Brad Stevens on areas C's need to improve

[Evantime34]

Honestly I think I agree with the approach. Sure I would love a rim protector, but it is always better to draft the best available talent rather than drafting for need. We need stars, regardless of position, if the C's have to choose between a rim protector who tops out as a good starter or a wing who could be an all star then you have to choose the wing.

I'm probably in the minority but I think scoring was a bigger problem (mostly for the starters) than the rim protection (although I expect this to improve internally with improvements in young players)

[Tr1boy]

Honestly I think I agree with the approach. Sure I would love a rim protector, but it is always better to draft the best available talent rather than drafting for need. We need stars, regardless of position, if the C's have to choose between a rim protector who tops out as a good starter or a wing who could be an all star then you have to choose the wing.

I'm probably in the minority but I think scoring was a bigger problem (mostly for the starters) than the rim protection (although I expect this to improve internally with improvements in young players)

When you get a rim protector that can stay on the floor, guys like IT , Smart, AB will not be as gassed on the offensive end. Think about how hard they have to work to prevent their man from diving in.   

We need a rim protector. You can't overload also unless the talent you are bringing in/drafting is a cut above.   

[GC003332]

There many different ways to skin a cat, this whole rim protection thing is overrated if you ask me, the great Bulls teams of the Jordan era had Cartwright/Longley as there starting centers.
If you have above average premier guys , which the Celtics do (Bradley / Smart ) , you get away with it to a certain extend.
What  'rim protection' did the Heat have on those recent championship teams?

[LilRip]

this C's team is so lacking in talent anyway. Rim protection is one of them but there a bunch of other important holes to fill too. For example, if we can get a real go-to scorer, I'd be happy.

[Tr1boy]

There many different ways to skin a cat, this whole rim protection thing is overrated if you ask me, the great Bulls teams of the Jordan era had Cartwright/Longley as there starting centers.
If you have above average premier guys , which the Celtics do (Bradley / Smart ) , you get away with it to a certain extend.
What  'rim protection' did the Heat have on those recent championship teams?

skin a cat?  that is animal cruelty man lol

of course when you have a Jordan, Lebron you can get away without rim protection.

But teams without those kind of players like SA, Dallas needed a rim protecting component to be able to win

AND if you have a very good rim protector you got a better chance to beat Lebron than if you don't

[Tr1boy]

this C's team is so lacking in talent anyway. Rim protection is one of them but there a bunch of other important holes to fill too. For example, if we can get a real go-to scorer, I'd be happy.

How many real go to scorers are there in the league??  Basically the few that exist are former #1, #5 picks.   You can win the way the recent Spurs have won by building a solid balanced , well coached team.

CBS is missing a rim protector that can stay on the floor.  If we add someone that can also operate from the post and pass out of the double team, IT , AB, Smart , Ko would have that much more space to shoot the ball

[Evantime34]

Honestly I think I agree with the approach. Sure I would love a rim protector, but it is always better to draft the best available talent rather than drafting for need. We need stars, regardless of position, if the C's have to choose between a rim protector who tops out as a good starter or a wing who could be an all star then you have to choose the wing.

I'm probably in the minority but I think scoring was a bigger problem (mostly for the starters) than the rim protection (although I expect this to improve internally with improvements in young players)

When you get a rim protector that can stay on the floor, guys like IT , Smart, AB will not be as gassed on the offensive end. Think about how hard they have to work to prevent their man from diving in.   

We need a rim protector. You can't overload also unless the talent you are bringing in/drafting is a cut above.   

I agree a rim protector is best for how the team is currently constructed. However, we don't know who will be on the team when the C's are contending again. We need to get the best available talent, on the chance that they could be the players you build around, not select someone who fits what we are now.

We need a player that dictates what we do in the future, not a player that caters to the present. If all else is equal I would love a rim protector, but we need to select the best player regardless of position.

[PhoSita]

The Celts were a spread the floor offense without any really great floor spacers, and nobody who is particularly good at creating outside shots for himself or others, aside from Isaiah Thomas.

Improving the shooting is definitely a good way to go for the team. 

Also improving on the boards could help; the Celts were a middle of the road team at best in that area.

Really this year's team had the correct type of players to execute Stevens's system, which allowed them to have as much success as they did.  The next task is to find ways to upgrade those pieces, because the quality / talent of the players was the problem.

[LilRip]

this C's team is so lacking in talent anyway. Rim protection is one of them but there a bunch of other important holes to fill too. For example, if we can get a real go-to scorer, I'd be happy.

