Cockeyed optimists

[Hemingway]

It's just very hard to see a star coming to Celts this off-season outside a trade that includes current guys I really like.

Its not really that difficult. Ainge just has to call around, see what trades he cane make that bring is some talent. Then go to all the FAs and see if we can work out any combination. Ideally we should bring in 2 high level guys, but we can use one to get the other.

[DarkAzcura]

Here's the reason people think those players will leave their teams (not necessarily to the Celtics):

Jordan: The Clippers may not want to pay him the max when they have CP3 and Griffin at the max already. It's possible. I don't think Jordan wants to leave, but the Clippers may be the ones who want to let him go. Rivers loves Jordan so I doubt it, but the taxes on the new CBA are no joke.

Love: There have been consistent reports that Love does not enjoy being the third wheel or "Bosh" on the Cavs. There's also that tweet from Lebron earlier in the season and so on and so forth. Ironically enough, I feel like Love's injury may have actually bonded him more with his teammates than ever, but say the Cavs win a championship without Love this season. Do they even want to keep him? Would Love want to come back as the definite third man when he may feel almost 'unnecessary' if the Cavs win this year? That may be a huge ego hit for a young star who is still trying to cement his legacy in this league.

Even Woj (the most reliable 'rumor' reporter in the NBA) has come out and said Love will probably look around the league this summer and that the Cavs are scared out of their boots that he will leave. Then there was the article from Woj saying that the Celtics have closed in on the Lakers as a potential destination for Love if he leaves Cleveland (KO incident may have changed his mind, but who knows). No one is being a 'cockeyed optimist' here. They are just reading reports and coming to their own conclusions. I think there is a better chance you are just being overly pessimistic because there is plenty of smoke here.

I think a lot of the sell to Love will be based on giving him the reigns and ability to play the way he did in Minnesota but in a winning situation. I think luring him will be dependent on if we can make a big trade or not (like for a Cousins, who I honestly don't think will be available until next summer if the Kings fail to win yet again).

Longshot, but: being a 40 win team (same as Minny last season with Love) may be a decent sell in itself in a "see what we can do without a scoring star? Imagine us with you, etc, etc. Remember all that go-to scoring and defensive rebounding that we missed in the Cavs series? You could have helped us turn that series around," kind of way.

Gasol: I agree this is really unrealistic. He grew up in Memphis practically. Only other place that has a shot at him is SAS.

I also think there is almost little to no shot Middleton, Leonard, or Butler leave their teams because like you said, they are restricted free agents. Only shot Leonard leaves is if SAS somehow convinces LMA and Gasol to join their team. SAS may choose to sign and trade Leonard (for a first round pick or two) if they prefer that "twin tower" core over a wing star. I doubt it, though. Only chance Butler leaves is if Chicago implodes in the off-season, and with all the reported drama between Thibs and the ownership anything is possible there, I suppose.

Not sure why Harris is on your list though. He is very gettable. His defense is complete junk, and I doubt Orlando would hesitate to move him in a sign and trade if another team throws a max offer sheet at him. I don't really want him anyway to be honest.

[oldutican]

Interesting what you say on Harris. I don't see the SF as big a need as is center. I like Crowder a lot, and think he can be  a legit starter with improved shooting.

What do you think of Dieng?  If they draft Towns or Okafor, he becomes expendable cause I don't think anyone would take Pekovic's salary.

[DarkAzcura]

Interesting what you say on Harris. I don't see the SF as big a need as is center. I like Crowder a lot, and think he can be  a legit starter with improved shooting.

What do you think of Dieng?  If they draft Towns or Okafor, he becomes expendable cause I don't think anyone would take Pekovic's salary.

I like Dieng's skill set, but he's still pretty raw. His defensive production isn't really matching up with actual defensive impact quite yet...but he definitely has the tools and ability to get there. If we can't pull a big free agent or player in a trade, I'd be interested in trying to get Dieng if Minny felt he was expendable with Towns or Okafor. Would they, though? Okafor's defense is pretty poor so they may want to keep Dieng and hope he figures it out defensively because again, his potential on that end of the floor is quite high. Teaming up Dieng with Okafor may be something they want to do rather than consider him expendable.

So yeah, if we can't lure a big free agent or make a big trade, then Dieng would be nice to have. He could "grow" with this team and obviously has a pretty good chance at turning into a pretty mean defensive player.

I agree that center is definitely a bigger need, but we do need one more scorer at the least preferably at the wing. If we can get Love, though, I'd be completely fine with running Crowder as the starting SF honestly. We really need one more high level scorer out there (other than IT). 

