Grizzlies Open To Kosta Koufos Sign-And-Trade

[Ogaju]

what would the Clippers have to offer in a sign and trade?

Danny, this is the Center you have been waiting for -- this is what you have amassed assets for -- make it happen.

If Doc wants to play, make him pay through the nose for Koufos.

The Grizz would be stupid to help out the Clips.  Losing Jordan, pretty much eliminates them as a championship contender.

Good point. Make it happen Danny.

[Who]

I'm still on board for adding a legit, physical 7-foot center. I'm not sold on Amir being a full-time option at the 5, and I view KO and Zeller as backups.

I have to confess that I am not a fan of Sullinger, and hope that Ainge manages to recoup some value for him this offseason. Would like to see Jerebko and Amir soak up the majority of the minutes at the 4.

The thing is, I don't see how you could play Amir and Koufos together very often at all.  Amir and Zeller will mostly operate in a timeshare playing next Sullinger, Olynyk, and Jerebko.  I doubt they'll be on the floor together very much.

Koufos is just not a need at this point.  I agree that Zeller is a backup, but Koufos is probably not your ideal starting center, either.  He too would probably play at most 24-26 minutes a game.

What about the Amir-Koufos tandem worries you? Is it Amir's ability to guard out to the perimeter? I think he has enough of a face-up game to keep the lanes open and give Koufos enough room to operate down low.

I think Amir Johnson's jump-shot is getting way too much credit on this forum over the last few days.

The stats being bandied about were FG% but do not mention volume:

10-16 feet = 38.5%
16-23 feet = 45.8%
3 Pointers  = 40.4%

Here is the volume

10-16 feet = 5 made jump shots
16-23 feet = 11 made jump shots
3 Pointers  = 19 made jump-shots

That is 16 two point jump-shots made in 75 games played.
35 jump-shots total outside of 10 feet. That is basically one every 2nd game.

Amir Johnson has done better in previous seasons and hit closer to 1 jump shot a game ... but this is not the type of threat that opponents worry about. Amir is the guy that opponents want to shoot the ball. That try to force him to shoot those shots. That leave him open to take those shots. But Amir rarely takes those shots because he does not think he can make enough of them. The shooting percentages are deceiving. Amir Johnson is one of the worst jump-shooting starting PFs in the league.

Amir Johnson is a (highly efficient and effective) garbage man. He takes the occasional jump-shot but that is not his game. And as you can see by the volume of jump-shots he makes, that is why Amir maintains such a high FG% (57% last year) because the vast majority of his shots are close to the basket (464 out of 519 FGAs within 10 feet of rim).

[Who]

Just to add on one last point ...

 It is going to be tough for Boston to play two well below average offensive big men together (Amir Johnson + Kosta Koufos) because of how limited Boston's perimeter players in creating offense.

The only above average perimeter scorer Boston has is Isaiah Thomas. Marcus Smart struggled all last year both as a scorer and as a playmaker. Basically a spot-up shooter. Bradley is a good jump-shooter but otherwise limited offensive player. Evan Turner is an inefficient scorer. Jae Crowder is very limited at SF. As is Gerald Wallace whenever he plays. The other guys are rookies / unproven youngsters.

That puts a huge amount of pressure on the big men to help compensate / counter-balance the perimeter player's lack of offensive punch. That is part of the reason why big man shooting and big man passing was so valuable to Boston's offense last season.

And it is why playing two offensively limited bigs like Amir (PF) and Koufos (C) together will be so difficult for Boston. It'll be fine in short doses ... but in large doses, it'll create just as many problems (offensively) [if not more] than it fixes (defensively).

[Smartacus]

Celtics have trade good will with the Grizz. Every player we've dealt to them in recent memory has produced in their system.

DA seems to work well with them.

[Celts Fan 508]

Just to add on one last point ...

 It is going to be tough for Boston to play two well below average offensive big men together (Amir Johnson + Kosta Koufos) because of how limited Boston's perimeter players in creating offense.

