Poll

Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?

Over .500
2 (6.5%)
Under .500
27 (87.1%)
Right at .500
2 (6.5%)

Total Members Voted: 31

Author Topic: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?  (Read 11992 times)

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Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #45 on: November 25, 2015, 08:38:20 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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At this point, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure on a brigade of 5-6 posters coming along and disagreeing with whatever he says, simply on principle.

And without fail somebody will say something along the lines of, "Why don't you just go post in a Sixers forum if you like them so much?!"

Yes, it is weird that a BOSTON CELTICS fan blog would be so unreceptive to someone repeatedly drooling over the PHILADELPHIA 76ERS.  I can't explain it.

Mike

To play devil's advocate, I think LarBrd33 just genuinely likes the 76ers approach to rebuilding.

From what I can see he's always been a person who has been heavily on board the "tank" train as a rebuilding method. 

He always seems to have been of the view that you need star power to be a contender, and that being any less than a contender (i.g. a Hawks team stuck in endless mediocrity) is a pointless excercise.

I think he hypes up the Sixers simply because they are going about things the way he would have liked to see the Celtics go about things.  I think he looks at the Sixers assets and feels that they are one unfortunate-Embiid-health-fail away from being one of the most promising young teams in the NBA.

I think if you look at it from a certain angle, he probably has a point.  They gambled on Embiid, and if he HAD turned out healthy and DID look like a future star, then we would be looking at the Sixers in a very different light right now with their core of Noel/Okafor/Embiid. 

Even still, I think he looks at Noel and sees a 21 year old, hyper-athletic seven footer center with future DPOTY potential.  I think he looks at Okafor and sees a 19 year old guy who is 6'11" with All-Star potential. 

I think he looks at that regardless of the Embiid situation and says "hey, two good hits out of three - can't complain about that". 

Then I think he looks at the fact they will have at least one other high pick (maybe two) after this year, and sees the potential for them to add one or two more guys of similar talent.

I think that if the tables turned and Boston were doing what the Sixers are, he'd be all over the Celtics with a coke and a smile.  But Danny's chosen a different (lower risk, lower payoff) approach to rebuilding, which I think leaves our friend LarBrd33 a little dissapointed.

While I don't necessarily agree with the way the Sixers are doing things (since it's extremely high risk, and will be extremely embarrassing if it fails) I do understand the logic, and I think it's well within his rights to be a fan of that if that's the way he rolls.

I just don't agree with it, which means I will disagree with almost everything he posts hahaha but he has the right to his opinion at the same time.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #46 on: November 25, 2015, 08:38:26 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Doesn't he have like 3 or 4 more years on his contract?

A line up of:
Newman (Lakers Pick)
Saric
Simmons
Noel
Okafor

with possibly a healthy Embiid at some point, could easily be .500. Thats a really nice young team there.

To clarify, Nerlens has 2 years left after this season. Currently he's on the bench on a bad team, so logic would question if he'll even provide a significant enough impact to get them to .500
Noel has started the last two games.  He clearly doesn't fit next to Okafor.  One of those guys will need to be traded.   He has a minimum of two years left on his contract after this one... essentially locked up until at least Summer 2018, but that's assuming they don't extend him... I don't consider restricted free agency to be "free agency"...  I'm going to guess you're assuming that Philly doesn't extend him and he ends up playing for his qualifying offer in 2017-18.  Far-fetched, but we'll pretend.

The premise of this thread has to make the assumption that Okafor is the one who is traded... why else would Noel still be on the roster in 2018?  It clearly doesn't work.  One needs to be cashed in.   So if Noel stays and Okafor leaves, what do you suspect Philly got for Okafor in this hypothetical?   

