Author Topic: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden  (Read 13288 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2016, 04:23:33 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11192
  • Tommy Points: 858
Other than the beard, I don't know what is not to like about Harden.  Seems like just what we need; anchor scorer who will demand defensive attention and open things up for other players.  26 years old, on a good contract.  I think we can make up for his defense assuming he plays with Smart, Crowder, Sullinger, and maybe Mickey or Zeller?

I am not holding my breath but boy, I would love this.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2016, 05:40:15 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

  • NCE
  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11833
  • Tommy Points: 950
I think Brad Stevens is willing to cut the playing time of a player like Harden if he doesn't try hard on defense.  If there is a trade, would Harden change his ways or will he get benched or will Stevens get fired for not playing Harden enough?
"The worst thing that ever happened in sports was sports radio, and the internet is sports radio on steroids with lower IQs.” -- Brian Burke, former Toronto Maple Leafs senior adviser, at the 2013 MIT Sloan Sports Analytics Conference

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2016, 11:13:51 PM »

Offline mgent

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7567
  • Tommy Points: 1962
Am I the only one that threw up a little reading this trade suggestion?

No, lol.

That said, he's probably the 3rd best point forward at this point behind LeBron and Green.  If only he could stop being non-existent on defense and become less streaky/more efficient on offense.

Harden is not a forward.

Psh, whatever.

Learn the NBA and then re-read my statement.
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2016, 12:11:13 AM »

Offline chilidawg

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2009
  • Tommy Points: 261
Other than the beard, I don't know what is not to like about Harden.  Seems like just what we need; anchor scorer who will demand defensive attention and open things up for other players.  26 years old, on a good contract.  I think we can make up for his defense assuming he plays with Smart, Crowder, Sullinger, and maybe Mickey or Zeller?

I am not holding my breath but boy, I would love this.

I've never been a fan.  I do like the beard though.

Poor defender, high usage, low efficiency.


Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2016, 12:17:51 AM »

Offline Denis998

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3308
  • Tommy Points: 388
  • Rutgers '17
Im saying 3 more days unti we start to hear steph curry rumors

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2016, 12:20:13 AM »

Offline Denis998

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3308
  • Tommy Points: 388
  • Rutgers '17
Am I the only one that threw up a little reading this trade suggestion?

No, lol.

That said, he's probably the 3rd best point forward at this point behind LeBron and Green.  If only he could stop being non-existent on defense and become less streaky/more efficient on offense.

Harden is not a forward.

Psh, whatever.

Learn the NBA and then re-read my statement.
Harden is a shooting guard, not a small forward, and therefore can not be a point forward. If anything, he is a combo guard.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2016, 01:54:54 AM »

Offline aingeforthree

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2013
  • Tommy Points: 134
Other than the beard, I don't know what is not to like about Harden.  Seems like just what we need; anchor scorer who will demand defensive attention and open things up for other players.  26 years old, on a good contract.  I think we can make up for his defense assuming he plays with Smart, Crowder, Sullinger, and maybe Mickey or Zeller?

I am not holding my breath but boy, I would love this.

I've never been a fan.  I do like the beard though.

Poor defender, high usage, low efficiency.

Throw that out the window. Like he's doing with Turner, Stevens will fit Harden into the system and turn him into a far more efficient player. That's the truth.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2016, 02:03:18 AM »

Offline colincb

  • NCE
  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5095
  • Tommy Points: 501
Pelton, the stats guru from ESPN says Harden is the problem in HOU, especially his defense:

The Rockets should trade Harden.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/rockets-trade-harden-trades-work/story?id=36881518

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2016, 02:15:12 AM »

Offline colincb

  • NCE
  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5095
  • Tommy Points: 501
Doubt Harden's on the block because his contract is relatively favorable, but his production isn't leaps and bounds better than IT.

http://bkref.com/tiny/iSGvM

The advanced stats for Harden are going to be out of whack with reality on the defensive side with DH12 behind him. If you read the article I posted above, then you'd see Harden's a big problem defensively for HOU this year and has been for most of his career.  Otherwise, Harden's biggest advantage over IT is getting to the FT line at an incredibly high rate. It's tough for me to understand the disparity in foul calls between him and IT, but it does exist. However, giving up IT and a couple of BKN firsts for that is a massive overpay.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2016, 02:19:10 AM »

Offline aingeforthree

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2013
  • Tommy Points: 134
Doubt Harden's on the block because his contract is relatively favorable, but his production isn't leaps and bounds better than IT.

http://bkref.com/tiny/iSGvM

The advanced stats for Harden are going to be out of whack with reality on the defensive side with DH12 behind him. If you read the article I posted above, then you'd see Harden's a big problem defensively for HOU this year and has been for most of his career.  Otherwise, Harden's biggest advantage over IT is getting to the FT line at an incredibly high rate. It's tough for me to understand the disparity in foul calls between him and IT, but it does exist. However, giving up IT and a couple of BKN firsts for that is a massive overpay.

