Author Topic: Roster Consolidation  (Read 15068 times)

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Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #30 on: July 20, 2015, 10:58:16 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Not really interesting or exciting, but you need big contracts if you're talking about a 3 for 1 kinda deal.

Not if you're using Turner as your largest salary (i.e. Not Bradley).

By the way, Turner, Sully and Babb (presumably plus a low pick) works for DeRozen.

Yeah, sure, I'm just not sure who's gonna trade us anybody that makes a deal worthwhile if the Ohio State duo is the heart of the package.

Might mean DeRozen is too ambitious. But I doubt the Raps can get a meaningful package for Him.

This. DeRozan is one of the most perennially overvalued players on this board. There's not a huge market for an expiring, inefficient, SG who can't shoot or play defense, and wants an inordinately large contract next year. Furthermore, the Raptors aren't even that committed to him. 'Prying' DD from the Raptors won't be that difficult.

Since when has Derozan been a guy who "cant play defense"???

Derozan has been a solid defensive player pretty much his entire career.  He's an immediate upgrade over Turner on that end of the court and is probably at least on par with Crowder.

That's a bit reason why he is so valued - he's got decent size, he's got elite athleticism, he's a 20 PPG scorer, he plays solid defence, and he's only 25 year old.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2015, 11:06:03 PM by crimson_stallion »

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #31 on: July 20, 2015, 11:11:18 PM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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He actually performed quite a bit better at SF than at SG.

http://www.82games.com/1415/14TOR6.HTM

Smitty77

I can't find the article I read exploring this, but the basic gist was that DeRozan, much like Jimmy Butler, can play the 3 situationally, but is better suited to play the 2 primarily. He gives up too much size defensively.

Hmm, didn't know that. By any chance, do you know who he was playing alongside?

Vasquez.

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #32 on: July 20, 2015, 11:32:13 PM »

Offline biggs

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ET needs to hit the road

He is standing smack dabb in the middle of the road blocking the Celtics progress


Just let go......write it off.......wave him........kick him.......just get him off the team


Rather have Holmes......than ET or Young.

I've seen lots of hate towards ET lately.  He is not a perfect player, but was part of the reason we went 24 and 12 to end the season.  3 triple doubles, other near miss triple doubles, game winning shots, and I believe he was second to Westbrook in at least 10, 5, 5 games the second half of the season.

Again not a perfect player but I think he is more than a salary dump in a trade especially to a team that is in need of ball handling small forward.

ET grew on me this year, but he flaked in the playoffs big time. I do agree though that he was a big part of our regular season success.
Truuuuuuuuuth!

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #33 on: July 20, 2015, 11:52:23 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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I'd expand the GS trade to Lee and Barnes for Turner, Sully, Wallace, PJ3 and Cavs 1st.

Smart/IT/Rozier
AB/Hunter/Young
Barnes/Crowder
AJ/Lee/Jerekbo
Zeller/KO/Mikey
14 guys.
15th could be Holmes?

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #34 on: July 21, 2015, 12:00:05 AM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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ET needs to hit the road

He is standing smack dabb in the middle of the road blocking the Celtics progress


Just let go......write it off.......wave him........kick him.......just get him off the team


Rather have Holmes......than ET or Young.

I've seen lots of hate towards ET lately.  He is not a perfect player, but was part of the reason we went 24 and 12 to end the season.  3 triple doubles, other near miss triple doubles, game winning shots, and I believe he was second to Westbrook in at least 10, 5, 5 games the second half of the season.

Again not a perfect player but I think he is more than a salary dump in a trade especially to a team that is in need of ball handling small forward.

ET grew on me this year, but he flaked in the playoffs big time. I do agree though that he was a big part of our regular season success.
He had some good games in the playoffs. In game 3 he was tremendous, but the other 3 games were just OK. I think hes a bit underrated.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2015, 12:00:45 AM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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I'd expand the GS trade to Lee and Barnes for Turner, Sully, Wallace, PJ3 and Cavs 1st.