The only above average perimeter scorer Boston has is Isaiah Thomas. Marcus Smart struggled all last year both as a scorer and as a playmaker. Basically a spot-up shooter. Bradley is a good jump-shooter but otherwise limited offensive player. Evan Turner is an inefficient scorer. Jae Crowder is very limited at SF. As is Gerald Wallace whenever he plays. The other guys are rookies / unproven youngsters.

That puts a huge amount of pressure on the big men to help compensate / counter-balance the perimeter player's lack of offensive punch. That is part of the reason why big man shooting and big man passing was so valuable to Boston's offense last season.

And it is why playing two offensively limited bigs like Amir (PF) and Koufos (C) together will be so difficult for Boston. It'll be fine in short doses ... but in large doses, it'll create just as many problems (offensively) [if not more] than it fixes (defensively).

I agree, but I would still do it.  I think the Celts are still in the acquiring assets phase and Koufos is an asset that makes them better and improves their trade chips.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

I think whatever Tyler Zeller is doing right now can be done by Kosta Koufos, while adding a little better rim protection.

Do this Danny. This is atleast something.

[Megalodon]

Edite: wrong topic

[wdleehi]

Go for it.  Johnson is a short term player for the Celtics.  Kosta has the potential to fill a role on the Celtics for a long period of time. 

[ThaPreacher]

Just to add on one last point ...

 It is going to be tough for Boston to play two well below average offensive big men together (Amir Johnson + Kosta Koufos) because of how limited Boston's perimeter players in creating offense.

The only above average perimeter scorer Boston has is Isaiah Thomas. Marcus Smart struggled all last year both as a scorer and as a playmaker. Basically a spot-up shooter. Bradley is a good jump-shooter but otherwise limited offensive player. Evan Turner is an inefficient scorer. Jae Crowder is very limited at SF. As is Gerald Wallace whenever he plays. The other guys are rookies / unproven youngsters.

That puts a huge amount of pressure on the big men to help compensate / counter-balance the perimeter player's lack of offensive punch. That is part of the reason why big man shooting and big man passing was so valuable to Boston's offense last season.

And it is why playing two offensively limited bigs like Amir (PF) and Koufos (C) together will be so difficult for Boston. It'll be fine in short doses ... but in large doses, it'll create just as many problems (offensively) [if not more] than it fixes (defensively).

I agree, but I would still do it.  I think the Celts are still in the acquiring assets phase and Koufos is an asset that makes them better and improves their trade chips.

Koufos is an asset. Amir is an asset.
Boston should examine this.
What is the asking price?

[Geo123]

I like Koufos also.  Depends on the price but I think he's going to the Clips.

[Celts Fan 508]

Just to add on one last point ...

 It is going to be tough for Boston to play two well below average offensive big men together (Amir Johnson + Kosta Koufos) because of how limited Boston's perimeter players in creating offense.

The only above average perimeter scorer Boston has is Isaiah Thomas. Marcus Smart struggled all last year both as a scorer and as a playmaker. Basically a spot-up shooter. Bradley is a good jump-shooter but otherwise limited offensive player. Evan Turner is an inefficient scorer. Jae Crowder is very limited at SF. As is Gerald Wallace whenever he plays. The other guys are rookies / unproven youngsters.

That puts a huge amount of pressure on the big men to help compensate / counter-balance the perimeter player's lack of offensive punch. That is part of the reason why big man shooting and big man passing was so valuable to Boston's offense last season.

And it is why playing two offensively limited bigs like Amir (PF) and Koufos (C) together will be so difficult for Boston. It'll be fine in short doses ... but in large doses, it'll create just as many problems (offensively) [if not more] than it fixes (defensively).

I agree, but I would still do it.  I think the Celts are still in the acquiring assets phase and Koufos is an asset that makes them better and improves their trade chips.

Koufos is an asset. Amir is an asset.
Boston should examine this.
What is the asking price?

Probably some non guaranteed contracts or contracts expiring soon and some 2nds.  It can't be much as they don't have a need or want for him anymore.

[saltlover]

It should be noted the C's might have up to $8 mil in cap room left depending where the cap ends up. We can technically sign Crowder last, so that he only takes up space equal to his cap hold until he signs.  If Ainge wants Koufos, a sign-and-trade wouldn't be necessary.