[LGC88]

Here's the reason people think those players will leave their teams (not necessarily to the Celtics):

Jordan: The Clippers may not want to pay him the max when they have CP3 and Griffin at the max already. It's possible. I don't think Jordan wants to leave, but the Clippers may be the ones who want to let him go. Rivers loves Jordan so I doubt it, but the taxes on the new CBA are no joke.

Love: There have been consistent reports that Love does not enjoy being the third wheel or "Bosh" on the Cavs. There's also that tweet from Lebron earlier in the season and so on and so forth. Ironically enough, I feel like Love's injury may have actually bonded him more with his teammates than ever, but say the Cavs win a championship without Love this season. Do they even want to keep him? Would Love want to come back as the definite third man when he may feel almost 'unnecessary' if the Cavs win this year? That may be a huge ego hit for a young star who is still trying to cement his legacy in this league.

Even Woj (the most reliable 'rumor' reporter in the NBA) has come out and said Love will probably look around the league this summer and that the Cavs are scared out of their boots that he will leave. Then there was the article from Woj saying that the Celtics have closed in on the Lakers as a potential destination for Love if he leaves Cleveland (KO incident may have changed his mind, but who knows). No one is being a 'cockeyed optimist' here. They are just reading reports and coming to their own conclusions. I think there is a better chance you are just being overly pessimistic because there is plenty of smoke here.

I think a lot of the sell to Love will be based on giving him the reigns and ability to play the way he did in Minnesota but in a winning situation. I think luring him will be dependent on if we can make a big trade or not (like for a Cousins, who I honestly don't think will be available until next summer if the Kings fail to win yet again).

Longshot, but: being a 40 win team (same as Minny last season with Love) may be a decent sell in itself in a "see what we can do without a scoring star? Imagine us with you, etc, etc. Remember all that go-to scoring and defensive rebounding that we missed in the Cavs series? You could have helped us turn that series around," kind of way.

Gasol: I agree this is really unrealistic. He grew up in Memphis practically. Only other place that has a shot at him is SAS.

I also think there is almost little to no shot Middleton, Leonard, or Butler leave their teams because like you said, they are restricted free agents. Only shot Leonard leaves is if SAS somehow convinces LMA and Gasol to join their team. SAS may choose to sign and trade Leonard (for a first round pick or two) if they prefer that "twin tower" core over a wing star. I doubt it, though. Only chance Butler leaves is if Chicago implodes in the off-season, and with all the reported drama between Thibs and the ownership anything is possible there, I suppose.

Not sure why Harris is on your list though. He is very gettable. His defense is complete junk, and I doubt Orlando would hesitate to move him in a sign and trade if another team throws a max offer sheet at him. I don't really want him anyway to be honest.

Middleton :
Ideally, the Bucks would like to resign him. But if someone else throw a max offer at him, I'm not sure it is wise for the bucks to spend around 15m. They have Jabari Parker at the same position next year. They could use 15m to spend on another position that they need the most.

[Future Celtics Owner]

Crowder does everything really well except outside shooting and shooting off dribble.Those are things guys improve. Same for Smart with all of his offensive game. I've always liked Sullinger and if he can drop some weight he's a borderline all-star.

Shooting in general is a large part of the game and I think the "glue-guy" goes overboard in terms of rating Crowder.   It was a contract year, the guy plays hard but I almost puked in my mouth when I saw him launch a three early in the shot clock when he did it.   He should never be the first option on offense given his present skill level and talent.

Smart, I think will improve.   He is staying most of the summer in Boston and working with the guy who honed Klay Thompson.

Sullinger, has a finite talent base but is already skilled.  He is not a good athlete, was top five bottom in his combine, and that is only going to improve marginally by him getting in shape because he was in better shape at the combine.   I love his hands and knack for rebounding but he is a pathetic defender.  Despite supposedly, saying he would get in shape the last two years and working on his three, he didn't show aptitude.   I think he could be a decent player, but borderline all star is a stretch as long as he tries to be something he is not and that is a long range marksman.   He needs to embrace the dirty work and get into the trenches of the low post where his hands and rebounding knack can help us and he is a much more effective low post player.   I think he has a nice mid range, I just do not want him shooting threes.   Other teams do not even respect it and give it to him.   Good players play to their strengths.   Third year, Sully pales next to Kevin Love, and it is not even close.

