Author Topic: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !  (Read 47239 times)

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Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #60 on: July 22, 2015, 03:06:18 PM »

Offline RAAAAAAAANDY

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That's not an article...

I've yet to see a single shred of evidence that playing on a bad team helps you steal the ball, block shots or cause your opponents to miss shots as the rim.

And on it's face that assertion is pretty absurd. His numbers improved significantly as the team got better around him.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #61 on: July 22, 2015, 04:34:02 PM »

Offline colincb

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That's not an article...

I've yet to see a single shred of evidence that playing on a bad team helps you steal the ball, block shots or cause your opponents to miss shots as the rim.

And on it's face that assertion is pretty absurd. His numbers improved significantly as the team got better around him.

His best defensive +/- numbers were with MCW and McDaniels on the court. They were gone by the trade deadline.

Anyhow, from a Liberty Baller fanpost. The author seems to be a standard middle-of-the-road fan on the Little Miss Sunshine-Debbie Downer spectrum of optimism-pessismism:

http://www.libertyballers.com/2015/4/11/8380885/a-nerlens-counterpoint-is-the-defense-as-good-as-it-seems

Quote
...it might not feel like a top 12 defense because the team is routinely beaten on rotations, make simple errors, or give up high scoring quarters. Not coincidentally, and what I've taken so long to get to, these breakdowns and big quarters happen more often in the beginnings of games, when people tune in, or when games can turn into blowouts as the opposing team's starters and best players beat down the Sixers.

The Sixers' defensive rating by quarter, points allowed per 100 possessions per NBA.com, reflects that they are not a good first half team (league rankings in parentheses):

1Q; 106.3 (24th)

2Q: 105.5 (T-22nd)

3Q: 98.4 (5th)

4Q: 97.6 (1st)

So, the Sixers are a great fourth quarter defensive team. If the fourth quarter were all that mattered, as so many people believe, the Sixers would have the best defense in the NBA! Of course, that's not the case. The other three quarters matter! The Sixers routinely are down double digits at halftime. On average, the Sixers trail by 6.8 points per game (per TeamRankings.com) after two quarters, which is the worst in the NBA, and by 8.0 points entering the fourth quarter.

Because of this, the Sixers routinely face competition that either takes their proverbial foots off the pedal, or they're facing backups throughout the second halves of games. Plus, by being so far behind, with the league's second worst point differential, the team avoids late-game foul shenanigans by just not being in regularly competitive games. Late-game fouls tend to offset decreased offensive efficiency in fourth quarters, the result of player fatigue and heavy backup minutes, as foul attempts have a higher points-per-possession tally than any other non-open-layup or dunk result.

Good defensive teams follow the Sixers in defensive rating: Golden State (which faces the same thing in fourth quarters, but only because they're outscoring opponents by millions of points a game), Houston, Portland, and Chicago immediately follow. Sixth-best? The bleeping NEW YORK KNICKS, who for the full game, rank third worst in defensive efficiency, and are the only team with a worse point differential than the Sixers.

Nerlens plays the same number of minutes in virtually every quarter - he averages between 7.6 and 8.0 minutes across each. He's playing as much in games where the margins are closer and the team is falling behind and the defense struggles as he is in the fourth quarter, when an average game margin is between three and four possessions. Does Noel magically play better in the second halves of games? I doubt that.

The Sixers' (and Noel's) statistics in garbage time (without Katie Nolan) inflate his case which, if you're waging Nerlens Noel's ROY case on him creating more value than Wiggins, and more minutes than Mirotic, must be evaluated as well. How much of his defensive value, and the team's defensive performance, is meaningless? The Sixers' effort defensively while trailing is a great indicator of work ethic, but if you're building a true ROY case on this, you cannot ignore how little his case means to game results.

There are issues for stats of good players on really bad teams on both sides of the ball and it can affect stats like +/-, PER, etc..

