Author Topic: Let's build the Warriors Eastside  (Read 14362 times)

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Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #120 on: June 01, 2015, 12:59:34 AM »

Offline max215

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It has nothing to do with that. I totally disagree. I'd say noone in the league is a better passer than Magic johnson either.  Chris Paul might have a better argument than Curry vs Bird but I still disagree.  Again Magic and his assortment of passes and ability to dominate a game that way at a high level over a period of time.

Rondo had some of that but not on that level over that period.  Rondo was a better passer than Chris Paul.  Same argument but Rondo isn't near that level for the time.

The Bird and Magic arguments are fundamentally different though. Magic's dominance as a passer can be quantified, his APG is way higher than anyone else in history. You have no numbers to back up your claims about Bird.
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Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #121 on: June 01, 2015, 01:16:47 AM »

Offline walker834

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All I know is I keep that same argument with everything. It has very little to do with the team I root for.  It's like Russell vs jordan.  It's really difficult to compare players from different time periods. Russell dominated a league rebounding the ball that was somewhat undersized outside of Chamberlain.  He was also more defensive oriented and won games in different ways.  jordan was more offensively geared with roleplayers arond him and a very good defensive player himself.  Russell has more championships. I don't disrespect either.  I think jordan is sometimes somewhat overrated bcause of teh time period he played in but it was also very difficult for him to get championships early on because of teams like the Lakers and Celtics.

It's the same with anything.  joe Montana.  Dan Marino. I think if anything Marino gets the shaft sometimes because statistically as a passer he was completely dominating a league that was not like that at the time. Guys like Brady and Manning are and are winning championships but i give Marino his due.  I don't discount Brady or Manning either.  Or MOntana just because the style of play was different and he doesn't have the numbers. The same can be said about Emmitt Smith or Sanders. Two running backs playing at the same time.  Two very different situations and style of play. Both great runningbacks. I don't sit here and say Emmitt wasn't deserving and I don't say that Sanders doesn't deserve his due either. 

I try to be fair is all. I don't think i'm absolutely right.  I don't know everything but I try to be fair and see things for how they are.  It's a blessing and a curse I tell you lol.

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #122 on: June 01, 2015, 01:29:10 AM »

Offline walker834

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My response to this thread, because I don't want to get it off topic more than I already have, was I don't think building like the warriors works because we don't have Curry.  The entire team goes through him they have Klay Thompson and Green.  We have Isiah Thomas who could make it interesting that way somewhat. I wouldnt mind getting a sf more like Green on this team.  That's why I like Crowder.  Green is even better.  Unless a guy like the next Larry Bird comes along though. I don't see that though. That's why I think ainge is drafting guys like james young and taking chances on young small forwards that are halfway decent.  jeff green was the same t hing. Crowder etc.  Draymond would be an upgrade over Crowder.  Isiah is not in Curry's class but that's the point is to upgrade.

I think our team is better served getting a big man down low though. Be a more balanced team and be stronger down low.  The Warriors have great guard play and are weak inside.

I'd still be looking for that Larry Bird sf and center.  That's just me.  But if we could get Draymond ..

Draymond would be a really good signing and get a center too on this team to go with Smart and Thomas and guys like Bradley. 

We sign Draymond I would let Crowder walk though. They are redundant. I would sign Draymond and bring Young along as a shooter.   Save money that way vs reupping Crowder.

That would be a good move for the celtics.  I still think Crowder might come along and be a draymond kind of guy but Ainge has been kind of spinning his wheels there. jeff green wasnt it.  Crowder could be.  Draymond Green we know what he is.

I think Isiah and Smart are keepers for the time being.

If I could build the celtics like this today it would go something like this

Isiah
Smart Bradley or  Young
Draymond Crowder or Young
Sully/KO  Kevin Love??
Draft a center or sign someone in the interm to be a rim protector.

I would keep james young just because he can play sg and sf.  Smart ultimately may be our pg as well.

...

I really like Draymond Green as a player but also feel like we might be sellling ourselves short here a bit.  Unless we are getting Kevin Love.   Ben Simmons guys like that might actually be Larry Bird.

