Lowe - Excerpt from Hornets article on Celtics' draft day offer

[GreenWarrior]

I really hope we at least offered this much to philly.

[ahonui06]

Steep price, especially the Brooklyn unprotected pick. However, I'm not mad that Ainge offered that package for Justise Winslow.

Also not mad that Charlotte rebuked our offer and am happy with the Rozier selection at 16.

[obnoxiousmime]

The reason I point that out continuously around here is that many have an attitude that building from the middle is not only more noble, respectable, and enjoyable than building from the bottom via the draft, but it is also less messy and difficult.

My point has always been that building from the middle is, yes, "more noble, respectable, and enjoyable" but also that it's probably about equally "messy and difficult" as building from the bottom.

I believe it's "messy and difficult" either way.  I'd rather watch a team that's "noble, respectable, and enjoyable" while waiting for that big break that may or may not come.

I think a lot of pro-tankers like myself are operating under the assumption that if Ainge had a few early picks he wouldn't totally mess them up like Charlotte has. The Celtics have shown themselves to be a pretty solid organization and Ainge's draft record, while not perfect, should be considered at least above average.

[footey]

Not sure I get why Winslow was worth all that fuss. Seems like winning the NCAA championship inflates the value of a pick too much, especially in his case.  I'd much rather have Rozier, Hunter and Mickey than him.  Maybe a case could be made for Johnson, but he was gone by then. 

[PhoSita]

My fear is we will be hoarding assets until 2018 waiting for a player to become available.

I agree.  This is my fear as well.

[PhoSita]

I think a lot of pro-tankers like myself are operating under the assumption that if Ainge had a few early picks he wouldn't totally mess them up like Charlotte has.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Substitue Monroe for Harris and you'd take a step in the right direction.

Harris was the other name I considered putting in there.  I think you're right that it's a better example. 

Nevertheless, I'm still skeptical that Monroe wasn't a target for the Celts.  I think he simply preferred other teams with more talent already on board. 

I wouldn't blame Monroe for thinking that the Celts would have a much harder time propping him up defensively compared to the lanky, athletic roster the Bucks have assembled.

I mean, remove the pessimism and think on this objectively, do you really believe that the Celtics wouldn't be able to even get a meeting with Monroe if they wanted to when he chose a team in Milwaukee?

Yes, I believe that.  The Bucks have Middleton, a young break out guy who's not quite a star but very good, combined with Giannis, a player on the rise to stardom, and Jabari, a prospect who is perceived as a potential superstar scorer.  The Celts have nothing to compare to that when you look at the core of their roster . . . because the Celts don't have a core at all, really.

Add in the fact that, as I noted above, the Bucks are probably a better fit for Monroe, and I can believe that easily.



As for Love: talk is cheap.  Sure, we heard that Love liked Boston and would consider coming here.  But it seems to me he was very quick to go right back to Cleveland.  At the end of the day, the star chose to stay with other stars on a team that just went 6 games in the Finals.  Not a shock.

As I mentioned, focusing too much on why he would choose the Bucks over us, not really much of a reason to why the Celtics couldn't even get a meeting.

You really believe that the Celtics showed interest in Monroe and didn't manage to even scrape up a meeting (given all the factors I mentioned)?

And considering your position on this matter, why would Monroe take a meeting with the Lakers then? Ah right because Los Angeles... but wait, I thought were focusing on rosters here.

Also took a meeting with Portland who's was set to hemorrhage talent left and right.

[slamtheking]

Not sure I get why Winslow was worth all that fuss. Seems like winning the NCAA championship inflates the value of a pick too much, especially in his case.  I'd much rather have Rozier, Hunter and Mickey than him.  Maybe a case could be made for Johnson, but he was gone by then. 

I'd rather have Winslow or Turner than those 3.  either of those players is projected to be at least a good starter in the league.  Rozier, Hunter and Mickey aren't really projected to be more than rotation players at most.  getting 3 rotation-quality players is nothing to sneeze at but we've already got a roster loaded with rotation-quality players but none are really starting-quality.  Winslow or Turner could have been that type of player for us.

having said that, I'm appalled Danny offered an unprotected Brooklyn pick as part of that deal and it just goes to further make my point that Jordan is clueless when it comes to running a franchise.  Kaminsky may be as close to  "NBA ready" as any player in the draft but that doesn't make him a great pick for that draft slot. 

[PhoSita]

You really believe that the Celtics showed Monroe and didn't manage to even scrape up a meeting (given all the factors I mentioned)?

And considering your position on this matter, why would Monroe take a meeting with the Lakers then? Ah right because Los Angeles... but wait, I thought were focusing on rosters here.

Also took a meeting with Portland who's was set to hemorrhage talent left and right.