Just to be clear, I think Noel can be elite defensively and he had a very good year defensively as a 2nd year rookie, but his stats were inflated by being on a bad, bad team. His offensive future is  another story altogether and expecting that he's going to have the same level of improvement that Jordan had because of the stats they both had as a rookie is a reach. Playing with Embiid or Okafor is another challenge for him, because offensively, he not as effective away from the basket in a half court offense. Okafor's strictly an inside player too and there's good reason to be skeptical for how the Sixers' offense can accommodate having both of them on the floor at the same time. Finally, getting to be a decent shooter is usually tougher when you can't shoot from the line or a reasonable distance away from the basket.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #62 on: July 22, 2015, 04:38:54 PM »

Offline RAAAAAAAANDY

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You'll notice that article didn't actually make a single conclusion about his defensive statistics being inflated...

It just said they were because, "blowouts"

And if you're playing that game then please account for the total lack of spacing on the offensive end for the first half of the season. Noel improving to DeAndre levels on offense is far from ridiculous, DeAndre's range is the length of his arm and he can't make a FT to save his life.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #63 on: July 22, 2015, 04:51:00 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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The fact that he re-broke the foot is actually a new development. I'd be interested in seeing the particulars on when/how they found that out.
This situation remains somewhat bizarre for a number of reasons.   

One of the main disagreements fans here were having about Embiid stemmed from how they were interpreting the facts in the situation.   I was on the losing side of that disagreement, clearly.  But I kept pointing out several things.   

#1 - He felt no pain. 
#2 - He was going full-bore training and a routine CT scan showed something "different" that was consistently referred to as "not healed as much as hoped"
#3 - He didn't seem to be in a walking boot.  He was hanging around summer league running up stairs and shooting shots. 
#4 - It was reported multiple times that he did NOT re-break his navicular bone.   
#5 - THe original prognosis said it could take up to 12 months to heal and we were now at the 12 month mark...

Now, there had been a couple tweets/rumors without proper sources that claimed this was more serious.   It was mentioned that surgery wasn't ruled out... But everything coming from the team, Hinkie, the CEO of the 76ers, Embiid himself and Bill Self seemed to suggest that surgery wasn't the first option.   If it was broken, you'd think that surgery would be the immediate option. 

Based on this, you could come up with your own interpretation of events, but both were completely speculative.   I admitted that my opinion was pure speculation... none of us actually knew what was going on... there were just two rival conspiracy theories.

#1 - The team was lying.  His foot was broken.  His career was over.
#2 - It was less serious than they were letting on.  It probably had to do with the tissue surrounding the bone.  He would be kept out of summer league but should be fine to go in 4 months when the season started.

I was in camp #2.  I was wrong.   Fine.   But now it appears that those who were right were only right, because their conspiracy theory was correct.   The team literally was lying.  I hadn't factored that into my speculation.   

Still, there remains major confusion about what exactly is going on with Embiid's health.  There remains debate on whether or not the report by Bob Cooney about Embiid's foot being "rebroken" is even accurate.  Is Cooney (who 76ers fans seem to be suggesting is a hack) just misreporting things?  Does it even matter?  It kind of does matter whether or not it "re-broke" or if a different part of the foot broke.  I've seen the phrase "spider cracks" thrown out there.  Some people speculate that Embiid's growth may have caused an issue with the screws in place.   Regardless of whether or not his foot actually did "re-break", I believe they'll need to surgically break it again to put in the bone graft... and I say "believe", because I still don't know... and nobody else does either.  The 76ers are oddly keeping details of what's happening under wraps.  And it makes things all the more confusing when Embiid is seen walking around (without a boot) on his supposedly "broken" foot by TMZ yesterday:  http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/21/nbas-joel-embiid-john-wall-video-ty-lawson/

I get flack on this forum for writing about Embiid, but my motivation was purely as a fan of basketball.  Instead of burying the kid based on "Greg Oden"/"Yao Ming", I genuinely want to know what's going on with him.  This is a weird situation... and I'm not the only person who thinks so.   Here's a recent article that I highly recommend:  http://www.csnphilly.com/basketball-philadelphia-76ers/sixers-mishandled-joel-embiid-injury-news

Quote
It?s a complicated situation for all sorts of reasons, but one aspect is clear enough: the Sixers haven?t done a very good job explaining exactly what?s going on with Joel Embiid.

