Author Topic: Kanye for President in 2020  (Read 7111 times)

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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #45 on: September 01, 2015, 04:17:50 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Had to put it on in order to get the quote right (plus it's one of my favorite concert films) but Roger Waters said this in 1971 and I don't think it has changed a single iota in the almost 40 years since.

"It's like, you give a man a Les Paul guitar and he becomes Eric Clapton, and of course that's not true. And if you give a man an amplifier and a synthesizer, he doesn't become, you know, whoever; he doesn't become us."
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #46 on: September 01, 2015, 10:16:34 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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:P
From a sonic perspective he's got a lot of interesting ideas, particularly in the context of pop music.

I don't own any of his records, but calling him talentless just makes it sound like you don't know what you're talking about.
nope, I've heard him.  sounds god-awful.  admittedly I hate the vast bulk of rap "music" but I find his brand of noise to be particularly loathesome.

I don't like country music or classic rock, etc but I would never call them talentless.
neither would I -  they would actually have to have a talent like playing an instrument or singing.

Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #47 on: September 01, 2015, 10:17:53 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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:P
From a sonic perspective he's got a lot of interesting ideas, particularly in the context of pop music.

I don't own any of his records, but calling him talentless just makes it sound like you don't know what you're talking about.
nope, I've heard him.  sounds god-awful.  admittedly I hate the vast bulk of rap "music" but I find his brand of noise to be particularly loathesome.

That's not what I'm talking about, though. You don't have to like it to know that it's good -- the vast majority of radio music, regardless of genre, sounds tremendous, and there's a reason some of these producers can command seriously high dollar prices for sessions.

It has next to nothing to do with "like" or "dislike" unless you're the kind of person who judges things exclusively on that criteria. Not that that isn't a perfectly valid way to measure things, but it does sound uneducated.
when it comes to personal taste, then 'like' or 'dislike' is the primary way to judge things.  Music is very much one of those things. 

as far as rap goes, there's no musicianship that I could point to and appreciate.  For example, I can't stand most country music either but I can certainly appreciate musicianship that goes into it.   Rap is basically rhythmic speech.  while it does require some effort to become good at it, it's not nearly on the same level as someone who actually sings.  another example, I'm not a fan of Christina Aguilera's music but I can appreciate she has an incredible voice.

calling that uneducated is getting on a high horse to look down on others that don't share your viewpoint and you come across as an elitist snob.

The thing is: that's just incorrect. You're not talking about musicanship: you're talking about virtuosity, and conflating the two is misguided, to put it nicely. There is much more to music than what you're using to delineate 'real music' from 'pretend music.'

This is beyond genre preference. This is simply a matter of using a very limited scope of a conversation to define your entire contribution to the discussion. I know you're a lot smarter than that and it's kind of a bummer that you're not looking at it in a larger way, that's all.
well thank goodness you know what's correct here that you can tell people they're wrong ::)

Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #48 on: September 01, 2015, 10:50:52 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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I will never understand why people read only the first sentence of a post and suffice themselves with that. 

To use a loose basketball analogy,What you have said is  that Shane Battier was a bad basketball player because he did not score many points.

You would, I am sure, agree that said opinion is both uniformed and wrong. You can dislike Shane Battier's play aesthetically, but if you say he was a bad NBA player you are incorrect. Categorically not right. This is, I think you would agree, relatively uncontroversial to point out.


Look at what you wrote:

as far as rap goes, there's no musicianship that I could point to and appreciate. 

The key here is the last seven words, not the first eight. It's not a taste thing, it's not an "I like it" "I don't like it" thing, it's a "you are saying something that is incorrect and I am trying to explain to you why" thing. Like getting a math equation wrong in an introductory algebra class and saying "NO IM NOT WRONG", it makes you look petulant and uniformed. You, insofar as I know you as a CB poster, are neither of those things, so I don't understand the resistance.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2015, 11:08:30 PM by D.o.s. »
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #49 on: September 01, 2015, 10:56:36 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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Perhaps slam is just embracing his inner Kanye right now.
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #50 on: September 01, 2015, 10:58:35 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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No I think he's unaware of the difference between instrumental virtuosity and musicianship, at least insofar as his comments about "playing an instrument" are concerned. Now, that's silly, since you don't have to be able to play an instrument to write music -- as vast annals of human history have proven -- and you don't have to use live instrumentation to create music, either.