Smart/IT/Rozier
AB/Hunter/Young
Barnes/Crowder
AJ/Lee/Jerekbo
Zeller/KO/Mikey
14 guys.
15th could be Holmes?
I doubt GS does that plus we already trade the Cleveland #1.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2015, 12:11:44 AM »

Offline Csfan1984

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I'd expand the GS trade to Lee and Barnes for Turner, Sully, Wallace, PJ3 and Cavs 1st.

Smart/IT/Rozier
AB/Hunter/Young
Barnes/Crowder
AJ/Lee/Jerekbo
Zeller/KO/Mikey
14 guys.
15th could be Holmes?
I doubt GS does that plus we already trade the Cleveland #1.
Well trade one of the teams ever growing amount of low first . Can't keep track of all the picks coming and going. Lol. Now I do agree it is seriously doubtful, yet GS should consider it if repeating and being financially stable is their goal. They keep depth in Turner, PJ3 and Sully effectively but aren't locked in salary wise plus they get a pick.

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #37 on: July 21, 2015, 12:42:58 AM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Not really interesting or exciting, but you need big contracts if you're talking about a 3 for 1 kinda deal.

Not if you're using Turner as your largest salary (i.e. Not Bradley).

By the way, Turner, Sully and Babb (presumably plus a low pick) works for DeRozen.

Yeah, sure, I'm just not sure who's gonna trade us anybody that makes a deal worthwhile if the Ohio State duo is the heart of the package.

Might mean DeRozen is too ambitious. But I doubt the Raps can get a meaningful package for Him.

This. DeRozan is one of the most perennially overvalued players on this board. There's not a huge market for an expiring, inefficient, SG who can't shoot or play defense, and wants an inordinately large contract next year. Furthermore, the Raptors aren't even that committed to him. 'Prying' DD from the Raptors won't be that difficult.

Since when has Derozan been a guy who "cant play defense"???

Derozan has been a solid defensive player pretty much his entire career.  He's an immediate upgrade over Turner on that end of the court and is probably at least on par with Crowder.

That's a bit reason why he is so valued - he's got decent size, he's got elite athleticism, he's a 20 PPG scorer, he plays solid defence, and he's only 25 year old.

I've never seen him described as a good defender.  He's one of those guys who has the tools to be a good defender, but seemingly doesn't care to be one.  He's not a good enough offensive player to be someone whose defensive indifference could be tolerable.  I haven't looked at the numbers, but I'd guess that doing so would show that Danilo Gallinari, another popular trade target, is a better defender.
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Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #38 on: July 21, 2015, 01:07:56 AM »

Offline max215

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Not really interesting or exciting, but you need big contracts if you're talking about a 3 for 1 kinda deal.

Not if you're using Turner as your largest salary (i.e. Not Bradley).

By the way, Turner, Sully and Babb (presumably plus a low pick) works for DeRozen.

Yeah, sure, I'm just not sure who's gonna trade us anybody that makes a deal worthwhile if the Ohio State duo is the heart of the package.

Might mean DeRozen is too ambitious. But I doubt the Raps can get a meaningful package for Him.

This. DeRozan is one of the most perennially overvalued players on this board. There's not a huge market for an expiring, inefficient, SG who can't shoot or play defense, and wants an inordinately large contract next year. Furthermore, the Raptors aren't even that committed to him. 'Prying' DD from the Raptors won't be that difficult.

Since when has Derozan been a guy who "cant play defense"???

Derozan has been a solid defensive player pretty much his entire career. He's an immediate upgrade over Turner on that end of the court and is probably at least on par with Crowder.

That's a bit reason why he is so valued - he's got decent size, he's got elite athleticism, he's a 20 PPG scorer, he plays solid defence, and he's only 25 year old.

