Windhorst: "Rose's breakup with the Bulls has begun" [speculating]

[hpantazo]

The Brian Windhorst muckraking campaign against the Bulls has begun. I don’t know how long it’s going to last. I don’t know if it’s going to be complete. But you can sort of see it.

He's trying to sabotage them so they don't pose any threat to the Cavs.

This. What qualifies as reporting and journalism nowadays is pretty pathetic. Rose also looked pretty darn great last night too.

[PhoSita]

Eh, except Rose is basically a 33 year old point guard.  Not actually, but I think that's how we should look at him.  He's still capable of contributing to a good team, probably, but I doubt he has many years left on his legs.  Similar to Deron Williams, he's not suited to play a central role on a team anymore.

[Hemingway]

Wishful thinking. As Rose said tonight after having a great game, he couldn't play at all for 2 weeks in recovery and lost his rhythm and some fitness.

No desire to have Rose in Boston, would just thinking we could benefit as a 3rd team facilitator to make a trade work, if it happens.

I agree. We can be a facilitator to just about any trade. a good thing to do while you wait.

[sofutomygaha]

God this would all look so different if he hadn't been given one of Lebron James' MVP trophies because he reminded a bunch of nostalgic sportswriters of Jordan.

Rose is overrated and broken.

He spent two years launching himself at the basket like Russell Westbrook and it was awesome and anyone who was paying any attention knew he was going to hurt himself very badly. He did (future Westbrook buyers, beware, by the way).

I'm so tired of the fascination with this guy.

[hpantazo]

I find it funny that so many people are dumping on Rose after he put up 29, 5, and 7 in a win over the Thunder last night. He still has it, it was unreasonable to think a guy who basically missed the few weeks leading into the season didn't need a few games to get back into rhythm. He is much, much better than any player on the celtics right now, and is totally worth the $$$. The Bulls I'm sure are not looking or willing to move him though, don't believe what passes for reporting nowadays.

[chambers]

I find it funny that so many people are dumping on Rose after he put up 29, 5, and 7 in a win over the Thunder last night. He still has it, it was unreasonable to think a guy who basically missed the few weeks leading into the season didn't need a few games to get back into rhythm. He is much, much better than any player on the celtics right now, and is totally worth the $$$. The Bulls I'm sure are not looking or willing to move him though, don't believe what passes for reporting nowadays.

He's lost a step but he was awesome vs OKC.
I think that without his former athleticism he's just too poor a FG% player to be a true franchise guy again. I think he had 27 shots vs OKC which is incredible for a team with Gasol, Butler, McDermott , Mirotic.

I don't think anyone is saying Rose sucks, he's just not worth 20 million x 2 years because of his steady and continuous decline because of injury. It's simply too risky and would also hinder Smart's development.

I don't think they'll trade him anyway, I think he'll slowly feel less pressure now that Butler and Gasol are there to help. Jimmy Butler is going to be even better than last season to give them a shot at a 7 game series vs Cleveland.

[GetLucky]

How many former MVPs are not in the Hall of Fame? I don't think Rose is fit for the latter just yet.

[D Dub]

This is absurd.  Brian the Windhbag at it again. 

Lets just imagine our team has Butler, Gasol & Mirotic in the front court. 
What kind of player would you ideally want to complete that group? 
Hmm, this is really difficult, let me think about it...  Still thinking....oh wait I got it!  How about a veteran point guard?  Maybe a former MVP still capable of scoring. 

Chicago has exactly zero reason to trade Rose.  He fits, and they are in win-now mode. 

Rose has exactly zero reason to want a trade at this point because ...he fits and they are in win-now mode.

This story is just pure, utter garbage from ESPN.  Quite representative of the kind of 'reporting' that caused me to cancel my cable subscription so I could have the peace of mind knowing I don't support their "product". 

[moiso]

I find it funny that so many people are dumping on Rose after he put up 29, 5, and 7 in a win over the Thunder last night. He still has it, it was unreasonable to think a guy who basically missed the few weeks leading into the season didn't need a few games to get back into rhythm. He is much, much better than any player on the celtics right now, and is totally worth the $$$. The Bulls I'm sure are not looking or willing to move him though, don't believe what passes for reporting nowadays.

I would take Smart over Rose regardless of salary at this point.

[CelticSince83]

I wonder if Philly would want him.  If so, that would be a way to get Nerlens. 

IT to CHICAGO
ROSE to PHILA
NERLENS to BOS

Landry and Wroten as fillers.  I'm guessing there would have to be picks involved but considering all three of those guys have super volatile/ hard to gauge trade values, I honestly am not 100% sure who would have the most legit argument with regards to receiving picks.  Perhaps Chicago, but then again, IT looks a million times better than Rose at this point so who knows.

You don't understand how GMs think.  If Chicago starts thinking of trading Rose, they're going to want a return that treats him as if he is a superstar.

