30 years from now Patriots Hall of Fame will be better than actual hall of fame.

[Moranis]

The only chance the field would have would be to blitz. The best Patriots tackles....Bruce Armstrong...Solder...Matt Light....they'd have a tough time in this game.

I think it could force the Pats to be more up the middle sending Curtis Martin behind John Hannah and keeping a guy back.

Personally I think keeping extra blockers in and give Tom time to find Troy, Julian, Gronk, and Randy....good luck with that

I would also make the game slightly more fair by saying if the Pats get a prime player the field can't have him. Like the Pats get prime Curtis Martin and prime Randy Moss. So the field doesn't get him. But the field gets Junior Seau not us.

Can the Pats stop an offense featuring, say, Joe Montana throwing to Jerry Rice, Antonio Brown, Calvin Johnson and Tony Gonzalez, and handing off to Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders and Walter Payton?

of course not, especially when the OL is guys like Anthony Munoz, Bruce Matthews, Mike Webster, Gene Upshaw, and Forrest Gregg (with guys like Larry Allen, Jonathon Ogden, Walter Jones, etc. on the bench).

[KGs Knee]

And when LT breaks Brady's leg on the first play of the game, then what?

[Dino Pitino]

"Frankly, I think you could argue a team like Steelers, Cowboys, or Niners would have a better team than the Patriots anyway."

You sure about that?

[Eja117]

And when LT breaks Brady's leg on the first play of the game, then what?

Coach Belichick will have a plan for that. I'm assuming Bledsoe with a bunch of Edelman and Doug Flutie trick plays

[Eja117]

The only chance the field would have would be to blitz. The best Patriots tackles....Bruce Armstrong...Solder...Matt Light....they'd have a tough time in this game.

I think it could force the Pats to be more up the middle sending Curtis Martin behind John Hannah and keeping a guy back.

Personally I think keeping extra blockers in and give Tom time to find Troy, Julian, Gronk, and Randy....good luck with that

I would also make the game slightly more fair by saying if the Pats get a prime player the field can't have him. Like the Pats get prime Curtis Martin and prime Randy Moss. So the field doesn't get him. But the field gets Junior Seau not us.

Can the Pats stop an offense featuring, say, Joe Montana (or Steve Young or Peyton Manning) throwing to Jerry Rice, Antonio Brown, Calvin Johnson and Tony Gonzalez, and handing off to Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders and Walter Payton?

But we saaaawww this. We saaawww this many times.

We saw big baaaaaaddd Peyton Manning handing off to a Pro Bowl RB, and throwing to multiple Pro Bowl recievers, a Pro Bowl TE, and being protected by a Pro Bowl center and left tackle.  And even a Pro Bowl kicker.

We saw the Patriots play against Marshal Faulk (how'd that go?) with some greatest show on turf stuff. With Kurt Warner and Isaac Bruce and Orlando Pace and Aenaes Williams and another Pro Bowl guard and another Pro Bowl WR.  Brady beat them throwing to Jr Redmond and Jermaine Wiggins. He's not throwing to Wiggins this time. This time it's Gronk

We saaaawww them play the big vaunted Ravens defenses with Ray Lewis and Ed Reed and whoever they had.

I get that the All time team gets to upgrade from Marshall Faulk to Barry Sanders. But this time we don't have to chase him with Bryan Cox. We chase him with Andre Tippet.

We saaaawww our receivers play against Richard Sherman. Whoever it was we saw it. Whoever the du jour player was we saw it.  This time Strahan wouldn't be going up against Matt Light. 

And who is coaching this All Time Team? Shula?

Does it come down to special teams? Because we got the best kicker. 

I'd like to see Montana complete a pass to Jerry Rice after getting smacked in the mouth by a Lawyer Milloy safety blitz.

Have fun going over the middle MegaTron. I got a Rodney Harrison and a Brushci waiting for you.

Yes the Pats would be underdogs. Just like they were all those other times.

[Moranis]

The only chance the field would have would be to blitz. The best Patriots tackles....Bruce Armstrong...Solder...Matt Light....they'd have a tough time in this game.

I think it could force the Pats to be more up the middle sending Curtis Martin behind John Hannah and keeping a guy back.