How many real go to scorers are there in the league??  Basically the few that exist are former #1, #5 picks.   You can win the way the recent Spurs have won by building a solid balanced , well coached team.

CBS is missing a rim protector that can stay on the floor.  If we add someone that can also operate from the post and pass out of the double team, IT , AB, Smart , Ko would have that much more space to shoot the ball

There are a lot of scorers in this league. In this Finals alone, there's already Kevin Love, Lebron, Irving, JR Smith, Curry, and Klay. As a matter of fact, we have one in IT but he's better off as a 6th man.

And I get the feeling that you're severely underrating the 2013-2014 Spurs. They're not just some well-coached team of role players. That team still had Parker, Duncan, Ginobili (who turns it on exclusively for the playoffs) and the 2015 DPOY in Leonard. I don't think we have a player on the level of those 4. Not to say our players wouldn't make great Spurs (I think they would). They just wouldn't have replaced any of those 4 in the rotation during the 2014 playoff run.

Anyway, I'm not disagreeing that we need a rim protector. I'm just saying that this team lacks so much talent anyway that we can plug another hole now (e.g. scoring) and it'll still make a ton of sense.

[Tr1boy]

Honestly I think I agree with the approach. Sure I would love a rim protector, but it is always better to draft the best available talent rather than drafting for need. We need stars, regardless of position, if the C's have to choose between a rim protector who tops out as a good starter or a wing who could be an all star then you have to choose the wing.

I'm probably in the minority but I think scoring was a bigger problem (mostly for the starters) than the rim protection (although I expect this to improve internally with improvements in young players)

When you get a rim protector that can stay on the floor, guys like IT , Smart, AB will not be as gassed on the offensive end. Think about how hard they have to work to prevent their man from diving in.   

We need a rim protector. You can't overload also unless the talent you are bringing in/drafting is a cut above.   

I agree a rim protector is best for how the team is currently constructed. However, we don't know who will be on the team when the C's are contending again. We need to get the best available talent, on the chance that they could be the players you build around, not select someone who fits what we are now.

We need a player that dictates what we do in the future, not a player that caters to the present. If all else is equal I would love a rim protector, but we need to select the best player regardless of position.

i agree with what you are saying but again at 16 there is no player (not rim protector) that is cut above.    Also come FA time , there are many decent players but none you are going to overpay for. Or should.    And those players interested in coming onboard will also want to play with a rim protector/rebounder

It is amazing how good the Celts did last season without a proper rim protector, very good rebounder.   This overachievement can't go on.  Cavs figured out how to kill us, Hawks got figured out also.   

We get another BPA - scorer available we might be slightly better. A rim protector can make much bigger impact. Also don't forget guys like Sully, KO are unable to play comfortably bc they are playing out of position, trying to prevent drives but losing their man at the same time.  KO trying to grab offensive rebounds, block shots, instead of focusing on shooting the ball

we will see what happens. But if it came down to grabbing a slightly better BPA that can score but has no room to grow vs grabbing a rim protector/rebounder to replace Bass, Jereko, I would go with option 2

[PhoSita]

And I get the feeling that you're severely underrating the 2013-2014 Spurs.

I agree, at least in the sense that the Spurs still had Parker and Ginobili, who were both still superb scoring ball-handlers who could make something out of nothing, for themselves and others.

Not to mention Duncan, who can still be a force on the low block when he wants to, and Kawhi, whose evolution into a very good scorer as well as an insane perimeter defender is what propelled them past the Heat.

The idea that the Spurs won a title without any elite individual scorers is kind of ridiculous.  What they did is win without any guys who took a high volume of shots on a game-to-game basis.

[Tr1boy]

And I get the feeling that you're severely underrating the 2013-2014 Spurs.

I agree, at least in the sense that the Spurs still had Parker and Ginobili, who were both still superb scoring ball-handlers who could make something out of nothing, for themselves and others.

Not to mention Duncan, who can still be a force on the low block when he wants to, and Kawhi, whose evolution into a very good scorer as well as an insane perimeter defender is what propelled them past the Heat.

The idea that the Spurs won a title without any elite individual scorers is kind of ridiculous.  What they did is win without any guys who took a high volume of shots on a game-to-game basis.

it's not ridiculous.  Look at the Hawks this season.   When was Milsap ever that good before?