In a new report, sources told Bob Cooney of the Philadelphia Daily News that the navicular bone in Embiid?s right foot was re-broken. A Sixers spokesperson did not respond when CSNPhilly.com inquired about the story.

A little over a week ago, it was revealed that Embiid will have a second surgery on his foot and will miss the upcoming 2015-16 season. As recently as early June, Embiid was reportedly progressing in his rehab and expected to play in summer league. Then a routine CT scan revealed ?less healing than anticipated,? according to a hastily issued team statement late on a Saturday evening in mid-June. All of that despite the fact that Sam Hinkie said Embiid was pain-free and felt great.

Sixers fans have been force-fed a lot of reports over the last month or so, but digesting the material is difficult in the absence of greater context and clarification. That?s where the Sixers lost control of the narrative and did themselves and their fans a disservice. Walking everyone through what?s happened so far and why would go a long way. Two purposefully cloudy press releases are inadequate by comparison.

This is, again, a hyper complex situation. Sources tell the Daily News that Embiid?s navicular bone was re-broken. There?s no reason to doubt Cooney or his sources. But what the Sixers would likely say ? if they were to uncloak themselves and reveal anything at all ? is that even the best orthopedic surgeons in the world tend to disagree when diagnosing this particular injury and recommending a course of action. The language used to describe the current state of his navicular bone has also differed. That?s something the Sixers could and should explain.

After the draft but before the second surgery was announced, I had separate conversations with two different sources close to the situation. Both independently explained the attendant complications in deciding if Embiid needed another procedure. They said Embiid had consulted several excellent doctors and was scheduled, at the time, to see at least two more. The problem in determining if Embiid should have the second surgery was that even though the team was sending him to the very best specialists, finding any sort of consensus on the matter proved difficult.

One of the sources explained it this way, and I?m paraphrasing: After seeing Doctor A, they ask Doctor A for his prognosis. He recommends Embiid undergoes the "Doctor A Procedure." They inquire about what that is. He tells them it?s a procedure he invented for this specific injury. After seeing Doctor B, they ask Doctor B for his prognosis. He recommends Embiid undergoes the "Doctor B Procedure." Doctor B also invented his method. And so on. Countless doctors. Countless opinions, some of which mesh, many of which do not.

This is something the Sixers would never say publicly, but it?s absolutely something they kicked around internally. If you?re the doctor who operates on Yao Ming?s navicular bone, even if his career is cut short, you?re still the doctor who did the procedure. That?s a massive deal. Athletes with similar problems might seek you out. It?s a huge career boost. Embiid?s first surgery was done by Dr. Richard Ferkel. He said all the right things after the procedure, telling reporters ?the surgery went very well and I'm confident that after appropriate healing he will be able to return to NBA basketball.? You wouldn?t expect him to say anything else. And it might still be the case. But regardless of what happens to Embiid?s career, Ferkel operated on a high-profile patient with high-profile friends in a high-profile business.

That might be a cynical way of looking at things, and the main motivations when recommending surgery (or not recommending it) are likely altruistic, but all of that was part of the process the Sixers went through when deciding whether Embiid should have another surgery. Some factors were bigger than others. Some information was weighed more heavily. But there were a lot of moving parts.

The other issue: It wasn?t a unilateral decision. Hinkie didn?t simply tell Embiid to go off and have another procedure. A lot of people were involved in the recommendation, and then Embiid had to sign off. I was told that took some time. As previously noted, he felt pain-free. He?s also a 21-year-old kid who does 21-year-old kid stuff. (The Sixers ?addressed? the Phunkee Duck flap with Embiid, if you?re wondering.)

This wasn?t simple on any level. Which is why walking everyone through the process and pointing out the seemingly unending variables would have helped quite a bit. The Sixers are a secretive organization. Hinkie admitted to telling his staff to ?never let your guard down. Never.? Which is a fine (if frustrating) approach for a general manager/president to adopt on many basketball-related matters. But in this particular instance, it makes less sense. We know Embiid needs surgery. We know he?ll be out another year. But there?s so much more we don?t know. Is the bone in fact re-broken? How did it happen? When? What were the different opinions of the different specialists? What language did they use in their diagnosis? Is Embiid still pain-free? What?s the success rate for a second navicular procedure? Has the doctor who will do the procedure performed it before? How many times? What was his/her success rate? And on and on.