Personally I think keeping extra blockers in and give Tom time to find Troy, Julian, Gronk, and Randy....good luck with that

I would also make the game slightly more fair by saying if the Pats get a prime player the field can't have him. Like the Pats get prime Curtis Martin and prime Randy Moss. So the field doesn't get him. But the field gets Junior Seau not us.

Can the Pats stop an offense featuring, say, Joe Montana (or Steve Young or Peyton Manning) throwing to Jerry Rice, Antonio Brown, Calvin Johnson and Tony Gonzalez, and handing off to Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders and Walter Payton?

But we saaaawww this. We saaawww this many times.

We saw big baaaaaaddd Peyton Manning handing off to a Pro Bowl RB, and throwing to multiple Pro Bowl recievers, a Pro Bowl TE, and being protected by a Pro Bowl center and left tackle.  And even a Pro Bowl kicker.

We saw the Patriots play against Marshal Faulk (how'd that go?) with some greatest show on turf stuff. With Kurt Warner and Isaac Bruce and Orlando Pace and Aenaes Williams and another Pro Bowl guard and another Pro Bowl WR.  Brady beat them throwing to Jr Redmond and Jermaine Wiggins. He's not throwing to Wiggins this time. This time it's Gronk

We saaaawww them play the big vaunted Ravens defenses with Ray Lewis and Ed Reed and whoever they had.

I get that the All time team gets to upgrade from Marshall Faulk to Barry Sanders. But this time we don't have to chase him with Bryan Cox. We chase him with Andre Tippet.

We saaaawww our receivers play against Richard Sherman. Whoever it was we saw it. Whoever the du jour player was we saw it.  This time Strahan wouldn't be going up against Matt Light. 

And who is coaching this All Time Team? Shula?

Does it come down to special teams? Because we got the best kicker. 

I'd like to see Montana complete a pass to Jerry Rice after getting smacked in the mouth by a Lawyer Milloy safety blitz.

Have fun going over the middle MegaTron. I got a Rodney Harrison and a Brushci waiting for you.

Yes the Pats would be underdogs. Just like they were all those other times.

Joe Flacco is 2-2 against the Patriots in the playoffs.  All 4 games were in New England.  And Joe Flacco was probably the best player (outside of Ogden) on the Ravens offense in those games.  And those Ravens defenses are no where near as strong as the 2000 defense or the other historically great defenses (like the 85 Bears, etc.). 

I mean for context, the 2000 Ravens played 4 playoff games.  They gave up 23 points combined.  Two of those offenses were top 3 offenses in the league that year.  In the course of the 20 games they played, they had 4 shut outs, and held another 11 opponents to 10 or less points.  The other 5 scores were 36 (W), 19 (L), 14 (L), 23 (W), 20 (W).  This is a team that went 5 consecutive games without an offensive TD and yet won 2 of them.  You put guys like Lawrence Taylor on that team and you make that defense even better.  Then you give them the greatest offense the world has ever seen and that team is unstoppable. 

There is no franchise in NFL history that can compete with the best of the best from league history. 

[Moranis]

"Frankly, I think you could argue a team like Steelers, Cowboys, or Niners would have a better team than the Patriots anyway."

You sure about that?

Yep.  Pretty confident in that statement. 

[Dino Pitino]

"Frankly, I think you could argue a team like Steelers, Cowboys, or Niners would have a better team than the Patriots anyway."

You sure about that?

Yep.  Pretty confident in that statement.

Test it, then. Choose one and compare it to the Pats.

[Dino Pitino]

This is what other teams have to beat:

How close is this to the truth: The all-time single-season Pats have the GOAT quarterback, two top 25 running backs, the 2nd GOAT wide receiver, the GOAT slot receiver, another top 50 wide receiver, the GOAT tight end, another top 25 tight end, a top 5-10 offensive line as a whole, a top 25 defensive lineman, a top 5 nose tackle, a top 10 middle linebacker, a top 10 outside linebacker, a top 10 cornerback, another top 10 cornerback, another top 25 cornerback, a top 10 strong safety, a top 5 kicker, the GOAT coach. What franchises can match or exceed that?

