This looks like a lotto squad to me

[PhoSita]

This whole "Marcus Smart and James Young won't improve" stuff is absolutely hilarious. I guess the idea is that they sat around on their couches and played video games all off season.  In fact even in that scenario I might still expect them to be improved.

Improvement is to be expected, but it's a question of what you perceive their upside to be.

Smart turning into a beefier George Hill and James Young becoming another CJ Miles won't change this team's fortunes.

[gpap]

I appreciate a realistic approach, but this exercise feels pretty skewed. I watch plenty of other teams and just don't get the outlook for some of these East teams and players while the C's get a snarky blurb about the D-League.

I wouldn't be surprised if the team wins 30 wins, wouldn't be surprised if they win 45. I haven't forgotten how enjoyable and gritty last years team was despite the lack of big moves this summer and I feel continuity and chemistry is habitually underrated. I've watched the Knicks bumble their rebuild for a decade plus because they lacked patience, don't want to see that happen here. Also feel our assets aren't as worthless as some have come to believe, we will at least be in the hunt for any major players that want out. I get that slow rides can be frustrating and the grass is always greener, but outright pessimism just isn't for me I suppose.

Until our "assets" land us anything, I have no reason to believe they have ANY sort of value.

[gpap]

The last half of last year (really as soon as IT showed up) outside of the Cavs and Hawks there really wasn't a team in the East the Celts couldn't beat at will. Where has this team regressed? What part of the team is worse?

The guards are better. Way better than at the start of last year.

The wings are better.

The bigs are better.

Arguably the center position isn't better but it's not worse.

We didn't lose a major coach, right?

What team are we expecting to be far healthier than us? Orlando. I could give you them. But not Brooklyn or a lot of other teams.

Milwaukee. I expect them to be good.

Teams like Indiana with George's return, Miami with Bosh's return and the Knicks with Melo's return and a couple decent pick ups like Lopez and Afflalo all MIGHT be better (and they may not.)

I am not saying the Celts definitely have no chance at the playoffs, but right now it doesn't look good.

For the 3rd season in a row we have an unbalanced roster. A bunch of guards and PF's but only 1 center. Also we have no real SF. Crowder is back-up and Turner sucks

[gpap]

I also think based on the free agent snubs that Ainge has come to the conclusion the only way we end up landing a star is through the draft.

On the contrary, signing vets to these large unguaranteed contracts signals to me that Ainge is not concerned with trying to get talent higher in the draft.  Nor does it seem like he's intent on signing second or third tier free agents, even if the player is young and might be a bargain long term. 

Instead, it seems he's focused entirely on setting himself up to make a blockbuster trade or two for an elite talent.  From what I can tell, all of the eggs are in that basket.  If no such trade materializes, we're basically left hoping that one of these guys selected in the mid to late 1st round turns into a star.

No we're not terrible. And that is the problem. We're mediocre. Fringe playoff team, going to he drafting 12-16 every year, watching FAs laugh in our face as they head elsewhere, as we pray for the trade of the century. We were promised fireworks two years in a row and ended up with Jack. We're literally in the worst place to be for a NBA franchise.

And the Nets have no incentive to tank and every in incentive to avoid embarrassment..

Gimme a break. To be in the worst place you have to have no assets, no youth to develop, and up against the cap.

So basically the Brooklyn Nets.

You are the complete opposite. You're wide open. Keep building through the draft.

A few problems with what you're saying

-Other than Smart, we have no assets.

-Having youth to develop is meaningless. You need to have players that can contribute now to win now.

-I actually like the guys we drafted but having "youth to develop" is in NO WAY a requirement for having a good team.

- No assets other than Smart ? That's not true. No GM in the game believes that. IT4 is an asset by himself, and you know it

- Nothing meaningless about developing talents like Young, Olynyk, Sullinger, and Smart. They proved your point wrong last year when they were winning and developing at the same time

- Never said it was required, just pointed out the transition. Develop your youth and try to win, that's the goal

The main reason behind our success in the 2nd half was Smart, Crowder, Bradley and picking up Isaiah.  Olynyk and Sully were injured for most of the 2nd half of the season and never really gained any consistency when they came back.  Young had literally NOTHING to do with our success last year as he showed how inconsistent of a shooter he was.

