Lowe/Flannery - "Is Marcus Smart really untradeable?"

[LarBrd33]

Was just listening to Zach Lowe's podcast with Paul Flannery:  http://espn.go.com/espnradio/grantland/player?id=12976115

The highlight for me was the discussion about Marcus Smart.  It echos many of the sentiments I've been expressing here and I think it's really important for Celtic fans to think about.

First for context:  They speculate about whether the Celtics will go after Love (obviously they will) and how amazing a fit Love would be in the Celtics system.   Then, Lowe poses the question that makes many Celtic fans salivate... how prepared is the organization to go All-In for DeMarcus Cousins?  The podcast is definitely worth a listen.  Celtic discussion starts around the 31 min mark.

I'll paraphrase a bit and highlight key quotes, but here's the relevant discussion about Marcus Smart in relation to the rare opportunity of landing a game-changing talent like Cousins:

Lowe:  I think the question the Celtics will have to ask, at some point, is... "Is Marcus Smart, really untradeable?"... cuz I mean, these other players are "nice" ... Olynyk is "nice" and Sully's "nice" if he can get himself in shape... and James Young, we don't know what he is... and they have picks... and maybe the picks are "good" and maybe most of the picks are 15th and higher...  Smart is the one that teams are going to ask for in the initial round of conversations.... and some of the teams will just hang up if Smart is out.

Lowe:  I think Marcus Smart is going to be really good... I love his defense, I love his positional versatility on defense, I love the fact that he shot 34% from three when people thought he couldn't shoot AT ALL...  that's a great Step 1 for him...  I just don't know what he's going to be.  I don't know if Marcus Smart will ever be the team's number 1 ball-handling option in the NBA. 

Flannery:  If you're making a list of the Celtics top assets, Marcus Smart is Number 1... so if I'm trading a franchise player, that's absolutely the first guy I want [in a trade package from Boston].   

Lowe:  I just think you have to be very careful... for example, the Nets really blew it with Mason Plumlee by making him untradeable when they had a chance to get rid of Deron Williams.  You just have to careful.  If you have a chance to land a franchise player, you have to be careful. 

Flannery:  One thing we know about Danny is that nobody is untradeable.... he's basically traded everyone he's ever had... sometimes twice. 

So what's your thoughts on this?  I've repeatedly said that while I see Marcus as the least likely to be shopped, I see him as the most likely to be traded if we land a star.  I just can't imagine a trade for a star without the inclusion of Marcus Smart.   We're likely getting outbid anyways by teams have top 4 picks or star prospects, but if we have any shot at all... Smart has to be part of that deal.   I've said it a bunch of times now.  Smart is a B- asset in a sea of C's and D's.   While I'd prefer keeping him, I think he's more than likely the focal point of any trade package that lands us a star.       

 
 

[BigAlTheFuture]

Yeah, there's no chance we trade for a Demarcus Cousins type AND keep Smart, which is a bummer. If you want value, you gotta give up value.

[Who]

No way. If a young All-Star is on the table then Smart is available.

[gpap]

I like Smart but if I can net a guy like Cousins or a similar star player for him in return, I do it in a heartbeat.

[wiley]

Yeah, there's no chance we trade for a Demarcus Cousins type AND keep Smart, which is a bummer. If you want value, you gotta give up value.

I disagree.  Normally I think that would be correct.  But it's not often a team has as many first rounders in their possession as the Celtics, including from a team going backwards at the moment:  Nets.

So, normally you'd have to include Smart, but in this case it would be a bunch of other players plus a ton of picks for someone like Cousins.  If they say no, then they don't get three of our non-Smart starters plus 4 firsts (for Cousins) or whatever...

I do think Danny would trade Smart if he felt like it.  Just don't think he's going to feel iike it, because we'd be giving up not just Smart but still a bunch of picks.  We'd be the Kings East...if you want to trade for Cousins it should be to pair him with Smart.  Otherwise just stay on the current course.

[alldaboston]

Yes yes good sir. However, we must remember that we have Danny Ainge, the master of trickery. He will confound the opposition's GM and be able to get DeMarcus AND keep Smart.

[Who]

I think that most trade packages (for top talent) Ainge offers will be built around future picks rather than current players. I think the current players in the deal will be secondary assets rather than the headliner in (or main focus of) a deal.

I do not think Smart or any other Celtics player has done enough to be the main focus for a GM in a trade where he is giving up top level talent. It'll be the draft picks they are after.

Consequently, I think Ainge has a good chance of holding onto his most prized players and offering combination of alternatives instead. Say giving up Olynyk / Sully + Bradley instead of Smart. Refusing to offer Smart. I think Ainge can, should and will play hard ball over Smart and that he will most likely be successful in keeping Smart off the table.

But yeah, if it becomes a deal-breaker (which I doubt), Smart will be made available.

[Who]

On a related note: I am not expecting Boston to make any huge trades this summer.