Or maybe he's one of those people who directly equate manual dexterity to musical accomplishment. Slam, are you a big Rush fan?
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #51 on: September 01, 2015, 11:16:51 PM »

Offline Forza Juventus

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He is just ignorant. He already is not a hip hop fan so he has a biased opinion. If he thinks Kanye has no talent then he must think all rappers have no talent because Kanye is universally known as one of the best. In my opinion the best. He is critically acclaimed. I mean this poster literally said Kanye has no talent. In my experience people that don't like Kanye already don't like hip hop and in my experience people that don't like hip hop are very arrogant and elitist and can't just dislike hip hop, they have to also not take it seriously and say it's not real music. Very ignorant stuff.
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #52 on: September 01, 2015, 11:19:39 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Well, for the record, I don't like Kanye as a rapper. Hip hop is just music like any other kind of music -- there is 'good' and 'bad,' but it's not impossible to see the things that are done well in music you don't like.
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #53 on: September 01, 2015, 11:25:14 PM »

Offline Forza Juventus

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Which is why he shouldn't be critiquing him. I don't go around insulting country stars or hockey stars because I know nothing about either. He literally said the man has no talent. He couldn't have been more ignorant.
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #54 on: September 01, 2015, 11:27:46 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Which is why he shouldn't be critiquing him. I don't go around insulting country stars or hockey stars because I know nothing about either. He literally said the man has no talent. He couldn't have been more ignorant.

I don't know if that was meant quite so literally.
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #55 on: September 02, 2015, 01:23:52 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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It's fair to call him a genius. Not a fan of his - though I was when he first came out and was more of a producer and initially off-the-radar artist - but, to be fair, his following and critical acclaim speaks for itself. If he did not produce an exceptional product for many years, then the general population would necessarily have horrible taste... seems like pretty good odds to safely bet he's good at what he does.

Huge fan of 90s rap, likely as a product of age, culture, the superiority of 90s rap, etc. So everything that has come since Tupac, for example, I can fairly easily brush off as "crap." But to dismiss his talents based upon personal preferences would be silly, which seems to be the discussion unraveling here.

One can certainly argue that a lot of his success came from his creating a polarizing persona. That'd argument could carry weight, for sure, in that a lot of people make careers off of that. But he definitely did not start off his career that way, at least not to the general public, and I doubt he would've enjoyed the success he has had based entirely upon PR stunts.

I do think he's a clown, fwiw. And I would like to see him run for president solely because of that, too.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2015, 01:47:45 AM by tarheelsxxiii »
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #56 on: October 04, 2015, 04:59:55 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

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Part of the glory of the United States of America is that anyone of a certain age who was born here can run for President.  That does not mean that they will be elected president..... ;)
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #57 on: October 04, 2015, 06:57:23 PM »

Offline littleteapot

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"In America, anyone can be president. That's the problem." -George Carlin
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #58 on: October 05, 2015, 03:25:41 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

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"In America, anyone can be president. That's the problem." -George Carlin
Ahhh...a little humor on the subject...do you feel that Presidents should be Harvard or Yale trained...preferably constitutional lawyers?  or life long politicians?
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Re: Kanye for President in 2020
« Reply #59 on: October 05, 2015, 03:31:23 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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"In America, anyone can be president. That's the problem." -George Carlin
Ahhh...a little humor on the subject...do you feel that Presidents should be Harvard or Yale trained...preferably constitutional lawyers?  or life long politicians?

Ideally all of the above. We need them to protect our corporations job creators.
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