Author Topic: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game  (Read 17171 times)

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Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #75 on: May 28, 2015, 09:45:02 PM »

Offline Eja117

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Notice nobody answers the questions.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #76 on: May 28, 2015, 09:51:27 PM »

Offline Who

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I see Olynyk's value more in team offense than as a go-to guy. Someone who is at his best as a 3rd or 4th scoring option on the floor. Someone who can stretch the court and pull an opposing big man away from the basket. Someone who can provide high post passing and facilitate the offense. Someone who can pump fake and drive against a scrambling defense. Someone who can drive and kick in those situations or sometimes finish himself either with a pull up J or getting all the way to the basket.

I do not see him as a one-on-one type of scorer or playmaker.

I see Olynyk's value as a passer and as a scorer coming more in team offense type situations where he is a supplementary scorer & playmaker.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #77 on: May 28, 2015, 09:52:45 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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He'll look perfect in a Kings uniform.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #78 on: May 28, 2015, 10:29:45 PM »

Offline loco_91

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

y u mad?

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #79 on: May 28, 2015, 10:30:38 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

Kelly generally doesn't draw doubles when he gets in the lane.  That's why he scores fairly efficiently when he gets in there. 

He is a good passer, but he doesn't seem to be a great passer off the drive.  I believe that one of the next steps in his development will be to get better at making reads off the bounce and finding teammates when the help comes. 

The other offensive skill that I feel he really needs to improve on is the midrange game, which is almost non-existent.  He's good at driving and finishing at the rim, and he's good at shooting the three pointer.

That's nice.  Those are the two most efficient shots in basketball.  The midrange two is the least efficient.  Still, though, I feel it would help his overall game tremendously if, instead of trying to get all the way to the rim every time he gets into the lane, if he just learned to pull up and hit a little midrange shot. 

That's my best effort at answering your very leading questions. 
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #80 on: May 28, 2015, 10:33:11 PM »

Offline Eja117

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

Kelly generally doesn't draw doubles when he gets in the lane.  That's why he scores fairly efficiently when he gets in there. 

He is a good passer, but he doesn't seem to be a great passer off the drive.  I believe that one of the next steps in his development will be to get better at making reads off the bounce and finding teammates when the help comes. 

The other offensive skill that I feel he really needs to improve on is the midrange game, which is almost non-existent.  He's good at driving and finishing at the rim, and he's good at shooting the three pointer.

That's nice.  Those are the two most efficient shots in basketball.  The midrange two is the least efficient.  Still, though, I feel it would help his overall game tremendously if, instead of trying to get all the way to the rim every time he gets into the lane, if he just learned to pull up and hit a little midrange shot. 

That's my best effort at answering your very leading questions.
He needs to improve? I'll agree to that. He shows no signs of it, but I'd agree to it

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #81 on: May 28, 2015, 10:34:44 PM »

Offline Eja117

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

y u mad?
I get annoyed when the Celts don't get their money's worth out of a guy and when he doesn't act like he cares about that. In the mean time wake me up if he ever seems to be the player who is playing hardest on the court for most of a game. It'll never happen and certainly not when Marcus Smart is around. On a good day he hustles like a 108 year old Galapagos tortoise who sees lettuce 50 feet away.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #82 on: May 28, 2015, 10:38:00 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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I see Olynyk's value more in team offense than as a go-to guy. Someone who is at his best as a 3rd or 4th scoring option on the floor. Someone who can stretch the court and pull an opposing big man away from the basket. Someone who can provide high post passing and facilitate the offense. Someone who can pump fake and drive against a scrambling defense. Someone who can drive and kick in those situations or sometimes finish himself either with a pull up J or getting all the way to the basket.

I do not see him as a one-on-one type of scorer or playmaker.

I see Olynyk's value as a passer and as a scorer coming more in team offense type situations where he is a supplementary scorer & playmaker.

I would agree with almost all of this.  Depending on who he was surrounded by, I think he could be a really good starter on a good team in this role. 
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #83 on: May 28, 2015, 10:49:07 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
Do you think opposing defenses even respect, let alone fear, KO?
  I think they lick their chops.

Quote
Is that what we think the other team is thinking? I think they notice when IT comes into the game. I think KO enters the game and nobody blinks.
  Spot on.


Quote
If he's so good why is his three point percentage going down? Why is his free throw percentage a joke? Why didn't his assists go up despite more playing time? Why did his rebounds go down despite more playing time?
  He is soft as wet kleenex

Quote
Who plays hardest on the Celts? Who plays like they want it really bad? Is KO near the top of that list? Or closer to the bottom?
  I do think he tries, but is limited athletically.  There were some games where his effort level was better than Sully.  I would say that Smart plays the hardest on the Celtics most nights.

Also, I do think his defense is relevant to discuss because every one that plays has to play it about half of the time.   In some ways, he was our best defensive big by some stats.

I was unhappy when we picked him.   I wanted someone more athletic and I thought he was soft.   I still think those things about him.   He has some skills just not the confidence or athletic ability to always bring them into motion every night.

He is a nifty passer.   But on our team does that even matter with our shooters?

Quote
I think he could be a really good starter on a good team in this role.
  I wish you were a GM with a top seven pick so I could fleece you like Ainge would in this regard.   He does not do anything really well.    He is a decent shooter, decent rebounder and decent passer and defender but he really does not excel routinely at ANYTHING!