If the Hawks had a legit rim protector , no doubt in my mind they win at least 2 games vs the Cavs, then who knows.   They overachieved but the team was not in balance, lacking a rim protector or someone that can alter shots like Mozgov

Look Gino, Diaw are good players and added to Pops system. But it was also vice versa. They are good players just not that good that either (as a key player) can turnaround a bad team

[chambers]

this C's team is so lacking in talent anyway. Rim protection is one of them but there a bunch of other important holes to fill too. For example, if we can get a real go-to scorer, I'd be happy.

How many real go to scorers are there in the league??  Basically the few that exist are former #1, #5 picks.   You can win the way the recent Spurs have won by building a solid balanced , well coached team.

CBS is missing a rim protector that can stay on the floor.  If we add someone that can also operate from the post and pass out of the double team, IT , AB, Smart , Ko would have that much more space to shoot the ball

The Spurs had Duncan averaging 20 points 10 rebounds and protecting the rim. He was a top 5 center last season.  Parker was a top 5 pg and Kawahi was a top 25 player.

we need talent like that first, which is why we will probably take the best player available before filling needs. Perhaps the Clips pick or a 2nd rounder on a project big man, but it's going to be a year or two of steep learning for whoever comes in at that point.
Most late first rounders/2nd rounders turn into Ian Mahinmi types at best.
This team needs core talent which we are severely lacking at the moment.

[Tr1boy]

this C's team is so lacking in talent anyway. Rim protection is one of them but there a bunch of other important holes to fill too. For example, if we can get a real go-to scorer, I'd be happy.

How many real go to scorers are there in the league??  Basically the few that exist are former #1, #5 picks.   You can win the way the recent Spurs have won by building a solid balanced , well coached team.

CBS is missing a rim protector that can stay on the floor.  If we add someone that can also operate from the post and pass out of the double team, IT , AB, Smart , Ko would have that much more space to shoot the ball

The Spurs had Duncan averaging 20 points 10 rebounds and protecting the rim. He was a top 5 center last season.  Parker was a top 5 pg and Kawahi was a top 25 player.

we need talent like that first, which is why we will probably take the best player available before filling needs. Perhaps the Clips pick or a 2nd rounder on a project big man, but it's going to be a year or two of steep learning for whoever comes in at that point.
Most late first rounders/2nd rounders turn into Ian Mahinmi types at best.
This team needs core talent which we are severely lacking at the moment.

The issue is we have the 16 pick. Not top 7 pick.     This years draft the talent level are similar from about 14 to 33 .   You could get Portis at 16 but Looney at 23 might end up becoming a better pro.   Wood at 27 might end up becoming better than Anderson at 19

So you have a little more room to draft based out of need imo. Even at 16 if we get a SG (BPA) i'm really hoping that Danny grabs even a Mahinmi type of guy at 28 or at worse 33.   Unless you want to draft 3 SGs or SFs, have 2 of them playing at the D league or draft and stash and have teams drive in against us at will. Especially when they been outplayed for 3 quarters , then the coach instructs them to just keep driving bc they have nobody to block a shot. 

[PhoSita]

And I get the feeling that you're severely underrating the 2013-2014 Spurs.

I agree, at least in the sense that the Spurs still had Parker and Ginobili, who were both still superb scoring ball-handlers who could make something out of nothing, for themselves and others.

Not to mention Duncan, who can still be a force on the low block when he wants to, and Kawhi, whose evolution into a very good scorer as well as an insane perimeter defender is what propelled them past the Heat.

The idea that the Spurs won a title without any elite individual scorers is kind of ridiculous.  What they did is win without any guys who took a high volume of shots on a game-to-game basis.

it's not ridiculous.  Look at the Hawks this season.   When was Milsap ever that good before?

The Hawks struggled in the playoffs because they lack exactly what I was talking about with San Antonio -- multiple guys who could turn it on and score 1-on-1 while still operating within the spacing / ball-movement system.

Teague, Korver, Millsap, Horford are all excellent players, but arguably none of them is on the same level in terms of individual scoring ability as Parker, Ginobili, Kawhi, and Duncan.


Put another way, what made those Spurs so great is that, like this year's Warriors, they beat you in a number of ways.  They could play slower, inside-out basketball with Duncan on the block, they could play up-tempo, fast-break basketball, they could whip the ball around and find the open man three passes away, and they could rely on one or more of their stars to create a decent shot late in games when things ground to a halt.

That's the extra gear /  versatility the Hawks lacked.