There?s a lot to navigate here. The Sixers should better explain how and why they plotted this particular course.

And look, I was clearly on the losing side of the Embiid debate... I have ate my crow for it.  But again, I wasn't factoring in the possibility that the team was literally lying about what was going on with Embiid.  This is very strange:

http://deadspin.com/did-the-76ers-lie-about-joel-embiids-injured-foot-1719150487

Quote
Finally, nobody seems to know when the reported re-break occurred, and what activity Embiid is or isn?t allowed to undertake. Cooney writes that until June 13 was practicing full bore, and after the announcement of ?less healing than anticipated? he was still taking flat-footed shots at the team?s practice facility, and wasn?t wearing a boot nor limping. And last week in Las Vegas, after the announcement of his season-ending surgery, Embiid was spotted running ?up the steps at the Thomas and Mack Center toward the concourse level.?

When reports about whether a guy ran or walked up some steps and what protective footwear he was or wasn?t wearing while doing so becomes relevant, you can be assured we?re through the looking glass.

If the 76ers understood the specifics of Embiid?s injury but sought to obfuscate them in public statements and in conversations with the press, all I can say is that they are even dumber than I thought. Considering the amount of people that know the details of his injury?the front office, the coaching staff, the training staff, a number of independent doctors, Embiid, his agent, his family, and whoever any of these people told?the chances of this specific lie not getting outed was close to zero. And when there is already a healthy distrust that your team is conducting itself on the level (the 76ers were fined $3 million for not fully disclosing the extent of Jrue Holiday?s injury when trading him to the Pelicans in 2013), furthering that reputation is a very bad idea.

Teams lying about injuries is nothing new, but usually they do so for some sort of competitive advantage. Considering Embiid was over four months from playing in a game when the team announced they would reevaluate his foot, it?s hard to understand what advantage they gained. Instead, it looks another move that prioritizes public relations for an organization that seemingly cares more about PR than putting a functioning basketball team on the court.




« Last Edit: July 22, 2015, 04:59:15 PM by LarBrd33 »

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #64 on: July 22, 2015, 06:04:48 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Worth noting: Bill Walton.

And you can't say Len Bias was anymore of a loss than Vin Baker, really. We all make our own choices. He made his.

Umm, yes you can.  The only way that would make any sense would be if the players were on the same level and the circumstances were equal, which is not the case.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #65 on: July 22, 2015, 06:37:15 PM »

Online hpantazo

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Apparently Embiid was walking around town without a limp or boot or brace or anything last night and said " Do I look broken to you?"

http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/21/nbas-joel-embiid-john-wall-video-ty-lawson/

The reporter who stated that Embiid rebroke his foot is also backtracking a bit on the story:

http://www.csnphilly.com/basketball-philadelphia-76ers/joel-embiid-foot-re-broken-scott-oneil-sticking-original-story

This just gets weirder and weirder.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #66 on: July 22, 2015, 06:41:17 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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What is Hinkie doing?

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #67 on: July 22, 2015, 06:41:48 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Apparently Embiid was walking around town without a limp or boot or brace or anything last night and said " Do I look broken to you?"



This just gets weirder and weirder.


Either it all of  a BIG hoax ......he wants off the team .....or this type of " I'm alright strategy "  gloating. ..show ......is how he is going to  "dupe" another team into paying him a big contract , for a FREE ride in life because he was born with weak bones and gas to sit on the bench and heal for the rest of his NBA career .

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #68 on: July 22, 2015, 06:47:13 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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What is Hinkie doing?


I doubt he really knows .....just keep a  bad team....keep playing D league ball .....eventually after being in the  top pick for 5-6 years get gets enough players to put together a team.

All NBA has to do is only allow a team to gave one top 10 lottery pick every three years ...set tanking limits ....after you tank....then play ball......that would stop him and force him to act like Human being , field the best team EVERY year he can for fans to cheer for .


Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #69 on: July 22, 2015, 07:38:19 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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Apparently Embiid was walking around town without a limp or boot or brace or anything last night and said " Do I look broken to you?"



This just gets weirder and weirder.


Either it all of  a BIG hoax ......he wants off the team .....or this type of " I'm alright strategy "  gloating. ..show ......is how he is going to  "dupe" another team into paying him a big contract , for a FREE ride in life because he was born with weak bones and gas to sit on the bench and heal for the rest of his NBA career .
It's possible he's just a young kid who doesn't want to admit he's injured.   If he was "dominating" a month ago and now they are saying he needs to have a bone graft, he might be fighting back behind the scenes.  I'm sure if they want to do a bone graft it's to improve the bone's stability long-term and prevent it from breaking again... that's why the report that he actually re-broke it is curious.  Some are speculating that was sloppily reported since it's easier to just say he "re-broke it" instead of saying, "there's concern about the long-term stability of the bone and they will need to put in a bone graft"... either way, they will probably have to break it, right?  I think you need to break the bone in order to put the bone graft in... at least, that's what I've read.

He was supposed to have surgery within 7-10 days of the initial report... it's been over 10 days... I wonder what's up with that too.  This situation is indeed strange... here he is on June 26th when he reportedly was already dealing with a broken bone in his foot... no walking boot... sup with this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LckiKil7_Q

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #70 on: July 22, 2015, 08:03:23 PM »

Offline wayupnorth

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The fact that he re-broke the foot is actually a new development. I'd be interested in seeing the particulars on when/how they found that out.
This situation remains somewhat bizarre for a number of reasons.   

One of the main disagreements fans here were having about Embiid stemmed from how they were interpreting the facts in the situation.   I was on the losing side of that disagreement, clearly.  But I kept pointing out several things.   

#1 - He felt no pain. 
#2 - He was going full-bore training and a routine CT scan showed something "different" that was consistently referred to as "not healed as much as hoped"
#3 - He didn't seem to be in a walking boot.  He was hanging around summer league running up stairs and shooting shots. 
#4 - It was reported multiple times that he did NOT re-break his navicular bone.   
#5 - THe original prognosis said it could take up to 12 months to heal and we were now at the 12 month mark...

Now, there had been a couple tweets/rumors without proper sources that claimed this was more serious.   It was mentioned that surgery wasn't ruled out... But everything coming from the team, Hinkie, the CEO of the 76ers, Embiid himself and Bill Self seemed to suggest that surgery wasn't the first option.   If it was broken, you'd think that surgery would be the immediate option. 

Based on this, you could come up with your own interpretation of events, but both were completely speculative.   I admitted that my opinion was pure speculation... none of us actually knew what was going on... there were just two rival conspiracy theories.

#1 - The team was lying.  His foot was broken.  His career was over.
#2 - It was less serious than they were letting on.  It probably had to do with the tissue surrounding the bone.  He would be kept out of summer league but should be fine to go in 4 months when the season started.

I was in camp #2.  I was wrong.   Fine.   But now it appears that those who were right were only right, because their conspiracy theory was correct.   The team literally was lying.  I hadn't factored that into my speculation.   

Still, there remains major confusion about what exactly is going on with Embiid's health.  There remains debate on whether or not the report by Bob Cooney about Embiid's foot being "rebroken" is even accurate.  Is Cooney (who 76ers fans seem to be suggesting is a hack) just misreporting things?  Does it even matter?  It kind of does matter whether or not it "re-broke" or if a different part of the foot broke.  I've seen the phrase "spider cracks" thrown out there.  Some people speculate that Embiid's growth may have caused an issue with the screws in place.   Regardless of whether or not his foot actually did "re-break", I believe they'll need to surgically break it again to put in the bone graft... and I say "believe", because I still don't know... and nobody else does either.  The 76ers are oddly keeping details of what's happening under wraps.  And it makes things all the more confusing when Embiid is seen walking around (without a boot) on his supposedly "broken" foot by TMZ yesterday:  http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/21/nbas-joel-embiid-john-wall-video-ty-lawson/

I get flack on this forum for writing about Embiid, but my motivation was purely as a fan of basketball.  Instead of burying the kid based on "Greg Oden"/"Yao Ming", I genuinely want to know what's going on with him.  This is a weird situation... and I'm not the only person who thinks so.   Here's a recent article that I highly recommend:  http://www.csnphilly.com/basketball-philadelphia-76ers/sixers-mishandled-joel-embiid-injury-news

Quote
It?s a complicated situation for all sorts of reasons, but one aspect is clear enough: the Sixers haven?t done a very good job explaining exactly what?s going on with Joel Embiid.