I'll turn to my fellow Celtic fans... what's your best offer for a 19 year old beast who is averaging 18.4 points, 8 rebounds, 1.7 blocks with 48% shooting... and just torched the #1 rookie for 25 points,12 rebounds and 2 blocks?   Clearly you'd give up Sully for him.  Would you also include Avery Bradley?  Would you give up Marcus Smart + additional 1sts?   Go ahead... tell me your godfather offer for Jahlil Okafor.   Until someone gives me a better answer, I'll just pencil in Avery Bradley and Sully (Philly says hell no)... But if we were to think outside the Boston box... You got teams like Orlando who are overloaded with SFs... Okafor for Harris... who says no?    You got teams like the Bucks who are possibly overloaded with SFs (Middleton, Parker, Giannis).. Okafor for Parker... who says no?   But lets stick with Boston since it's what we know.

You now have Avery Bradley, Jared Sullinger and Nerlens Noel.   Let's just pretend Embiid's career is over even though it probably isn't... so let's pretend they get zero assets for Embiid.    They still have a guaranteed top 4 pick this year, meaning they are getting Ben Simmons, Skal, Brown, Ingram, Murray...     They get the Lakers pick if it falls outside the top 3, so they might end up with two of those guys coming over... otherwise they get the Lakers unprotected 2017 pick.    They have Saric coming over at some point before 2018.   They have oodles of cap space.   They have two more 2016 1sts coming this year from Miami and OKC.  They have prospects with some value like Wroten, Stauskas, Grant, etc...

Yeah, I'd bet on them being a .500 team before 2019.  A good GM could turn that team into a .500 team pretty easily.   If they can't turn all of those assets into a .500 team over the next few seasons, that's a failure.

Wouldn't you be happier strictly posting on a Sixers board? Serious question considering how much you marvel at that pathetic team. You'd be an instant hit with your passionate infatuation based on god knows what.
I wonder which one of us talks more about the 76ers on this board.  I'd guess you start more threads about them.

Not sure, but you sure don't miss to a chance to sing their praises. If only you could spread the wealth to the home team.
I constantly praise every superstar prospect on Boston.

And constantly praise the non-superstar prospects in Philly. Imagine if Noel was actually good at basketball and Okafor could play D and rebound effectively.
Noel finished 3rd in the Rookie of the Year voting.  He was 10th in steals and 7th in blocks in the NBA last season.   Pretty darn good for a player you say isn't good at basketball.  He's just 21 so he has plenty of time to develop further.

You should watch him play, especially on offense, instead of relying on stats. He looks like a baby dear on ice. If that guy has superstar potential, then he doesn't have very high standards of what being a superstar constitutes.
I haven't seen Noel this year but I watched him quite a bit last year.  I've never said Noel is going to be a superstar but he can be a defensive stud at center.  Whether he can diversify his game enough to play PF is certainly an open question.

Please watch him this year. The guy is so overrated. Sure he gets blocks and is active in passing lanes, but he's not the best rebounder, especially in traffic, and gets pushed around way too easily. On offense he's a trainwreck. No footwork. No post game. No perimeter game. Poor free throw shooter. Stone hands. Low IQ/awareness. Weak ball handling. Lack of coordination.

If you think I'm making this stuff up, just watch. Watch him on the offensive end and notice how teams completely ignore him and see what he does when he gets the ball.

Had to quote myself just to reiterate how awful Noel is offensively. So overrated in these parts.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #47 on: November 25, 2015, 09:38:48 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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At this point, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure on a brigade of 5-6 posters coming along and disagreeing with whatever he says, simply on principle.

And without fail somebody will say something along the lines of, "Why don't you just go post in a Sixers forum if you like them so much?!"

Maybe it's because, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure that it's going to be a 100% positive/glass half full opinion. He really does an outstanding job of polishing that turd.


I can understand why people get annoyed that he seems to always have a half-full opinion about other teams and a half-empty opinion about our team.  I just think sometimes the REFUTE AND SHAME LARBRD33 Brigade gets a little bit overbearing.  Derails threads.
Lol personally I think it's hilarious.  These dudes are more obsessed with LarBrd33 and Philly than I am.  You got Eddie who literally can't post a single thing on this forum without quoting me.  If I were a teen idol, I imagine my poster would be on their wall.  Or maybe a dart board.  Christmas is around the corner... Who wants a dart board with larbrd33 hugging Nerlens Noel ?