If I'm making anyones faces melt my apologies.  It's not even like that.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2015, 02:22:30 AM by walker834 »

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #123 on: June 02, 2015, 01:28:46 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Back on the derail for a second, Ric Bucher had this story re: Curry's shooting. It is one of the rarest of rarities -- a Bleacher Report article worth reading.
Quote
the assignment: Explore the notion that Warriors guard Stephen Curry is the greatest shooter in NBA history.

Initial reaction: This will be easy. Make a claim about someone being the greatest ever—it doesn't really matter what the topic is—and you can warm yourself by the outrage that follows. Accomplished NBA marksmen in particular, past and present, would bury the idea faster than a wide-open jumper.

Five of them, spanning 50-plus years of NBA history, responded to that claim: Rick Barry, Kiki Vandeweghe, Chuck "The Rifleman" Person, Dana Barros and Steve Nash.

Surely they would not all be prisoners of the moment, even if that moment has lasted about three seasons now, representing Curry's streak leading the league in both three-pointers taken and made. Surely the reverse off-hand shots glancing high off the backboard before floating down through the net or made three-pointers launched in the shadow of a defender, an expiring clock and the game's outcome would not unduly sway them.

Surely someone would point out that defensive rules have changed, that it's infinitely easier to get off shots now than a few decades ago, that someone as slight as Curry would've had to spend a year or two in the weight room before he could hope to compete in the NBA against the likes of Michael Jordan and Derek Harper and Gary Payton free to hand-check to their heart's content.

Or surely someone would point out that he is only in his sixth year, that proclaiming anyone the best the NBA ever has seen—especially someone whose third season was reduced to 26 games because of ankle issues—after such a relatively modest sample size would be premature.

Whether driven by ego or insight, surely someone would insist they played with or against someone better than Curry.

Nope. Fit Vandeweghe and Co. for proverbial orange jump suits along with everyone else who is convinced that when it comes to launching a pebbled leather sphere through a steel rim suspended 10 feet in the air, no one has done it more ways, from more places, with more numbing consistency and accuracy than Wardell Stephen Curry II. Ever.

Quote
"I played HORSE with Nash and he's the best I've played with," Vandeweghe said. "Steph reminds me of Steve in some ways."

"Comparing year to year, people at their peak, I've never seen anyone better," Vandeweghe said. "The difficulty of some of the shots he makes is incredible. He makes shots I wouldn't even think of taking, and I took a lot of shots. He has a certain body and court awareness. He always knows where the basket is. His fundamentals are as good as anyone I've seen—Dell's form is actually more textbook because his release point was higher—and no matter where he is, he can always get off a good shot."

Quote
Nash has no problem conceding the title to Curry.

"The only pause I have is from fear of being ignorant," he said. "Am I missing someone? Does he need to play longer or do it longer? Does he have to do it in the playoffs more years? But my first reaction is, 'Why not?' He's as good as anyone I can think of on every level—pure shooting, array of shots, percentage, getting hot, plays to the end—he checks all the boxes."

Nash discounted the value of his superior percentages—listen up, ye who believe numbers are infallible and efficiency is everything—because he approached the game differently and was sometimes chastised for it.

"He's probably going to shoot a lower percentage than me his whole career because he's going to take more shots and he should," Nash said. "It's just a difference in mentality. I would shoot a higher percentage than Steph because I was much more conservative. I would try to shoot as high a percentage as possible to save shots for my teammates and then shoot more in the fourth quarter. I had coaches tell me I was hurting our team at times by trying to set up my teammates, but I always thought I got it back by how I made them feel and incorporated them into the offensive scheme and the chemistry of the team. He's capable of that, but he's more inclined to score. There are things he can do that I can't. He's such a beautiful shooter with such an array of shots and such a quick release, you wouldn't want to take that away from him at all.

"Steph takes it to another level," Nash said. "I was able to do it going left and right, and we can both do it at speed, but I was always trying to get to the three-point line. He can do it from deeper and, frankly, I never took a step-back. He has no trouble taking a step-back and making it. You add that to all the other shots. It could be a clincher in this game of deciding who's the best."
"Truly, from the eye test, he's the greatest there's ever been."


Quote
Both Barros and Person played the majority of their careers before the league eliminated the illegal defense rules in 2001 and essentially outlawed hand-checking in 2004. That meant Barros, a career 41.1 percent three-point shooter over 14 seasons and listed as 5'11" and 163 pounds, had to learn how to get his shot off against defenders who could legally use their size and strength as advantages.