[Dino Pitino]

QB - Tom Brady '07
HB - Corey Dillon '04
HB - Curtis Martin '95
FB - Jim Nance '66
WR - Randy Moss '07
WR - Wes Welker '11
WR - Stanley Morgan '79
WR - Terry Glenn '96
WR - Troy Brown '01
TE - Rob Gronkowski '11
TE - Ben Coates '94
TE - Russ Francis '78

G - John Hannah '80
G - Logan Mankins '10
G - Brian Waters '11
C - Jon Morris '66
T - Bruce Armstrong '96
T - Matt Light '07
T - Leon Gray '78
T - Brian Holloway '85

LB - Nick Buoniconti '66
LB - Andre Tippett '85
LB - Jerod Mayo '10
LB - Steve Nelson '80
LB - Tom Addison '61
DE - Richard Seymour '04
DE - Larry Eisenhauer '63
DE - Willie McGinest '96
DT - Houston Antwine '63
DT - Vince Wilfork '12

CB - Darrelle Revis '14
CB - Mike Haynes '76
CB - Ty Law '03
CB - Raymond Clayborn '85
S - Rodney Harrison '03
S - Lawyer Milloy '99

K - Adam Vinatieri '01
(or Stephen Gostowski '15?)
P - Rich Camarillo '83
PR - Irving Fryar '85
KR - Dave Meggett '96
Gunner - Matthew Slater '14
Miscellaneous - Gino Cappelletti '64

I'm sure there's a better version of that. I'm not a huge football fan. But still, that looks like the makings of a nearly-unbeatable all-time single-season team.

[Eja117]

The only chance the field would have would be to blitz. The best Patriots tackles....Bruce Armstrong...Solder...Matt Light....they'd have a tough time in this game.

I think it could force the Pats to be more up the middle sending Curtis Martin behind John Hannah and keeping a guy back.

Personally I think keeping extra blockers in and give Tom time to find Troy, Julian, Gronk, and Randy....good luck with that

I would also make the game slightly more fair by saying if the Pats get a prime player the field can't have him. Like the Pats get prime Curtis Martin and prime Randy Moss. So the field doesn't get him. But the field gets Junior Seau not us.

Can the Pats stop an offense featuring, say, Joe Montana (or Steve Young or Peyton Manning) throwing to Jerry Rice, Antonio Brown, Calvin Johnson and Tony Gonzalez, and handing off to Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders and Walter Payton?

But we saaaawww this. We saaawww this many times.

We saw big baaaaaaddd Peyton Manning handing off to a Pro Bowl RB, and throwing to multiple Pro Bowl recievers, a Pro Bowl TE, and being protected by a Pro Bowl center and left tackle.  And even a Pro Bowl kicker.

We saw the Patriots play against Marshal Faulk (how'd that go?) with some greatest show on turf stuff. With Kurt Warner and Isaac Bruce and Orlando Pace and Aenaes Williams and another Pro Bowl guard and another Pro Bowl WR.  Brady beat them throwing to Jr Redmond and Jermaine Wiggins. He's not throwing to Wiggins this time. This time it's Gronk

We saaaawww them play the big vaunted Ravens defenses with Ray Lewis and Ed Reed and whoever they had.

I get that the All time team gets to upgrade from Marshall Faulk to Barry Sanders. But this time we don't have to chase him with Bryan Cox. We chase him with Andre Tippet.

We saaaawww our receivers play against Richard Sherman. Whoever it was we saw it. Whoever the du jour player was we saw it.  This time Strahan wouldn't be going up against Matt Light. 

And who is coaching this All Time Team? Shula?

Does it come down to special teams? Because we got the best kicker. 

I'd like to see Montana complete a pass to Jerry Rice after getting smacked in the mouth by a Lawyer Milloy safety blitz.

Have fun going over the middle MegaTron. I got a Rodney Harrison and a Brushci waiting for you.

Yes the Pats would be underdogs. Just like they were all those other times.

Joe Flacco is 2-2 against the Patriots in the playoffs.  All 4 games were in New England.  And Joe Flacco was probably the best player (outside of Ogden) on the Ravens offense in those games.  And those Ravens defenses are no where near as strong as the 2000 defense or the other historically great defenses (like the 85 Bears, etc.). 