(a) Yes.  There were enough teams ahead of the Celts on his list that he made a decision before even reaching the point where he'd sit down with the Celts.

(b) I can't say why he'd entertain the Lakers ahead of the Celtics; maybe the media market, or maybe he thinks their young guys have star potential, or maybe he looks up to Kobe. Who knows, he didn't pick them.  I think it would have been a bad choice.

(c) Portland still has Lillard, though, which is more than the Celts have.

[Forza Juventus]

Zach Lowe is one of the best in the business so this report is definitely true. Now that this has come out I now believe Ainge did the best he could to move up, we can't offer much better than this for the 9th pick. I think Charlotte should have made the deal but time will tell if they made the right decision.

[tankcity!]

Is Winslow even that good? That's a lot to give up for a dude with subpar ball handling skills. Also, the best part of the article is the quote below. So unreal. How dysfunctional are these guys?

Polk argues drafting extra players might have cramped Charlotte’s roster space. “We didn’t have enough spots after picking up Spencer Hawes, Jeremy Lamb, and Batum,” Polk says. “Even if someone wants to give me first-round picks, what am I going to do with them?”

Some of this doesn’t quite hold up. Charlotte had 12 players on its roster before picking Kaminsky, meaning it could have drafted two players and still had room to sign either Jeremy Lin or Tyler Hansbrough — both of whom are in Charlotte on great contracts, by the way. A well-prepared front office has enough intel on every first-round prospect to make snap decisions in the heat of the draft. Cho and his staff have the goods to pivot.

[ahonui06]

Is Winslow even that good? That's a lot to give up for a dude with subpar ball handling skills. Also, the best part of the article is the quote below. So unreal. How dysfunctional are these guys?

"Polk argues drafting extra players might have cramped Charlotte’s roster space. “We didn’t have enough spots after picking up Spencer Hawes, Jeremy Lamb, and Batum,” Polk says. “Even if someone wants to give me first-round picks, what am I going to do with them?”

Some of this doesn’t quite hold up. Charlotte had 12 players on its roster before picking Kaminsky, meaning it could have drafted two players and still had room to sign either Jeremy Lin or Tyler Hansbrough — both of whom are in Charlotte on great contracts, by the way. A well-prepared front office has enough intel on every first-round prospect to make snap decisions in the heat of the draft. Cho and his staff have the goods to pivot."

That quote about sums it up. Charlotte isn't a well-prepared front office lol.  Michael Jordan is a terrible front office person, basically the opposite of how he was as a player.

[jpotter33]

Not sure I get why Winslow was worth all that fuss. Seems like winning the NCAA championship inflates the value of a pick too much, especially in his case.  I'd much rather have Rozier, Hunter and Mickey than him.  Maybe a case could be made for Johnson, but he was gone by then. 

I'd rather have Winslow or Turner than those 3.  either of those players is projected to be at least a good starter in the league.  Rozier, Hunter and Mickey aren't really projected to be more than rotation players at most.  getting 3 rotation-quality players is nothing to sneeze at but we've already got a roster loaded with rotation-quality players but none are really starting-quality.  Winslow or Turner could have been that type of player for us.

having said that, I'm appalled Danny offered an unprotected Brooklyn pick as part of that deal and it just goes to further make my point that Jordan is clueless when it comes to running a franchise.  Kaminsky may be as close to  "NBA ready" as any player in the draft but that doesn't make him a great pick for that draft slot.

TP, this is spot on, though I do think Hunter and/or Rozier have the potential to become good starting options in this league.

[Rondo9]

You really believe that the Celtics showed Monroe and didn't manage to even scrape up a meeting (given all the factors I mentioned)?

And considering your position on this matter, why would Monroe take a meeting with the Lakers then? Ah right because Los Angeles... but wait, I thought were focusing on rosters here.

Also took a meeting with Portland who's was set to hemorrhage talent left and right.

(c) Portland still has Lillard, though, which is more than the Celts have.

Yeah? Lillard and who else?

[BudweiserCeltic]

You really believe that the Celtics showed Monroe and didn't manage to even scrape up a meeting (given all the factors I mentioned)?

And considering your position on this matter, why would Monroe take a meeting with the Lakers then? Ah right because Los Angeles... but wait, I thought were focusing on rosters here.

Also took a meeting with Portland who's was set to hemorrhage talent left and right.

(a) Yes.  There were enough teams ahead of the Celts on his list that he made a decision before even reaching the point where he'd sit down with the Celts.

(b) I can't say why he'd entertain the Lakers ahead of the Celtics; maybe the media market, or maybe he thinks their young guys have star potential, or maybe he looks up to Kobe. Who knows, he didn't pick them.  I think it would have been a bad choice.

(c) Portland still has Lillard, though, which is more than the Celts have.

...OK then...