[gpap]

The team looked like a lottery squad last year.

But something happened on the way to tanksville.

Team play is a new paradigm for many to comprehend.

The Celtics are rediscovering their legacy and going retro.

This year will be better than last year.

Their "legacy" is to have a bunch of bench players barely making the playoffs in a terrible conference? You do realize that the Celtics have the most HOFers of any franchise right? That most of them were high lotto picks?

He is referring to playing hard, as a team and getting the most out of their talent.

This team is extremely young, and building. Last year they barely made the playoffs, this year they will be better than that and the year after that they will be better than that.

Where's all of the improvement coming from?

Are you expecting huge leaps forward over the next two years from Smart and Young?  Are you hoping for Rozier, Hunter, or Mickey to turn into above average starters?

Um....yes.

You might be sadly disappointed. You can't rely on a bunch of young players to win you a championship. You need a mix of young players and veterans. Also, we haven't seen ANYTHING from Rozier, Hunter and Mickey to know how good or bad they will bad. Where is all this optimism coming from? Not to mention James Young was madly inconsistent last year

[gpap]

This whole "Marcus Smart and James Young won't improve" stuff is absolutely hilarious. I guess the idea is that they sat around on their couches and played video games all off season.  In fact even in that scenario I might still expect them to be improved.

I am sure Smart will improve but I don't get where all these high hopes for James Young are coming from. Seriously, it's like some people feel is going to be the MVP this year. What has he shown so far to support all these high hopes?

[gpap]

The team looked like a lottery squad last year.

But something happened on the way to tanksville.

Team play is a new paradigm for many to comprehend.

The Celtics are rediscovering their legacy and going retro.

This year will be better than last year.

Their "legacy" is to have a bunch of bench players barely making the playoffs in a terrible conference? You do realize that the Celtics have the most HOFers of any franchise right? That most of them were high lotto picks?

He is referring to playing hard, as a team and getting the most out of their talent.

This team is extremely young, and building. Last year they barely made the playoffs, this year they will be better than that and the year after that they will be better than that.

Where's all of the improvement coming from?

Are you expecting huge leaps forward over the next two years from Smart and Young?  Are you hoping for Rozier, Hunter, or Mickey to turn into above average starters?

Um....yes.

Put down the rock brother. I have been posting on CB pretty much since Jeff uploaded it. I have posted on RealGM Celtics since Chris Wallace was our GM. Every year fans expect giant leaps from role players and rookies to become stud starters. Never happens. You either have what it takes to be a star in this league or not. Bottom line..

Oh yes. KG, Kobe, Jimmy Butler, Jeremy Lin, Chauncey Billups....nobody ever develops.


Youtube never has what I want when I want it. I wanted that short clip from Hamburger Hill where the drill instructor was like "I am not your brother."  They just never have it

It's quite a stretch to think that any of the young players on the Celts will develop into KG, Kobe, Billups or Butler. Guess it could happen, but a reach nonetheless.

Also, not quite sure why you brought Jeremy Lin's name up.

[MBunge]

It's certainly possible Boston could miss the playoffs next season.  If Bosh is healthy, Miami should be a lot better it's probable that teams like Orlando, Charlotte, the Knicks and even Philly will show some improvement and that could mean more losses for the Celtics.

But when someone throws the phrase "lotto squad" around, they're not referring to a team that's hovering around .500 and fighting for a playoff spot until the end of the regular season, are they?  That seems more like a phrase applied to teams who start 6-24 and are out of the playoffs before New Year's Day.  Is there any reason to think Boston is going to be that?

Mike

[aingeforthree]

I also think based on the free agent snubs that Ainge has come to the conclusion the only way we end up landing a star is through the draft.

On the contrary, signing vets to these large unguaranteed contracts signals to me that Ainge is not concerned with trying to get talent higher in the draft.  Nor does it seem like he's intent on signing second or third tier free agents, even if the player is young and might be a bargain long term. 

Instead, it seems he's focused entirely on setting himself up to make a blockbuster trade or two for an elite talent.  From what I can tell, all of the eggs are in that basket.  If no such trade materializes, we're basically left hoping that one of these guys selected in the mid to late 1st round turns into a star.