I mean for context, the 2000 Ravens played 4 playoff games.  They gave up 23 points combined.  Two of those offenses were top 3 offenses in the league that year.  In the course of the 20 games they played, they had 4 shut outs, and held another 11 opponents to 10 or less points.  The other 5 scores were 36 (W), 19 (L), 14 (L), 23 (W), 20 (W).  This is a team that went 5 consecutive games without an offensive TD and yet won 2 of them.  You put guys like Lawrence Taylor on that team and you make that defense even better.  Then you give them the greatest offense the world has ever seen and that team is unstoppable. 

There is no franchise in NFL history that can compete with the best of the best from league history.

Oh I grant you a Brady/Belichick led all time Pats team would definitely be a 3.5 point underdog at home in this scenario.

Then they'd win

[Eja117]

Have you ever noticed how all the historically great defenses never played against Brady?  There were these historically great defenses led by great coaches. Then Brady started playing and they were never seen from again.

[Moranis]

"Frankly, I think you could argue a team like Steelers, Cowboys, or Niners would have a better team than the Patriots anyway."

You sure about that?

Yep.  Pretty confident in that statement.

Test it, then. Choose one and compare it to the Pats.

Start with the Steelers.  You take the 70's Steel Curtain defense and then you add guys like Troy Polamalu, Jack Butler, Rod Woodson, James Harrison, Joey Porter, Cameron Heyward, Kevin Greene, etc.

Offensively you have 2 HOF QB's leading the way with Bradshaw and Roethlisberger (6 Super Bowl wins between them).  Franco Harris, Jerome Bettis, and Le'Veon Bell at RB.  Antonio Brown, Hines Ward, Lynn Swann, and John Stallworth at WR with Heath Miller at TE (the one real weak spot).  As for the line, plenty of All Pros to choose from including some current players like Pouncey and DeCastro, and some more recent guys like Faneca, Dawson, Webster (though tackle is a bit weak, the line is very good overall).

The Patriots might very well be favored against that team, but it would be far from a given, especially when you consider that defense.  The Steelers could put together a defense that is superior to the Patriots defense, and it isn't all that close, though the Pats offense would likely have the edge. 

The Niners and Cowboys would have offenses on par or better, and would be close defensively.

Heck, I posted about the Ravens in this thread.  Clearly the Ravens in their 20 years of existence would fall way short offensively, but they could put together such a suffocating defense and Flacco obviously has no fear in NE, such that if you gave him Jamal Lewis, Priest Holmes, Ray Rice, and Shannon Sharpe offensively, I'm not sure I'd count them out either.  I mean imagine that 2000 Ravens defense, but add Haloti Ngata, Terrell Suggs, Elvis Dumervil, and Ed Reed to it.  Take the Chris McAlister from a few years later and the Rod Woodson from a couple of season earlier.  Put Ray Lewis at his peak.  The thought of trying to score on that team has got to be scary. 

[KGs Knee]

The only chance the field would have would be to blitz. The best Patriots tackles....Bruce Armstrong...Solder...Matt Light....they'd have a tough time in this game.

I think it could force the Pats to be more up the middle sending Curtis Martin behind John Hannah and keeping a guy back.

Personally I think keeping extra blockers in and give Tom time to find Troy, Julian, Gronk, and Randy....good luck with that

I would also make the game slightly more fair by saying if the Pats get a prime player the field can't have him. Like the Pats get prime Curtis Martin and prime Randy Moss. So the field doesn't get him. But the field gets Junior Seau not us.

The Pats do not get "prime" Randy Moss under your rules, the NFL team gets him. Moss' prime was in Minnesota.

Look, I appreciate a fan who loves his team. But this is 'Tommy on steroids' level Homer Simpson syndrome.

No individual team HOF would ever beat the league HOF, in any sport. It's just a silly notion. Fun to debate, but silly none the less.

[KGs Knee]

The bottom line is there are plenty of proud and successful franchises in the NFL.

Steelers, Cowboys, 49ers, Patriots, Giants, and Packers have all won at least 4 SB's. I would put any of those teams individual HOF teams against the Pats and feel confident in winning. Maybe they would, maybe they wouldn't, but it would be close.