DeRozan's DRtg, DWS, DBPM, and DRPM were all worse than Turner's from last year. Additionally, he has a reputation for being a lazy defender who seems disinterested on that side of the court. While the anecdotal evidence doesn't really mean anything, the advanced stats paint a picture of both Turner and DD being poor defenders, DeRozan being the inferior of the two. I'll say it again: I'm not opposed to getting DeRozan. He provides scoring that we desperately need and I think CBS could turn him into a more efficient scorer. However, we shouldn't view DeRozan as some sort of superstar, and we definitely should not overpay for someone with his flaws and contract situation.
Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

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Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #39 on: July 21, 2015, 01:09:39 AM »

Offline max215

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Not really interesting or exciting, but you need big contracts if you're talking about a 3 for 1 kinda deal.

Not if you're using Turner as your largest salary (i.e. Not Bradley).

By the way, Turner, Sully and Babb (presumably plus a low pick) works for DeRozen.

Yeah, sure, I'm just not sure who's gonna trade us anybody that makes a deal worthwhile if the Ohio State duo is the heart of the package.

Might mean DeRozen is too ambitious. But I doubt the Raps can get a meaningful package for Him.

This. DeRozan is one of the most perennially overvalued players on this board. There's not a huge market for an expiring, inefficient, SG who can't shoot or play defense, and wants an inordinately large contract next year. Furthermore, the Raptors aren't even that committed to him. 'Prying' DD from the Raptors won't be that difficult.

Since when has Derozan been a guy who "cant play defense"???

Derozan has been a solid defensive player pretty much his entire career.  He's an immediate upgrade over Turner on that end of the court and is probably at least on par with Crowder.

That's a bit reason why he is so valued - he's got decent size, he's got elite athleticism, he's a 20 PPG scorer, he plays solid defence, and he's only 25 year old.

I've never seen him described as a good defender.  He's one of those guys who has the tools to be a good defender, but seemingly doesn't care to be one.  He's not a good enough offensive player to be someone whose defensive indifference could be tolerable.  I haven't looked at the numbers, but I'd guess that doing so would show that Danilo Gallinari, another popular trade target, is a better defender.

Their advanced defensive stats are nearly identical, maybe slightly favoring Gallinari.
Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

DKC Clippers

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #40 on: July 21, 2015, 01:32:14 AM »

Offline viulo

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Wait...

Aren't we theoretically at 16 now if you count Wallace and Babb?

Isn't it pretty much already common knowledge that Wallace + Babb are going to be traded out for Lee?

Won't that bring us back down to 15, and if so isn't that the limit - or has it changed recently?

You're probably forgetting Perry Jones III

1 Isaiah Thomas
2 Smart
3 Rozier
4 Bradley
5 RJ Hunter
6 James Young
7 Evan Turner
8 Crowder
9 Jerebko
10 Sullinger
11 Olynyk
12 David Lee
13 Amir Johnson
14 Tyler Zeller
15 Mickey
16 Perry Jones III


That's assuming Wallace and Babb go for Lee and Thornton goes to europe (or d league but without a contract with the Cs)

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #41 on: July 21, 2015, 07:30:33 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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When is Wallace and Babb officially ....out of here  :-X


So excited to see Wallace fly out the door ...been forever.....ugh

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #42 on: July 21, 2015, 07:45:14 AM »

Offline ssspence

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Can one of the cap efficienados answer a question for me:

When a player is signed & traded to another team, I believe he can't be traded with another player. But can he be traded with a pick?
Mike

(My name is not Mike)

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #43 on: July 21, 2015, 08:24:10 AM »

Offline JumpingJudkins

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Again not a perfect player but I think he is more than a salary dump in a trade especially to a team that is in need of ball handling small forward.

We're not a team in need of a ball-handling small forward. We're a team in need of a small forward who can score consistently and hit the three.

I would live a happier life if I never had to see another awkward ET drive to the middle with a pass back out to the top of the key for a steal and uncontested dunk ...

Re: Roster Consolidation
« Reply #44 on: July 21, 2015, 08:37:26 AM »

Offline wayupnorth

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When is Wallace and Babb officially ....out of here  :-X


So excited to see Wallace fly out the door ...been forever.....ugh

What problem do you have with Wallace?