before and Bender completely dominated the matchup. This was July 2014, so Bender was 16 and Sabonis 18.


Bender     vs      Sabonis

Minutes  29 - 26
Pts         34 - 2
Reb        14 - 11
Ast         2 - 1
Stl          2 - 1
Blk         2 - 2
FG         10/14 - 1/8
FT          5/7 - 0/0
3PT        3/5  -  0/1
TO's         0 - 1

Full game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T111y-x5Wm8

Box Score
http://www.fibaeurope.com/compID_8aYeHlfuGF-mF5IqO8aFH1.season_2014.roundID_10067.gameID_10069-B-4-2.html

The triboy damage control is so real...

Thank you for this, laughed so hard.

[hpantazo]

Alot can happen in 2 years.

All we can go by recently is that Sabonis carried his ncaa team to the sweet sixteen, while bender got the bench warm  for his

Really? What was the NCAA team that Bender warmed the bench for?

[hwangjini_1]

Sabonis flashing his rebounding skills. Very quality rebounder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fk5kHLiN9U

Still pounding your Binky ? 

Honestly, if sabonis had dominated bender we would never hear the end of it from you.

[TwinTower14]

Alot can happen in 2 years.

All we can go by recently is that Sabonis carried his ncaa team to the sweet sixteen, while bender got the bench warm  for his

He played for pro team, with access to pro coaches, pro trainers and practice against other pros everyday. So I guess he hasn't gotten any better.

The more I watch Bender I see a ceiling of Pau...

[HomerSapien]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

[Eddie20]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

That's because a certain someone (hint: he posts a lot of youtube highlight videos) thinks we should take Sabonis at 3 and that Sabonis is the better prospect.

[Celtics4ever]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

We call this a rationalization where I work .

Rationalisation happens in two steps:

A decision, action, judgement is made for a given reason, or no (known) reason at all.
A rationalisation is performed, constructing a seemingly good or logical reason, as an attempt to justify the act after the fact (for oneself or others).

His stats are not due to politics, keep telling yourself that.   When has Nike ever tried to suppress a player?   Never.   They want them to play so they can sell shoes.   

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

I kind of hope we work out these two the same day.   It would settle much of the debate.   Guys who jump 27" are special in that they are trying to play an athletes sport when they are not.   Lateral movement is great, but he is so weak and can't jump that he will not be able to do much with it.   Porzingas is a way better athlete.  He also did not hide and why is Bender hiding from the  combine tests?

BECAUSE IT WOULD HURT HIS STOCK.

[hpantazo]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

We call this a rationalization where I work .

Rationalisation happens in two steps:

A decision, action, judgement is made for a given reason, or no (known) reason at all.
A rationalisation is performed, constructing a seemingly good or logical reason, as an attempt to justify the act after the fact (for oneself or others).

His stats are not due to politics, keep telling yourself that.   When has Nike ever tried to suppress a player?   Never.   They want them to play so they can sell shoes.   

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

I kind of hope we work out these two the same day.   It would settle much of the debate.   Guys who jump 27" are special in that they are trying to play an athletes sport when they are not.   Lateral movement is great, but he is so weak and can't jump that he will not be able to do much with it.   Porzingas is a way better athlete.  He also did not hide and why is Bender hiding from the  combine tests?

BECAUSE IT WOULD HURT HIS STOCK.

A very misleading, BIASED accusation/summary. Bender was not 'hiding' from anything, as others have stated several times, his pro team is still playing, he is under contract to play for them and their season is not over, therefore he cannot attend the combine. That alone takes all credibility out of your remaining comments.

[Eddie20]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

We call this a rationalization where I work .

Rationalisation happens in two steps:

A decision, action, judgement is made for a given reason, or no (known) reason at all.
A rationalisation is performed, constructing a seemingly good or logical reason, as an attempt to justify the act after the fact (for oneself or others).

His stats are not due to politics, keep telling yourself that.   When has Nike ever tried to suppress a player?   Never.   They want them to play so they can sell shoes.   

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

I kind of hope we work out these two the same day.   It would settle much of the debate.   Guys who jump 27" are special in that they are trying to play an athletes sport when they are not.   Lateral movement is great, but he is so weak and can't jump that he will not be able to do much with it.   Porzingas is a way better athlete.  He also did not hide and why is Bender hiding from the  combine tests?

BECAUSE IT WOULD HURT HIS STOCK.

A very misleading, BIASED accusation/summary. Bender was not 'hiding' from anything, as others have stated several times, his pro team is still playing, he is under contract to play for them and their season is not over, therefore he cannot attend the combine. That alone takes all credibility out of your remaining comments.

Exactly. If anything it was Sabonis who was hiding from subpar testing at the combine since he skipped it without cause.

[hwangjini_1]

It's really too bad that Bender wasn't able to play for Croatia last summer at Eurobasket.  Prior to that tourney, every International competition, basketball camp, etc. where he played against older peers he excelled and appeared to have a massive upward trajectory.  But unfortunately, because of Adidas vs. Nike politics and limited playing time on his new pro team we have very limited film on him from the last year.

We call this a rationalization where I work .

Rationalisation happens in two steps:

A decision, action, judgement is made for a given reason, or no (known) reason at all.
A rationalisation is performed, constructing a seemingly good or logical reason, as an attempt to justify the act after the fact (for oneself or others).

His stats are not due to politics, keep telling yourself that.   When has Nike ever tried to suppress a player?   Never.   They want them to play so they can sell shoes.   

For me Sabonis seems to top out at fringe NBA starter.  Bender, on the other hand, because of his unique physical profile (size combined with agile movement) seems like he could be something special if the cards are played right.  For that reason, I'd be willing to risk him being a total bust and draft him at #3.

I also don't quite know why these two are being compared to each other since they fall at significantly different parts of the draft.  The Celtics could easily select both if they wanted.

I kind of hope we work out these two the same day.   It would settle much of the debate.   Guys who jump 27" are special in that they are trying to play an athletes sport when they are not.   Lateral movement is great, but he is so weak and can't jump that he will not be able to do much with it.   Porzingas is a way better athlete.  He also did not hide and why is Bender hiding from the  combine tests?

BECAUSE IT WOULD HURT HIS STOCK.

Right now in an airport and heading to China so I won't check but I believe cousins' vertical was 25".  Just wanted to throw that out there. Dirks was none to impressive either if I remember correctly.

[max215]

TP, Eddie, this is fantastic.

[TwinTower14]

The crazy part is that Bender is 16 in this video. Basically a sophomore in high school beating up on a kid that is heading into college.

[Tr1boy]

Sabonis flashing his rebounding skills. Very quality rebounder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fk5kHLiN9U

Still pounding your Binky ? 

Honestly, if sabonis had dominated bender we would never hear the end of it from you.

I don't dig up stuff from 2-3 years ago.  Alot can change

Poeltl apparently took it to Sabonis last time they met at international play.   Yet recently(2 months ago)Sabonis torched Poeltl . 

Personally I was not a fan of Sabonis after his 1st season or anything.  He shot fts at 66 percent from the ft line, hesitant to even shoot the mid range.   His post moves were very mechanical.   He was a mobile 6'10 of that worked hard.   Nothing stood out. His stats especially

But this past season, he couldn't be ignored.   His shooting noticeably improved.  Even shooting 3s at 36 percent.  He touched up on his post play (dad prob hammered him).  He was stronger, quicker .  Looked much more confident .   Yes his ceiling is not high, but he reached it (rebounding), post play (I think a good part of it will translate at the next level) and he will improve his shooting even further (bc indication is he gets better).