I find it hard including IT4 in any deal, & it's just based on how long Ainge was chasing 'his guy'. Ainge really wanted this player & finally got him. Now, Harden's a legit talent so who knows if Ainge would trade IT in this situation. I would think he'd include an extra Brooklyn pick in exchange for keeping IT4 here.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2016, 02:55:28 AM »

Offline chambers

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7482
  • Tommy Points: 943
  • Boston Celtics= Championships, nothing less.
Never happening  in a million years unfortunately
"We are lucky we have a very patient GM that isn't willing to settle for being good and coming close. He wants to win a championship and we have the potential to get there still with our roster and assets."

quoting 'Greg B' on RealGM after 2017 trade deadline.
Read that last line again. One more time.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2016, 02:59:27 AM »

Offline Ilikesports17

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8595
  • Tommy Points: 842
The proposed deal would be hard to turn down.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2016, 12:11:56 PM »

Offline mgent

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7567
  • Tommy Points: 1962
Am I the only one that threw up a little reading this trade suggestion?

No, lol.

That said, he's probably the 3rd best point forward at this point behind LeBron and Green.  If only he could stop being non-existent on defense and become less streaky/more efficient on offense.

Harden is not a forward.

Psh, whatever.

Learn the NBA and then re-read my statement.
Harden is a shooting guard, not a small forward, and therefore can not be a point forward. If anything, he is a combo guard.

You guys are ignoring the purpose/point of my post, and nitpicking semantics that have nothing to do with it (aka wasting both of our time).

He's listed at the same height at Oscar Robertson.  Look at him.  He's not just long, he's heavy.  He's listed at 4 pounds less than Lamar Odom (no reason for that comparison, it's just what showed up on Google when I looked up Harden's weight).  He's listed at 16 pounds more than Ariza who's currently playing SF for the Rockets.

I'd assume most people who know the NBA would classify him as a swingman.  Who wouldn't put him in the same category as Evan Turner?

A combo guard is like Bradley, Bayless, Terry, Eric Bledsoe, Monta Ellis, Lou Williams....

Turner has been a SG for the Celtics these past 2 years according the basketball-reference.  Would you guys be trying to correct me if I referred to Turner as a point forward (which many do)?

I understand if you guys just feel the need to disagree with someone and try to prove them wrong, but you're extremely grasping here.
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2016, 12:20:42 PM »

Offline mgent

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7567
  • Tommy Points: 1962
And for the record, any time 2 of Beverly, Lawson, Thornton, or Terry is on the court with Harden (which is not exactly infrequent) he's obviously a forward.
Philly:

Anderson Varejao    Tiago Splitter    Matt Bonner
David West    Kenyon Martin    Brad Miller
Andre Iguodala    Josh Childress    Marquis Daniels
Dwyane Wade    Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich    Toney Douglas   + the legendary Kevin McHale

Re: Forget Horford or Howard...It's Harden
« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2016, 12:27:44 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8825
  • Tommy Points: 289
Am I the only one that threw up a little reading this trade suggestion?

No, lol.

That said, he's probably the 3rd best point forward at this point behind LeBron and Green.  If only he could stop being non-existent on defense and become less streaky/more efficient on offense.

Harden is not a forward.

Psh, whatever.

Learn the NBA and then re-read my statement.
Harden is a shooting guard, not a small forward, and therefore can not be a point forward. If anything, he is a combo guard.

You guys are ignoring the purpose/point of my post, and nitpicking semantics that have nothing to do with it (aka wasting both of our time).

He's listed at the same height at Oscar Robertson.  Look at him.  He's not just long, he's heavy.  He's listed at 4 pounds less than Lamar Odom (no reason for that comparison, it's just what showed up on Google when I looked up Harden's weight).  He's listed at 16 pounds more than Ariza who's currently playing SF for the Rockets.

I'd assume most people who know the NBA would classify him as a swingman.  Who wouldn't put him in the same category as Evan Turner?

A combo guard is like Bradley, Bayless, Terry, Eric Bledsoe, Monta Ellis, Lou Williams....

Turner has been a SG for the Celtics these past 2 years according the basketball-reference.  Would you guys be trying to correct me if I referred to Turner as a point forward (which many do)?

I understand if you guys just feel the need to disagree with someone and try to prove them wrong, but you're extremely grasping here.
Edit
Guys are just busting you on point foward its not a big thing. OP slotted him at SF because said trading with Smart and Crowder. He is also currently a SG for Rockets. So combo guard is what he would be by definition for either team till trade. Not a point foward. It's a lost cause to argue it. It's okay to say, yes combo guard. It's all the same thing anyways. A non- PG ball handler and distributor.

Edit: let's just call him swingman
« Last Edit: February 12, 2016, 12:40:35 PM by Csfan1984 »