We are a team full of bench players and we need stars.  Stars are harder to add, I trust Ainge, and  I warn people to not be too attached to anyone.  Ainge thinks with logic, not his heart and he will do what it takes to improve the team and get a star or two.  This may involved trading some guys now or signing a guy who he thinks will be a star.   I think he will try to get a free agent of impact but it will be hard with our team and the weather to sell them.

I didn't know that about Smart. I agree though that we are a team full of role players. Making the playoffs under 500 is a joke and its not like the 2 teams we beat out are going to get better next season.....GOOD JOKE...Miami gets back Bosh and IND has Paul George.

We should be crossing our fingers for the top pick instead we have the same "Lets make the playoffs for experience" guys wanting to trade away our now enlightened players for a pick......what a joke.

[Celtics4ever]

We should be crossing our fingers for the top pick instead we have the same "Lets make the playoffs for experience" guys wanting to trade away our now enlightened players for a pick......what a joke.

  I think this has been debated ad nauseum here.   It's done, what some cheese with that whine?    I see both sides of the argument.   I do think a lot of that experience will walk and not be here.   But I could not find myself, rooting for us to lose once the games started.

We will know if we are a viable free agent destination shortly.   You may be right, we have built a lot in the past through the draft.   I am more than a little skeptical about Boston weather being a selling point.

[LGC88]

Noel has said, prior being drafted, that he's a Celtics fan.
There are players that know our culture and we should focus on those players and try to find a way to bring them.

[oldutican]

Trading for Noel possible but I fear sixers will up price for celts

[Greyman]

2007 was very different. Celtics had a star in Pierce and KG and Allen were coming from losing teams. It made sense for all to put them together.

My original post was very much based on looking at the available UFAs and RFAs and the possibility of players who fit Celts’ needs. Go to list of all free agents  at http://hoopshype.com/free_agency_2015.htm. Also open ESPN trade machine to see rosters and salaries of teams. My conclusions are based on having done that.

I agree the two builds are totally different and have said in another thread the Celtics have no Pierce  to build on. The 2008 KG and RA would fill a number of holes in the present team, they are not available or players like them. I appreciate the homework you have done on this and acknowledge you have a better idea of what is available and possible even. Still, it is not impossible that DA, with Steven's growing reputation, could pull something off nobody thought possible. Or we may have to be patient and wait, that won't totally disappoint me and I half expect it may happen.

[greece66]

TP we need more threads like this.
Just saw a thread about ... the possibility of LBJ coming to the C's. Jeez...

[walker834]

This team is primed to add talent man.  I dont want lebron and not even happening but Ainge could do nothing and improve this team.  He is a good gm too.  I think Kevin Love could be possible but who konws really.  Cousins etc..  I think we might end up doing something else and going with Sully but we will see.

We are already a  pretty good team and winning starts now imo and the celtics should be aggressive and really busy this summer.  I wouldnt force moves for the sake of it though.

DA is not stupid.  Some people are but Ainge isn't.  Neither am I and I'm pretty confident we are going to be really good.

[walker834]

The thing is with this team is its not about tanking or trying to lose.  This team is trying to win always.  They aren't going to make moves for the sake of it but they are going to make moves that put them in best position to do taht whether that's this offseason or next.   They are going to build this.  It depends what is out there that actually makes sense.

[Hemingway]

If an internet message board is not the correct place to discuss our <1% chance of getting LBJ, where should this be discussed?

Take a look at Cousins. Lets say there is a 10% chance we can get him this summer or during the season(the number not really important here.) Its perfectly reasonable to talk about our 10% chance of getting him and how we could do it, and what other guys we would then want exc. without being reminded again and again that there is a 90% chance we won't get him. Its like a little kid saying, "I want to be in the NBA when I grow up Dad!" and the Dad saying, "never going to happen. smh lol (stupid emoticon)" 

[CelticGuardian]

We got better this year...both through the draft and through trades.  So there is more than one way to build a team.

Frankly, calling the Magic or Bucks "top-flight teams" and speak of the Celtics as if they are less than that seems silly.  There are a lot of reasons why players want to leave their current team, and not all of them may be in the public eye.

I don't know how likely it is that we will sign any first tier players during the offseason, but I know that Danny is always trying to make this team better, so it's in good hands. 

There's a buzz going on in the NBA about Boston now that we've sniffed the playoffs again.  Coach is getting a lot of positive attention because he motivated the players to become a team that was much greater than the sum of their parts.

Revisit this again next off season and let's see how things turned out



Rak

I don't know if you know but... Miami was plauged by injuries, as well as Pacers and Hornets. We were FORTUNATE to make the playoffs... it didn't come with 0 help.