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #84 on: May 28, 2015, 11:06:55 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

Kelly generally doesn't draw doubles when he gets in the lane.  That's why he scores fairly efficiently when he gets in there. 

He is a good passer, but he doesn't seem to be a great passer off the drive.  I believe that one of the next steps in his development will be to get better at making reads off the bounce and finding teammates when the help comes. 

The other offensive skill that I feel he really needs to improve on is the midrange game, which is almost non-existent.  He's good at driving and finishing at the rim, and he's good at shooting the three pointer.

That's nice.  Those are the two most efficient shots in basketball.  The midrange two is the least efficient.  Still, though, I feel it would help his overall game tremendously if, instead of trying to get all the way to the rim every time he gets into the lane, if he just learned to pull up and hit a little midrange shot. 

That's my best effort at answering your very leading questions.
He needs to improve? I'll agree to that. He shows no signs of it, but I'd agree to it

I'm curious which second year players you don't feel need to improve?

I answered yours.  Your turn.
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #85 on: May 28, 2015, 11:11:54 PM »

Offline greece66

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Versatility is Kelly's greatest asset.
If he manages to become an above average defender then he ll be a solid role player for almost any team.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #86 on: May 28, 2015, 11:12:27 PM »

Offline GetLucky

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In my opinion, Kelly is a role player with a high-commodity set of strengths for his position. I believe his skillset will allow him to fit well in many different lineups as the team improves, either as that extra floor-spacer or the guy setting up players from the high post with screens and passes. He will never be a consistent first, second, or third option, but he does have what I call the "combustability" factor (like JR Smith, but to a lesser extemt) where he can get hot and carry a team for quarters. That's honestly all I think can be asked of a role player, especially a big with his set of skills.


Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #87 on: May 29, 2015, 01:34:58 AM »

Offline DarkAzcura

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EDIT: You know what...nevermind.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 01:46:12 AM by DarkAzcura »

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #88 on: May 29, 2015, 07:10:29 AM »

Offline clover

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

Kelly generally doesn't draw doubles when he gets in the lane.  That's why he scores fairly efficiently when he gets in there. 

He is a good passer, but he doesn't seem to be a great passer off the drive.  I believe that one of the next steps in his development will be to get better at making reads off the bounce and finding teammates when the help comes. 

The other offensive skill that I feel he really needs to improve on is the midrange game, which is almost non-existent.  He's good at driving and finishing at the rim, and he's good at shooting the three pointer.

That's nice.  Those are the two most efficient shots in basketball.  The midrange two is the least efficient.  Still, though, I feel it would help his overall game tremendously if, instead of trying to get all the way to the rim every time he gets into the lane, if he just learned to pull up and hit a little midrange shot. 

That's my best effort at answering your very leading questions.

He did shoot .475 from 10-16 feet last year, though yeah, there's room for mid-range improvement.

Re: The value of Kelly Olynyk in the modern NBA game
« Reply #89 on: May 29, 2015, 07:14:49 AM »

Offline Eja117

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If KO is a potential playmaker then who isn't? Who on the Celts isn't a playmaker if KO is? He's just a guy that goes out there and plays no defense and doesn't get a lot of rebs and sometimes gets some open shots and sometimes looks a little like he's sorta trying to try hard.

He's got a little bit of NBA talent and has worked on his body and that's about the best you can say about him.

Playmaking means creating offense for yourself or for others. Pumpfaking, driving to the rim, drawing a double, kicking it out for an open 3. For example IT is our best playmaker, it has nothing to do with defense or rebounds. KO is our best playmaking big by far, even if he also has significant weaknesses in other areas.
So when KO goes to do this that will be the first time we ever see him draw a double, right?

Has this ever happened? Has KO ever...idk...gotten past Taj Gibson, drawn the double from Joahkim Noah....saw this..then dumped it off to a cutting Marcus Smart who just got past D Rose for the easy layup or something? Or maybe Avery who got past a screen to lose Jimmy Butler and hit an easy jumper from the top of the key? Is that the idea? That's how this is all going to work? Defenses are just going to respect KO so much that this is how it's going to work? Wow. Just wow.

So now KO has not only learned how to finally get his own offense...he's going to get it for others too....because now he's going to draw doubles.

Realistically I'd be thrilled if KO draws halfs. If I was KOs defender once he gets past the three point line I'd be looking for who to give help defense to.

Kelly generally doesn't draw doubles when he gets in the lane.  That's why he scores fairly efficiently when he gets in there. 

He is a good passer, but he doesn't seem to be a great passer off the drive.  I believe that one of the next steps in his development will be to get better at making reads off the bounce and finding teammates when the help comes. 

The other offensive skill that I feel he really needs to improve on is the midrange game, which is almost non-existent.  He's good at driving and finishing at the rim, and he's good at shooting the three pointer.

That's nice.  Those are the two most efficient shots in basketball.  The midrange two is the least efficient.  Still, though, I feel it would help his overall game tremendously if, instead of trying to get all the way to the rim every time he gets into the lane, if he just learned to pull up and hit a little midrange shot. 

That's my best effort at answering your very leading questions.
He needs to improve? I'll agree to that. He shows no signs of it, but I'd agree to it

I'm curious which second year players you don't feel need to improve?

I answered yours.  Your turn.
Every player in the league could stand to improve at all times. But there are lots of 2nd year players that did improve. KO isn't one of them.