In a new report, sources told Bob Cooney of the Philadelphia Daily News that the navicular bone in Embiid?s right foot was re-broken. A Sixers spokesperson did not respond when CSNPhilly.com inquired about the story.

A little over a week ago, it was revealed that Embiid will have a second surgery on his foot and will miss the upcoming 2015-16 season. As recently as early June, Embiid was reportedly progressing in his rehab and expected to play in summer league. Then a routine CT scan revealed ?less healing than anticipated,? according to a hastily issued team statement late on a Saturday evening in mid-June. All of that despite the fact that Sam Hinkie said Embiid was pain-free and felt great.

Sixers fans have been force-fed a lot of reports over the last month or so, but digesting the material is difficult in the absence of greater context and clarification. That?s where the Sixers lost control of the narrative and did themselves and their fans a disservice. Walking everyone through what?s happened so far and why would go a long way. Two purposefully cloudy press releases are inadequate by comparison.

This is, again, a hyper complex situation. Sources tell the Daily News that Embiid?s navicular bone was re-broken. There?s no reason to doubt Cooney or his sources. But what the Sixers would likely say ? if they were to uncloak themselves and reveal anything at all ? is that even the best orthopedic surgeons in the world tend to disagree when diagnosing this particular injury and recommending a course of action. The language used to describe the current state of his navicular bone has also differed. That?s something the Sixers could and should explain.

After the draft but before the second surgery was announced, I had separate conversations with two different sources close to the situation. Both independently explained the attendant complications in deciding if Embiid needed another procedure. They said Embiid had consulted several excellent doctors and was scheduled, at the time, to see at least two more. The problem in determining if Embiid should have the second surgery was that even though the team was sending him to the very best specialists, finding any sort of consensus on the matter proved difficult.

One of the sources explained it this way, and I?m paraphrasing: After seeing Doctor A, they ask Doctor A for his prognosis. He recommends Embiid undergoes the "Doctor A Procedure." They inquire about what that is. He tells them it?s a procedure he invented for this specific injury. After seeing Doctor B, they ask Doctor B for his prognosis. He recommends Embiid undergoes the "Doctor B Procedure." Doctor B also invented his method. And so on. Countless doctors. Countless opinions, some of which mesh, many of which do not.

This is something the Sixers would never say publicly, but it?s absolutely something they kicked around internally. If you?re the doctor who operates on Yao Ming?s navicular bone, even if his career is cut short, you?re still the doctor who did the procedure. That?s a massive deal. Athletes with similar problems might seek you out. It?s a huge career boost. Embiid?s first surgery was done by Dr. Richard Ferkel. He said all the right things after the procedure, telling reporters ?the surgery went very well and I'm confident that after appropriate healing he will be able to return to NBA basketball.? You wouldn?t expect him to say anything else. And it might still be the case. But regardless of what happens to Embiid?s career, Ferkel operated on a high-profile patient with high-profile friends in a high-profile business.

That might be a cynical way of looking at things, and the main motivations when recommending surgery (or not recommending it) are likely altruistic, but all of that was part of the process the Sixers went through when deciding whether Embiid should have another surgery. Some factors were bigger than others. Some information was weighed more heavily. But there were a lot of moving parts.

The other issue: It wasn?t a unilateral decision. Hinkie didn?t simply tell Embiid to go off and have another procedure. A lot of people were involved in the recommendation, and then Embiid had to sign off. I was told that took some time. As previously noted, he felt pain-free. He?s also a 21-year-old kid who does 21-year-old kid stuff. (The Sixers ?addressed? the Phunkee Duck flap with Embiid, if you?re wondering.)