[1] There seems to be less talent available this summer (in trades) relative to previous years (with everybody readying themselves for huge cap rise)
[2] As I said above, I don't think any C's players have done enough to convince GMs they are a star in the making and consequently Boston's trade offerings are only so-so. If a top star does become available, Boston will likely be out-bid by some other team.

I think this summer is more about (a) the draft (hopefully trading up!) and then (b) about free agent signings. Then enter next season with new roster. Look to make bigger trade at next year's trade deadline or following summer.

I can see Ainge making small to medium level trades but I do not expect Ainge to acquire any All-Stars in a trade this summer. Draft and free agency look Boston's best options for now.

[jpotter33]

I'm probably one of Smart's biggest fans on this forum, but even I would, begrudgingly, be willing to include him for a star-caliber player like DMC. I wouldn't like it, but that's the price to pay for talent. I'm not sure how many here would actually pull Smart off of the table unconditionally.

[max215]

Thanks for posting a quick summary LarBrd. Personally, I love Smart, but is he untradeable? No, nobody on this roster is untradable. However, the only way Smart is gone is for a PROVEN All-Star IMO. If we pull off a miracle and get Boogie, I'd say it's a 95% chance that Smart is the centerpiece. If not, we will trade the ENTIRE treasure chest, all of the BRK picks, our picks, the Mavs pick, along with KO/Sully. That only happens if the Kings are even more of a poorly run organization than we already believe them to be. As I said earlier (and many times across the blog), I love Smart and don't really want to part with him. But for Boogie, parting with Smart might be a necessary evil.

[danglertx]

The problem with trading picks for really good players is that your picks are inevitably going to be higher when you acquire a star player.  Having someone else's picks in this case is MUCH more desirable.  Sending picks from someone in your division that this new guy can beat up on to make those picks even better is the best case scenario.

That said, I just don't think we will send what Sactown is looking for in a deal.  Those picks could turn out to be too good and there are just enough red flags on Cousins that make him not worth it.  I don't think he is a franchise changing type of player anyway, at least he hasn't been for the Kings and he doesn't strike me as the kind of guy other players want to play with.

I'm sure IT has given Ainge his assessment of DeMarcus, what that is I don't know.

[PhoSita]

He's definitely not untradeable.  But the Celts would need to be getting back a potential cornerstone player, because Smart is the closest thing they have to that right now.

[byennie]

It's a domino thing, I think. IF you get Love, you deal Smart + something for Cousins and keep making moves. That would be a championship level front-line and we would have enough pieces to fill out the roster. For example:

1) Sign Love
2) Move Wallace with a pick
3) Trade for Cousins (Smart + future picks)
4) Sign Crowder if a reasonable deal

Now you're right around ~$67M and a roster of

Thomas / Bradley
Bradley / Young / #16?
Crowder / Turner
Love / Sully
Cousins / Zeller / KO / #28?

Probably at that point, you move Olynyk and/or Sully and sign some veterans. Then hit the FA market again next summer with max money.

That said, I'd love to keep Smart and have the dream of elite defense PLUS a killer front-court, but it seems far-fetched unless we can pull off something like Young, Sully + a ton of draft picks.

In that case, (let's say we deal Young, Sully, #16, all of the Brooklyn picks, and the Dallas pick) it could be more like:

Smart / Thomas
Bradley / #28
Crowder / Turner
Love / KO
Cousins / Zeller

+ #33, veteran signing

[crimson_stallion]

I'm probably one of Smart's biggest fans on this forum, but even I would, begrudgingly, be willing to include him for a star-caliber player like DMC. I wouldn't like it, but that's the price to pay for talent. I'm not sure how many here would actually pull Smart off of the table unconditionally.

This - basically the exact words I was about to say.

I'd hate to see Smart go, love everything about that kid.  He has everything you love to see in a young player - work ethic, tougness, leadership skills, unselfishness, coachability, a willingness to do all the dirty work. 

But if I could land a Demarcus Cousins / Lamarcus Aldridge talent by trading out Smart, then I'd have to do it.

For a guy like Kevin Love, Greg Monroe or Marc Gasol probably not, as I still don't feel those guys are dominant enough 1-on-1 to be able to carry at team as a #1 option.  But a DMC / LMA caliber talent, definitely.

[csfansince60s]

While I would include a Smart in a trade for Cousins, I'd RATHER sign Monroe and keep Smart.

If you had Monroe, would you trade him and Smart  and a bunch of picks as well as at least one of KO/Sully/Zeller for Cousins? I wouldn't! So to me it's better to have Monroe and keep smart and all our assets.

By signing Monroe, you still have all the other assets we currently have to build around Monroe and Smart. In addition, things are more attractive for Love to come here. I know people will moan about the D or lack thereof that many will anticipate with a Monroe/Love front court, but between the inside outside game that they would provide on O and the rebounding both offensively and defensively, those will more than offset tha expected lack of D.

Even if we didn't sign Love in addition to Monroe, we have tremendous flexibility and assets to move up/trade for accomplished vets.