No we're not terrible. And that is the problem. We're mediocre. Fringe playoff team, going to he drafting 12-16 every year, watching FAs laugh in our face as they head elsewhere, as we pray for the trade of the century. We were promised fireworks two years in a row and ended up with Jack. We're literally in the worst place to be for a NBA franchise.

And the Nets have no incentive to tank and every in incentive to avoid embarrassment..

Gimme a break. To be in the worst place you have to have no assets, no youth to develop, and up against the cap.

So basically the Brooklyn Nets.

You are the complete opposite. You're wide open. Keep building through the draft.

A few problems with what you're saying

-Other than Smart, we have no assets.

-Having youth to develop is meaningless. You need to have players that can contribute now to win now.

-I actually like the guys we drafted but having "youth to develop" is in NO WAY a requirement for having a good team.

- No assets other than Smart ? That's not true. No GM in the game believes that. IT4 is an asset by himself, and you know it

- Nothing meaningless about developing talents like Young, Olynyk, Sullinger, and Smart. They proved your point wrong last year when they were winning and developing at the same time

- Never said it was required, just pointed out the transition. Develop your youth and try to win, that's the goal

The main reason behind our success in the 2nd half was Smart, Crowder, Bradley and picking up Isaiah.  Olynyk and Sully were injured for most of the 2nd half of the season and never really gained any consistency when they came back.  Young had literally NOTHING to do with our success last year as he showed how inconsistent of a shooter he was.

So are you saying Young can't develop into a player ? He's still younger than everyone you drafted this year. I wouldn't count him out

[TheFlex]

This whole "Marcus Smart and James Young won't improve" stuff is absolutely hilarious. I guess the idea is that they sat around on their couches and played video games all off season.  In fact even in that scenario I might still expect them to be improved.

I am sure Smart will improve but I don't get where all these high hopes for James Young are coming from. Seriously, it's like some people feel is going to be the MVP this year. What has he shown so far to support all these high hopes?

Never saw everyone say he was going to be MVP.

Young didn't get a fair shot at a successful rookie year when whiplash kept him out of the Summer League and then for a significant portion of December. He cooperated with management's request without complaint going back and forth between Maine and Boston last year and dominated the D League. Coaches have raved about his mental and physical improvement all summer. He's still younger than anyone on our Summer League time. I expect him to be a contributor this year.

[tankcity!]

Let me start with this: you can see LarBrd33's whole pessimistic philosophy on the C's played out perfectly here. Pretty much every other team gets the benefit of the doubt, and the C's get pessimism and one line lol

This is a completely fair point.   

i don't equate the addition of rookies projected in the 2nd round the same as bonafied NBA starters.  Boston swapped one mediocre starter (bass) for another (amir).... Beyond that we didn't do anything.  Other teams have made real additions.  I see this as a lotto team.

That's what Danny's praying for.

[gpap]

Let me start with this: you can see LarBrd33's whole pessimistic philosophy on the C's played out perfectly here. Pretty much every other team gets the benefit of the doubt, and the C's get pessimism and one line lol

This is a completely fair point.   

i don't equate the addition of rookies projected in the 2nd round the same as bonafied NBA starters.  Boston swapped one mediocre starter (bass) for another (amir).... Beyond that we didn't do anything.  Other teams have made real additions.  I see this as a lotto team.

That's what Danny's praying for.

Which now brings us to the next question

Who are the "can't miss" draft prospects for next year's draft?

[tankcity!]

Ben Simmons and the rest aren't great. It's supposed to be a weak draft.

[gpap]

Ben Simmons and the rest aren't great. It's supposed to be a weak draft.

Nice.

So we don't even have a draft pick to look forward in case we suck.

Sweet.

[Hemingway]

On paper at least, trying to be objective, I think you'd say this was a middle of the pack sort of team not a lotto team. On paper we should do around .500. We could do better or worse and thats what will determine if we have a good year or not.

I see no reason to be negative though. We should be slightly better for our first game this season then we were by the end of last regular season, and we were pretty good then.

We are not going the tank out like crazy for year route. I know it kills some of you. The problem with that plan is that while you are more likely to get a star with a top pick, you are also more likely to lose the star you get because it's hard to become a good team fast when your star is a kid. Our plan of being decent to good while we draft develop and deal needs a little more luck to get us that 1st star, but once we get him we will be in a much better position that if we had really tanked out.