I actually disagree. I don't think GM'S aren't giving up staple pieces for the corpse of Derrick Rose. A top 10 pick would probably do it with some salary filler.
He hasnt shown any significant worth or health for 3 seasons and he's only got 1 year on his deal after this season.
For the Bulls it's about building around Jimmy Butler and McDermott asap. They'll probably try and dump Noah too.
There is absolutely zero chance we'd give up Marcus Smart for Derrick Rose.

Side note to the Philly/Boston/Chicago idea...why would the 76ers give up their young defensive stud Noel for two years of Derrick Rose?
Would you give up Nerlens Noel for Rose?
Hell no.

Why would Philly do that?  I don't know.  Their 3 most valuable assets all play center.  Why would they draft a center 3 years in a row?  They clearly have a surplus of young bigs unless you think Embiid is going to come back and play off guard.

But why does Philly trade away one of their top 3 assets for an injury riddled Derrick Rose who expires at the end of next season?
They've had plenty of opportunities to go after expensive free agents and have avoided it for development via the draft.
Why would they suddenly change their strategy to get Derrick Rose?
Doesn't make sense.

This trade is of zero interest to Philly. They just have a guy the Celtics might want (Noel) and for some reason the proposed trade assumes that Philly will do this terrible deal to facilitate our future over their own lol.
It's a completely non realistic, terrible proposal.

Ask yourself, if you are Philly, would you trade Nerlens Noel for Rose?

If you want to continuously contradict yourself just to argue with me, go ahead.  I don't think it is totally unrealistic for PHI to have interest in Rose at the right price.  They are going to have to eventually trade some of their bigs anyway.  What point guards do you think they would shop Noel for?  Westbrook?  Lillard?  Irving?  Rose wouldn't be a bad flyer.

The suggestion wasn't made with Celtic blinders on, as you claim.  But then again, since my first post questioned whether PHI would have interest, you more than likely have a problem with reading comprehension.

Contradict myself? Please highlight any contradictions with anything I've said? lol,
 I've pointed out how one sided this trade is and  that this trade is basically Philly giving up a highly prized asset for a mediocre return, thus helping the Celtics.

Arguing for the sake of arguing? You are the one arguing the literal fantasy that Philly would decide to trade their elite, potentially top 5 defensive big man- who is arguably their second best asset after Okafur- for the corpse of Derrick Rose. You are arguing imaginary reasons for the 76ers to want to give away their prized assets for a washed up, injury riddled star, who will probably never even be an All Star again.
Why are you arguing this again? For the sake of it?

Your reasoning is that 'they have to trade their bigs eventually anyway'.
So they should trade Nerlens Noel on his 2nd year of a rookie contract for D Rose now.... while Rose has less than 2 years on his deal and $40 million remaining. Uh huh. Give up their potentially franchise defensive big man for 18 months of Derrick Rose with their fingers crossed he doesn't go down with another knee injury.

But hey, the Celtics get Noel, so why not argue about it because they 'have to trade their bigs eventually'.

2nd year of his contract?  What was he on a community service agreement his first year?  Pretty sure it's his third.  No wait, I'm actually 100% positive.

Like I said, I think all three of those guys I mentioned have trade values that fluctuate quite a bit and are really difficult to gauge.  Case in point, the contrasting opinions on this thread with regards to who isn't giving up enough. 

Lastly, with regards to the Celtics portion..... I only brought them up as a team to facilitate because clearly Chicago would have no interest in trading for another big with their current roster, so they would most likely want a point guard/ scorer back for Rose so they could compete this year, which is why I threw in IT.  I really don't think this is a trade that is patently in favor of the Celtics, and wouldn't make sense to either of the other teams involved.  I also didn't realize PHI had no interest in spending money to trade for and or sign higher caliber players, which also seems to have been disputed by others here as well. 

[CelticSince83]

I wonder if Philly would want him.  If so, that would be a way to get Nerlens. 

IT to CHICAGO
ROSE to PHILA
NERLENS to BOS

Landry and Wroten as fillers.  I'm guessing there would have to be picks involved but considering all three of those guys have super volatile/ hard to gauge trade values, I honestly am not 100% sure who would have the most legit argument with regards to receiving picks.  Perhaps Chicago, but then again, IT looks a million times better than Rose at this point so who knows.

You don't understand how GMs think.  If Chicago starts thinking of trading Rose, they're going to want a return that treats him as if he is a superstar.

And you don't understand how difficult it is to trade a $40m contract for a guy who plays 8 games a year.

Honestly I think both of you are correct, which is why it's going to be very difficult for a trade to happen.  Chicago's going to want a high-end return for Rose, but very few GMs would be willing to consider it with his injury issues.  Seems unlikely unless the Bulls just decide to cut bait for whatever they can get.

I would agree with that.  TP.