Just kidding guys. . Keep fighting the good fight against Philly, soldiers.  I'll keep hoping they end up a trade partner.

Noel looks like crap.  They can't use him in a way he's most effective while playing next to okafor.   Okafor looks fantastic.  I think philly's decision is easy here... Trade Noel.  I'd be very happy to buy low on him. 

« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 09:47:59 PM by LarBrd33 »

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #48 on: November 25, 2015, 10:04:04 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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To answer the OP:

Only if Noel doesn't hit free agency for another 8-10 years.
"There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'"

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Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #49 on: November 25, 2015, 10:18:33 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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At this point, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure on a brigade of 5-6 posters coming along and disagreeing with whatever he says, simply on principle.

And without fail somebody will say something along the lines of, "Why don't you just go post in a Sixers forum if you like them so much?!"

Maybe it's because, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure that it's going to be a 100% positive/glass half full opinion. He really does an outstanding job of polishing that turd.


I can understand why people get annoyed that he seems to always have a half-full opinion about other teams and a half-empty opinion about our team.  I just think sometimes the REFUTE AND SHAME LARBRD33 Brigade gets a little bit overbearing.  Derails threads.
Lol personally I think it's hilarious.  These dudes are more obsessed with LarBrd33 and Philly than I am.  You got Eddie who literally can't post a single thing on this forum without quoting me.  If I were a teen idol, I imagine my poster would be on their wall.  Or maybe a dart board.  Christmas is around the corner... Who wants a dart board with larbrd33 hugging Nerlens Noel ?

Just kidding guys. . Keep fighting the good fight against Philly, soldiers.  I'll keep hoping they end up a trade partner.

Noel looks like crap.  They can't use him in a way he's most effective while playing next to okafor.   Okafor looks fantastic.  I think philly's decision is easy here... Trade Noel.  I'd be very happy to buy low on him.

Agree, as long as Oakfor gets better ,  the worse Noel will look , lowering his value, also helps him see there is no future on the team with Embiid and Oakfor.

So ...yes ......Noel might be had at a better deal than we could have thought last year.   I always liked Noah's game ......I think Noel could be the Celtics Noah.  Athletic big running the floor.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #50 on: November 25, 2015, 10:39:46 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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At this point, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure on a brigade of 5-6 posters coming along and disagreeing with whatever he says, simply on principle.

And without fail somebody will say something along the lines of, "Why don't you just go post in a Sixers forum if you like them so much?!"

Yes, it is weird that a BOSTON CELTICS fan blog would be so unreceptive to someone repeatedly drooling over the PHILADELPHIA 76ERS.  I can't explain it.

Mike

To play devil's advocate, I think LarBrd33 just genuinely likes the 76ers approach to rebuilding.

From what I can see he's always been a person who has been heavily on board the "tank" train as a rebuilding method. 

He always seems to have been of the view that you need star power to be a contender, and that being any less than a contender (i.g. a Hawks team stuck in endless mediocrity) is a pointless excercise.

I think he hypes up the Sixers simply because they are going about things the way he would have liked to see the Celtics go about things.  I think he looks at the Sixers assets and feels that they are one unfortunate-Embiid-health-fail away from being one of the most promising young teams in the NBA.

I think if you look at it from a certain angle, he probably has a point.  They gambled on Embiid, and if he HAD turned out healthy and DID look like a future star, then we would be looking at the Sixers in a very different light right now with their core of Noel/Okafor/Embiid. 

Even still, I think he looks at Noel and sees a 21 year old, hyper-athletic seven footer center with future DPOTY potential.  I think he looks at Okafor and sees a 19 year old guy who is 6'11" with All-Star potential. 

