Felger and Mazz today

[dannyboy35]

I can't believe I'm saying it but it's been like therapy after this season. I've been whining all season that We aren't building a title this way. They're building a Hawks team who have no chance at a title.
   But what I've been crying about all season is why do we play a single player all these minutes that has little to no trade value? Sully, zeller, Jerebko , Lee when he was here. It was the same thing last year when turner was the pg and smart is sporting up in the corner. We came into this season STILL not sure as we should be if smart will be capable to effective as s point guard.
   Brad Stevens is not about developing players. We needed injuries to get Rozier on the court and oh what do you know the guy looks like an asset. I think Stevens should be blasted for Lee and Sullingef especially. What's the point in playing these guys while guys we HOPE and at least have a CHANCE at becoming a trade able asset rot on the bench? Olynyk while maybe soft would be a more attractive asset on a package with better numbers. He SHOULD top out as a valuable 1st big off the bench on a CONTENDING team. Smart, Olynyk, Rozier are all guys that should currently have more value if they were played more and in Smart's case , handling the ball more. He wasn't going to get that opportunity even if THomas never came. Stevens is too much into winning immediately and nothing about developing. Earn minutes some people say? Sully by being fat most certainly got minutes he never deserved and has no trade value.

[droopdog7]

This is about as whiny as it gets.  The coaches job, first and foremost, is to win games.  He also needs to have the respect of the team.  Playing worse players over better ones is not a way to garner that respect.

In terms of trade value, your observations are extremely shortsighted.  You're not going to manipulate a guys trade value like a stock.  Other teams are not stupid.  They have a good idea about a player whether he plays much or not.

[jbp126]

This is about as whiny as it gets.  The coaches job, first and foremost, is to win games.  He also needs to have the respect of the team.  Playing worse players over better ones is not a way to garner that respect.

In terms of trade value, your observations are extremely shortsighted.  You're not going to manipulate a guys trade value like a stock.  Other teams are not stupid.  They have a good idea about a player whether he plays much or not.

I think the OP was paraphrasing what sounds like a Mazz rant. Other than that, I pretty much agree with you. Par for the course for Felger and Mazz. They don't usually talk NBA or pretend to know what they're talking about but when they do their opinions are generally unfavorable and reflect what the league was like in the early '00s.

[PhoSita]

Felger and Mazz have no clue what they're talking about when it comes to the Celtics and the NBA, especially building a team into a contender.

They don't care to get a clue, either, which is even worse.


They want the Celts to do nothing but tank so they can make fun of them and their "Green Teamer" fans.  If the team isn't tanking, they should be contending for a title because clearly there are no steps in between those two states.

Of course, if the team is contending, F&M will rant endlessly about how they're not as good as Celts teams past, or they'll say the team plays the wrong way, has a bad attitude, or whatever.

These guys are thoroughly anti-NBA because it serves them to be so.



Dan Shaughnessy posted an article today asking if fans are really satisfied with what Stevens has done so far, given that "three years in" the team is still not contending.

Utter hackery.  Hot-takes masquerading as a professional analysis.  And they know this is what will get them the most attention in Boston because nobody in mainstream media is providing any counterpoint, and there's little demand for anybody to do it.

It plays great to people who don't actually watch the team or pay attention to it.  The sort of people who loved the team in its 70s and 80s heyday but lost interest in the 90s, and were dismayed by the culture of the team with Pierce and Toine in the early 2000s.  The sort of people who tuned in to watch during some of the KG era, but tuned out before Pierce and KG were even traded.  The sort of people susceptible to the idea that "This team used to be about championships!" and now, obviously, it's all gone downhill.  Only the "endlessly optimistic Celtics fanbase," wherever they may dwell outside the domain of mainstream Boston media, see good things happening for this team.

Until of course they're contending again.  Then it's time to pick them apart for not doing it the right way.

[dannyboy35]

I just think smart should have taken his lumps in his rookie year at point. I totally am not a tanker . I want the team to bust their tails every game but Did anyone really believe Sully had s future here? I never thought that. I don't mean just to bump up Olynyk's stats. I mean I think he would produce those if played and didn't get enough minutes. I just think you need the minutes in games to develop. Maybe the main fault falls on Danny with this. I find it hard to believe Danny was happy with Sully starting all year. I don't think a player gains respect for the coach regarding Sully. I think if anything it's the opposite. He was our only player not ready yet again and awarded him the starting job.
 I think Stevens is a good in game coach and I'm not looking to ARGUE these points . But I do feel strongly about these opinions. I realize how much people love Stevens here and I think he's quality. But I think people generally have too high opinion on his impact that he can have.
  What I mean is nobody mentioned Ubuntu until the Allen, kg etc additions.
Having a good coach is great but it's the players that bring a winning culture 1st. Not the players.
 I'm not putting words in people's mouths here. I unfortunately don't have time to read all the posts ( wish I could there are great ones and I'm s die hard. I don't really care about any other Boston team. Just the Celtics. But in and outside my work and on the radio and tv  I keep hearing Brad is the Celtics best asset and I just completely disagree. But just my strong opinion and I know I'm on an island on this one.
Regardless, crossing my fingers for some luck on May 17.