"I had to learn a new definition of what being open meant," Barros said. "I'll never forget Michael Jordan enveloping my whole waist with his hand, directing me and saying, 'You're going nowhere, Little Man.' Every time I received the ball in the open court I'd run as fast as I could. Once I got everybody afraid of my speed, I could pull up at the three-point line and have space to get my shot."

Despite Curry's equally slight frame (6'3", 185 pounds), Barros is convinced his ball-handling skills and quick release would've translated in the black-and-bluer '90s. "What he's doing would be amazing and unstoppable in any era," Barros said.

Quote
Bird, Miller, Allen and Glen Rice are on Person's personal all-time shooters card, but Curry stands above them all. "I don't think there's ever been anybody better," he said. "He can shoot the ball quicker than the spot-up guys. That's unprecedented."

Quote
[Barry] didn't outright dismiss Curry's claim to a mythic best-shooter-ever title, nor did he nominate someone else. He did raise some fair points—noting that the Atlanta Hawks' Kyle Korver has led the league in three-point shooting percentage the last two years and insisting "that there were probably a lot of" players in his era that were better mid-range shooters than Curry—but he took greatest exception to the all-encompassing aspect of the title.

"You can't even do it because you can't compare guys who played before the three-point line was introduced," said Barry, a 12-time All-Star—four times in the ABA—who led the Warriors to their lone championship in 1975. His last NBA season, '79-80, was the league's first with a three-point line adopted from the ABA. "You can only pick from the modern era," he said. "I had to learn how to shoot that shot."

While Barry might abstain from the all-time shooter platitudes, he, too, admires Curry's flare for the dramatic. "It's the way he does it," Barry said. "It's such a quick release with range. And his confidence is off the charts. He's fun to watch. And he's made himself into a great basketball player. He's a shooter, a scorer and a facilitator."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2482473-is-stephen-curry-the-best-shooter-ever-yes-say-many-of-nbas-all-time-marksmen

¯\_(*-*)_/¯
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Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #124 on: June 26, 2015, 06:18:14 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 Here we come. Warriors Eastside! Who needs big guys anyway, In the "New Nba"

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #125 on: September 15, 2018, 08:27:20 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 This thread was made in May of 2015. Crazy enough let's look at the 2015 Warriors and the 2018 Celtics three years later.

 Warriors

Curry
Thompson
Green
Barnes
Iggy
Bogut
Livingston
David Lee
Speights
Barbosa
Justin Holliday
Ezeli

Celtics

Irving
Hayward
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Baynes
Smart
Rozier
Morris
Theis
Semi
Williams


 How crazy is it that Danny built a better roster than the 2015 Warriors in three short years.

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #126 on: September 15, 2018, 08:28:47 PM »

Online gouki88

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 This thread was made in May of 2015. Crazy enough let's look at the 2015 Warriors and the 2018 Celtics three years later.

 Warriors

Curry
Thompson
Green
Barnes
Iggy
Bogut
Livingston
David Lee
Speights
Barbosa
Justin Holliday
Ezeli

Celtics

Irving
Hayward
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Baynes
Smart
Rozier
Morris
Theis
Semi
Williams


 How crazy is it that Danny built a better roster than the 2015 Warriors in three short years.
Insane. DA’s work over the last few years since Rondo was traded has been awesome.

Love the fact that both teams featured Aussie big men

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #127 on: September 16, 2018, 12:14:54 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 This thread was made in May of 2015. Crazy enough let's look at the 2015 Warriors and the 2018 Celtics three years later.

 Warriors

Curry
Thompson
Green
Barnes
Iggy
Bogut
Livingston
David Lee
Speights
Barbosa
Justin Holliday
Ezeli

Celtics

Irving
Hayward
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Baynes
Smart
Rozier
Morris
Theis
Semi
Williams


 How crazy is it that Danny built a better roster than the 2015 Warriors in three short years.
Insane. DA’s work over the last few years since Rondo was traded has been awesome.

Love the fact that both teams featured Aussie big men



 Tp for recognizing Danny's genius.