I think he looks at that regardless of the Embiid situation and says "hey, two good hits out of three - can't complain about that". 

Then I think he looks at the fact they will have at least one other high pick (maybe two) after this year, and sees the potential for them to add one or two more guys of similar talent.

I think that if the tables turned and Boston were doing what the Sixers are, he'd be all over the Celtics with a coke and a smile.  But Danny's chosen a different (lower risk, lower payoff) approach to rebuilding, which I think leaves our friend LarBrd33 a little dissapointed.

While I don't necessarily agree with the way the Sixers are doing things (since it's extremely high risk, and will be extremely embarrassing if it fails) I do understand the logic, and I think it's well within his rights to be a fan of that if that's the way he rolls.

I just don't agree with it, which means I will disagree with almost everything he posts hahaha but he has the right to his opinion at the same time.
TP.  I've been a fan of what Philly is doing long before philly was doing it.  It's just interesting to me.  I don't start these threads.  I generally don't care if Philly fails.  But as long as people keep starting these threads, I don't mind being the minority pointing out that what they are doing has a chance to succeed.  It's not a love of philly or hate of Boston... It's just a rejection of seeing the same opinions over and over that I happen to believe are wrong.



Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #51 on: November 25, 2015, 11:39:25 PM »

Offline Emmette Bryant

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I think that we need an official 2015-2016 Philadelphia 76er season watch thread

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #52 on: November 26, 2015, 12:09:01 AM »

Offline TheFlex

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At this point, if LarBrd33 posts something about the Sixers, you can be sure on a brigade of 5-6 posters coming along and disagreeing with whatever he says, simply on principle.

And without fail somebody will say something along the lines of, "Why don't you just go post in a Sixers forum if you like them so much?!"

He's a better villain than Larry Bird himself.


Draft: 8 first rounders in next 5 years.

Cap space: $24 mil.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dkcleague/

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #53 on: November 27, 2015, 11:22:26 AM »

Offline cman88

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at some point shouldnt all these high draft picks result in wins? I understand the whole purpose of tanking. but once you have a couple of good players the goal should be to start building something that will develop them in the right way and give them a reason to stay.

so sixers look to tank again this year and get another high draft pick. Will they keep tanking again next year? they need alot of work at this point to even become a team who can go near .500.

at at some point does playing 3-4 years on a perennial loser affect development of players like noel, okafor etc. to develop bad habits.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #54 on: November 27, 2015, 12:02:18 PM »

Offline apc

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Quote from: crimson_stallion link=topic=81355.msg1978937#msg1978937

I think that if the tables turned and Boston were doing what the Sixers are, he'd be all over the Celtics with a coke and a smile.  But Danny's chosen a different (lower risk, lower payoff) approach to rebuilding, which I think leaves our friend LarBrd33 a little dissapointed.

I Think Danny was considering the same approach as the Sixers/Tanking, but had to change the plan after hiring Stevens.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #55 on: November 27, 2015, 01:28:43 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Something I was curious about, but are the 76ers losing money for a few years with this? I know they are the salary cap floor which is a lot of money saved. However, I believe they are last in the league in attendence (and this will only get worse as the season progresses). Furthermore, I would have to believe they are having a hard time selling their high end seats and luxury boxes as well as any team merchandise.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #56 on: November 27, 2015, 01:56:04 PM »

Offline Who

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Something I was curious about, but are the 76ers losing money for a few years with this? I know they are the salary cap floor which is a lot of money saved. However, I believe they are last in the league in attendence (and this will only get worse as the season progresses). Furthermore, I would have to believe they are having a hard time selling their high end seats and luxury boxes as well as any team merchandise.
Forbes says they made a lot of money this year.

Broke even (small losses) previous two years.