[droopdog7]

This is about as whiny as it gets.  The coaches job, first and foremost, is to win games.  He also needs to have the respect of the team.  Playing worse players over better ones is not a way to garner that respect.

In terms of trade value, your observations are extremely shortsighted.  You're not going to manipulate a guys trade value like a stock.  Other teams are not stupid.  They have a good idea about a player whether he plays much or not.

I think the OP was paraphrasing what sounds like a Mazz rant. Other than that, I pretty much agree with you. Par for the course for Felger and Mazz. They don't usually talk NBA or pretend to know what they're talking about but when they do their opinions are generally unfavorable and reflect what the league was like in the early '00s.

Ah, thanks for the correction.  I missed it.

[Csfan1984]

DA kind of mentioned player development and his own/team expectations. He clearly believes it 3 headed issues. Talent evaluation, Coaching and the Player at fault. Cs didn't do a good job of it this year. Portis or RHJ probably should have been the teams 1st pick. Time will tell if the players and coaches can turn it around.

[loco_91]

F&M are the Sarah Palin of sports commentary.

[dannyboy35]

Typo I had there. I think winning culture from the players not starting with the coach. Looked like I contradicted myself there. Also I should have titled this thread " I can't believe I'm agreeing with Felger and mazz" because I whole heartedly agree with the criticism against them and really can't stand them. Good point made by saying it's worse that they don't even care to know about the game. I rant all the time to my friends about that very point. They don't care to know about the game and even worse there absolutely PROUD of it. Nobody HAS to like nba basketball but when it's one of the four major sports you should probably know something about it. I'm willing to bet they can't even name all the divisions in the nba. Just pathetic.

[dannyboy35]

Even though doesn't sound like we agree it's so awesome to have this site. I have only 1 maybe 2 friends out of my 10 core buddies who are Celtics fans first. I started watching in 1984 as a little kid. What timing, huh? I was mesmerised. Max was my favorite because of his finals performance and he just cracked me up how he tried to get in guy's heads. Bird could never be my favorite because the dude was an alien. Lol. Too amazing to try and mimic except for his effort.
 Long winded . Sorry but I have so much Celtic talk bottled up and it's awesome to find other die hards. My other friends support the team but really just cuz it's the local team and not emotionally involved.

[Greyman]

Felger and Mazz have no clue what they're talking about when it comes to the Celtics and the NBA, especially building a team into a contender.

They don't care to get a clue, either, which is even worse.


They want the Celts to do nothing but tank so they can make fun of them and their "Green Teamer" fans.  If the team isn't tanking, they should be contending for a title because clearly there are no steps in between those two states.

Of course, if the team is contending, F&M will rant endlessly about how they're not as good as Celts teams past, or they'll say the team plays the wrong way, has a bad attitude, or whatever.

These guys are thoroughly anti-NBA because it serves them to be so.



Dan Shaughnessy posted an article today asking if fans are really satisfied with what Stevens has done so far, given that "three years in" the team is still not contending.

Utter hackery.  Hot-takes masquerading as a professional analysis.  And they know this is what will get them the most attention in Boston because nobody in mainstream media is providing any counterpoint, and there's little demand for anybody to do it.

It plays great to people who don't actually watch the team or pay attention to it.  The sort of people who loved the team in its 70s and 80s heyday but lost interest in the 90s, and were dismayed by the culture of the team with Pierce and Toine in the early 2000s.  The sort of people who tuned in to watch during some of the KG era, but tuned out before Pierce and KG were even traded.  The sort of people susceptible to the idea that "This team used to be about championships!" and now, obviously, it's all gone downhill.  Only the "endlessly optimistic Celtics fanbase," wherever they may dwell outside the domain of mainstream Boston media, see good things happening for this team.

Until of course they're contending again.  Then it's time to pick them apart for not doing it the right way.

TP here and will add Stevens has done a great job preparing the team to win while giving younger players opportunity. Rozier did a bit in the playoffs but he didn't show enough to suggest he was ready to get more minutes from the players ahead of him.