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #128 on: September 16, 2018, 12:16:20 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 2015 Celtics

 .   Player
0   Avery Bradley
63   Coty Clarke
99   Jae Crowder
28   R.J. Hunter
8   Jonas Jerebko
90   Amir Johnson
42   David Lee
55   Jordan Mickey
41   Kelly Olynyk
12   Terry Rozier
36   Marcus Smart
7   Jared Sullinger
4   Isaiah Thomas
11   Evan Turner
13   James Young
44   Tyler Zeller

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #129 on: September 16, 2018, 04:03:21 PM »

Offline rondofan1255

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 This thread was made in May of 2015. Crazy enough let's look at the 2015 Warriors and the 2018 Celtics three years later.

 Warriors

Curry
Thompson
Green
Barnes
Iggy
Bogut
Livingston
David Lee
Speights
Barbosa
Justin Holliday
Ezeli

Celtics

Irving
Hayward
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Baynes
Smart
Rozier
Morris
Theis
Semi
Williams


 How crazy is it that Danny built a better roster than the 2015 Warriors in three short years.

It's ridiculous.


 2015 Celtics

 .   Player
0   Avery Bradley
63   Coty Clarke
99   Jae Crowder
28   R.J. Hunter
8   Jonas Jerebko
90   Amir Johnson
42   David Lee
55   Jordan Mickey
41   Kelly Olynyk
12   Terry Rozier
36   Marcus Smart
7   Jared Sullinger
4   Isaiah Thomas
11   Evan Turner
13   James Young
44   Tyler Zeller

Speechless!

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #130 on: September 16, 2018, 05:32:00 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Let's just build the NBA champion Boston Celtics and forget about the flippin Warriors.
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Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #131 on: September 17, 2018, 12:37:55 AM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Let's just build the NBA champion Boston Celtics and forget about the flippin Warriors.

Thank You. The Boston Celtics do not genuflect to other league teams in some pathetic effort to beat them at their own game. The Great Celtic teams had their own style and won titles playing our game. Recently, however, we have had Danny Boy make some moves in a bad attempt to match up with another teams style. Bringing in Jeff Green and shipping out Kendrick Perkins was the worst trade he has made. He traded away the one advantage that Celtic group had - interior defense, rebounding, mental toughness and intimidation so we could be as good as Miami at playing an athletic, finesse style that Danny has always seemed to favor.                                                                                                                         
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Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #132 on: September 17, 2018, 01:02:41 AM »

Online gouki88

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Let's just build the NBA champion Boston Celtics and forget about the flippin Warriors.

Thank You. The Boston Celtics do not genuflect to other league teams in some pathetic effort to beat them at their own game. The Great Celtic teams had their own style and won titles playing our game. Recently, however, we have had Danny Boy make some moves in a bad attempt to match up with another teams style. Bringing in Jeff Green and shipping out Kendrick Perkins was the worst trade he has made. He traded away the one advantage that Celtic group had - interior defense, rebounding, mental toughness and intimidation so we could be as good as Miami at playing an athletic, finesse style that Danny has always seemed to favor.                                                                                                                       
Trading away Perk wasn't a bad move at all. Perk was absolutely shot, and never returned to the guy he was with us. Jeff Green was a solid player with us as a starter, if frustrating. If Shaq doesn't go down then nobody would care about losing Perk

Re: Let's build the Warriors Eastside
« Reply #133 on: September 17, 2018, 09:46:28 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Let's just build the NBA champion Boston Celtics and forget about the flippin Warriors.

Thank You. The Boston Celtics do not genuflect to other league teams in some pathetic effort to beat them at their own game. The Great Celtic teams had their own style and won titles playing our game. Recently, however, we have had Danny Boy make some moves in a bad attempt to match up with another teams style. Bringing in Jeff Green and shipping out Kendrick Perkins was the worst trade he has made. He traded away the one advantage that Celtic group had - interior defense, rebounding, mental toughness and intimidation so we could be as good as Miami at playing an athletic, finesse style that Danny has always seemed to favor.                                                                                                                       
Trading away Perk wasn't a bad move at all. Perk was absolutely shot, and never returned to the guy he was with us. Jeff Green was a solid player with us as a starter, if frustrating. If Shaq doesn't go down then nobody would care about losing Perk

Yeah the remainder of Perk's career was a steady slide out of the league, starting in those playoffs for OKC. And we had basically zero backup wings after Marquis Daniels had that scary neck injury.

It's not going to make a dent though. Sometimes grievances take on a life of their own.