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #57 on: November 27, 2015, 02:03:05 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Something I was curious about, but are the 76ers losing money for a few years with this? I know they are the salary cap floor which is a lot of money saved. However, I believe they are last in the league in attendence (and this will only get worse as the season progresses). Furthermore, I would have to believe they are having a hard time selling their high end seats and luxury boxes as well as any team merchandise.
Forbes says they made a lot of money this year.

Broke even (small losses) previous two years.

Very interesting, thanks. Have to imagine this makes the other owners get pretty angry about revenue sharing

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #58 on: November 27, 2015, 02:15:11 PM »

Offline Who

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Something I was curious about, but are the 76ers losing money for a few years with this? I know they are the salary cap floor which is a lot of money saved. However, I believe they are last in the league in attendence (and this will only get worse as the season progresses). Furthermore, I would have to believe they are having a hard time selling their high end seats and luxury boxes as well as any team merchandise.
Forbes says they made a lot of money this year.

Broke even (small losses) previous two years.

Very interesting, thanks. Have to imagine this makes the other owners get pretty angry about revenue sharing

I remember reading that Philly does not qualify for the revenue sharing program because Philly is too large a market to qualify for revenue sharing.

This isn't from last season but the year before.

Quote
Last year the NBA was projected to redistribute over $231 million to its needy teams through their revenue sharing program, a huge jump from the $40 million or so that was distributed under the previous CBA, which came entirely from luxury tax payments. Two teams were scheduled to receive in excess of $20 million each to help them remain competitive financially, with an additional 5 teams scheduled to receive $17 million each.

Except, the Sixers weren’t one of these 7 teams. In fact, the Sixers are not eligible to receive one cent from the league’s revenue sharing program, a fact first reported by Zach Lowe of Grantland, and one that John Gonzalez followed up on.

The exact details of who is eligible for revenue sharing are clarified by Larry Coon, where he states that teams with more than 2.5 million TV households cannot receive a revenue sharing payment.

This list, according to the Nielsen group, would include teams in the New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Philadelphia, Dallas, and San Francisco media markets.

Beyond that, since teams contribute to the revenue sharing pool an amount equal to a percentage of their revenue, the league actually makes teams accountable for hitting revenue benchmarks based on market size. If a team falls short on revenue they have to make up that difference. While I don’t have the exact figures of the Sixers revenue sharing contribution, it stands to reason that the Sixers didn’t hit their revenue benchmarks, and thus ended up sending a higher percentage of their revenue towards the league’s revenue sharing program than they normally would have, while getting nothing back from it.

In short, the Sixers did not turn a profit based on the league’s revenue sharing program.

http://nba.derekbodner.com/2014/08/28/how-the-sixers-did-and-didnt-turn-a-profit-last-year/

Re: Will Philly be a .500 team before Noel hits free agency?
« Reply #59 on: November 27, 2015, 04:36:08 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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at some point shouldnt all these high draft picks result in wins? I understand the whole purpose of tanking. but once you have a couple of good players the goal should be to start building something that will develop them in the right way and give them a reason to stay.

so sixers look to tank again this year and get another high draft pick. Will they keep tanking again next year? they need alot of work at this point to even become a team who can go near .500.

at at some point does playing 3-4 years on a perennial loser affect development of players like noel, okafor etc. to develop bad habits.
This is only Noel's 2nd active season and Okafor's 1st season.  Embiid and Saric haven't played yet.  I think Thompson is their only player who has been there three seasons.  There are plenty of other players (e.g. Cousins) who have been in losing situations longer.  With Embiid and the Sixers top pick plus hopefully Saric and a Laker's top 5 pick, I expect that they'll try to put a more cohesive, more balanced team on the floor next season.  Maybe get to 30 or so wins next season and then go for the playoffs the following season. 

I expect the Sixers to go after some free agents this offseason.  They really have to with the cap jumping another 20mil and them only having 26mil on the books.  I'd expect them to overpay on 1 or 2 year contracts.  With all their young players, they probably don't want to tie up too much salary long-term.