This wasn?t simple on any level. Which is why walking everyone through the process and pointing out the seemingly unending variables would have helped quite a bit. The Sixers are a secretive organization. Hinkie admitted to telling his staff to ?never let your guard down. Never.? Which is a fine (if frustrating) approach for a general manager/president to adopt on many basketball-related matters. But in this particular instance, it makes less sense. We know Embiid needs surgery. We know he?ll be out another year. But there?s so much more we don?t know. Is the bone in fact re-broken? How did it happen? When? What were the different opinions of the different specialists? What language did they use in their diagnosis? Is Embiid still pain-free? What?s the success rate for a second navicular procedure? Has the doctor who will do the procedure performed it before? How many times? What was his/her success rate? And on and on.

There?s a lot to navigate here. The Sixers should better explain how and why they plotted this particular course.

And look, I was clearly on the losing side of the Embiid debate... I have ate my crow for it.  But again, I wasn't factoring in the possibility that the team was literally lying about what was going on with Embiid.  This is very strange:

http://deadspin.com/did-the-76ers-lie-about-joel-embiids-injured-foot-1719150487

Quote
Finally, nobody seems to know when the reported re-break occurred, and what activity Embiid is or isn?t allowed to undertake. Cooney writes that until June 13 was practicing full bore, and after the announcement of ?less healing than anticipated? he was still taking flat-footed shots at the team?s practice facility, and wasn?t wearing a boot nor limping. And last week in Las Vegas, after the announcement of his season-ending surgery, Embiid was spotted running ?up the steps at the Thomas and Mack Center toward the concourse level.?

When reports about whether a guy ran or walked up some steps and what protective footwear he was or wasn?t wearing while doing so becomes relevant, you can be assured we?re through the looking glass.

If the 76ers understood the specifics of Embiid?s injury but sought to obfuscate them in public statements and in conversations with the press, all I can say is that they are even dumber than I thought. Considering the amount of people that know the details of his injury?the front office, the coaching staff, the training staff, a number of independent doctors, Embiid, his agent, his family, and whoever any of these people told?the chances of this specific lie not getting outed was close to zero. And when there is already a healthy distrust that your team is conducting itself on the level (the 76ers were fined $3 million for not fully disclosing the extent of Jrue Holiday?s injury when trading him to the Pelicans in 2013), furthering that reputation is a very bad idea.

Teams lying about injuries is nothing new, but usually they do so for some sort of competitive advantage. Considering Embiid was over four months from playing in a game when the team announced they would reevaluate his foot, it?s hard to understand what advantage they gained. Instead, it looks another move that prioritizes public relations for an organization that seemingly cares more about PR than putting a functioning basketball team on the court.

Lol

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #71 on: July 22, 2015, 08:22:14 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Apparently Embiid was walking around town without a limp or boot or brace or anything last night and said " Do I look broken to you?"

http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/21/nbas-joel-embiid-john-wall-video-ty-lawson/

The reporter who stated that Embiid rebroke his foot is also backtracking a bit on the story:

http://www.csnphilly.com/basketball-philadelphia-76ers/joel-embiid-foot-re-broken-scott-oneil-sticking-original-story

This just gets weirder and weirder.

Wow.  This may very well end up being a sort of Walton-Blazers situation where Bill left because of his distrust in Portland's medical staff.  Hopefully, Embiid won't have those problems or any similar injuries moving forward.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #72 on: July 22, 2015, 09:26:55 PM »

Offline oldtype

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Off topic, but is anyone sneaky-curious about whether Saric will ever actually come over to the NBA or not?

He basically has to choose between being a superhero in Europe or taking a pay cut to come to the NBA only to play on a team that's probably even worse than his old team that has no intention of winning.

Of course, this all changes if the Sixers rebuild progresses well and they become an up-and-coming young team; but I think Saric coming can only be the result of the Sixers making significant progress first, not the other way around.


Great words from a great man

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #73 on: July 22, 2015, 09:53:35 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Saric is overrated anyway.

Re: Embiid rebroke foot , wil miss next season too !
« Reply #74 on: July 22, 2015, 11:35:34 PM »

Offline colincb

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Hinkie was clearly lying.