BleacherReports' article on Celtics rebuild

[manl_lui]

Another good read. Love them or hate them, Bleacherreports sometimes post some good articles.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2436722-boston-celtics-offering-blueprint-for-how-how-to-rebuild-in-the-nba

This specifically caught me eyes

Season   Record   Off. Efficiency      Def. Efficiency   RPG   APG    SPG   BPG
'13-14   25-57   99.7                      105.2                   42.5      21.0    7.1    4.2
'14-15   40-42   101.7                  102.1                   43.8      24.5    8.2    3.6

Addition by subtraction, losing Rondo and Green but still able to win +15 games vs last year, that is a huge improvement in my opinion. I remember beginning of the year, I thought the Celtics would finish the season with 30-35 wins. Rebounds got a bit better. Assist, and steals are also better.

I like that we are in the playoffs and facing the Cavs, and possibly being swept by them. Even if we squeeze out one win, that is still a moral victory in my books. I remember watching a special on NBATV on the emerging teams in the late 80s and early 90s, that the Detroit Bad Boys and Chicago Bulls had to beat the best team in their era to become the best. In my opinion, if the Cavs are the best team right now, then playing them would be an excellent way to rebuild. You want to be the best, you gotta beat the best...and it isn't a one year or two year deal. It takes time, and this is a good start.

[kozlodoev]

Evan Turner + Isaiah Thomas > Rondo + Green.

[CelticGuardian]

Another good read. Love them or hate them, Bleacherreports sometimes post some good articles.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2436722-boston-celtics-offering-blueprint-for-how-how-to-rebuild-in-the-nba

This specifically caught me eyes

Season   Record   Off. Efficiency      Def. Efficiency   RPG   APG    SPG   BPG
'13-14   25-57   99.7                      105.2                   42.5      21.0    7.1    4.2
'14-15   40-42   101.7                  102.1                   43.8      24.5    8.2    3.6

Addition by subtraction, losing Rondo and Green but still able to win +15 games vs last year, that is a huge improvement in my opinion. I remember beginning of the year, I thought the Celtics would finish the season with 30-35 wins. Rebounds got a bit better. Assist, and steals are also better.

I like that we are in the playoffs and facing the Cavs, and possibly being swept by them. Even if we squeeze out one win, that is still a moral victory in my books. I remember watching a special on NBATV on the emerging teams in the late 80s and early 90s, that the Detroit Bad Boys and Chicago Bulls had to beat the best team in their era to become the best. In my opinion, if the Cavs are the best team right now, then playing them would be an excellent way to rebuild. You want to be the best, you gotta beat the best...and it isn't a one year or two year deal. It takes time, and this is a good start.

To be fair, those old teams had top-10 talent in Isiah Thomas and Michael Jordan.

[slamtheking]

Evan Turner + Isaiah Thomas > Rondo + Green.

in terms of effort, sure.  in terms of general talent, no. 

the problem was that their level of talent was no match for their lack of effort night in and night out. 

[CelticsFanFromNYC]

Another good read. Love them or hate them, Bleacherreports sometimes post some good articles.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2436722-boston-celtics-offering-blueprint-for-how-how-to-rebuild-in-the-nba

This specifically caught me eyes

Season   Record   Off. Efficiency      Def. Efficiency   RPG   APG    SPG   BPG
'13-14   25-57   99.7                      105.2                   42.5      21.0    7.1    4.2
'14-15   40-42   101.7                  102.1                   43.8      24.5    8.2    3.6

Addition by subtraction, losing Rondo and Green but still able to win +15 games vs last year, that is a huge improvement in my opinion. I remember beginning of the year, I thought the Celtics would finish the season with 30-35 wins. Rebounds got a bit better. Assist, and steals are also better.

I like that we are in the playoffs and facing the Cavs, and possibly being swept by them. Even if we squeeze out one win, that is still a moral victory in my books. I remember watching a special on NBATV on the emerging teams in the late 80s and early 90s, that the Detroit Bad Boys and Chicago Bulls had to beat the best team in their era to become the best. In my opinion, if the Cavs are the best team right now, then playing them would be an excellent way to rebuild. You want to be the best, you gotta beat the best...and it isn't a one year or two year deal. It takes time, and this is a good start.

I agree playing Cavs is the best situation for us in the playoffs. Yea well might've gotten a game or 2 more against the Hawks but, playing the Cavs is like starting your playoff debut in the ECF.. were playing possible Champions and a 2-time champion at that. Realistically were not going to win the ship this year so why not play the best talent the East has to offer. I rather gauge myself against the best instead of feeling good that we got games against a sub-par advanced team. Shorter series but more valuable experiece. HAwks would not help us understand what is is to go against a go-to superstar like Lebron

Atlanta is like a taller upgraded version  of out team with more rebounding and Korver shooting it up IMO

Teagues a tall IT, Carrol a better Crowder, Milsap is a upgraded Sully (what Sully could possibly be in a few years) There just couple years ahead in talent

[Celtics4ever]

The thing is we are a sub .500 team, in the weak East.   I wonder if our rebuild would be viewed the same in the West.

6 teams better than us in the East and Nine in the West.  We have the 15th best W L this season.

http://www.nba.com/standings/team_record_comparison/conferenceNew_Std_Cnf.html

I am sure that losing Sully for almost two months helped our DEF Efficiency.

[Eddie20]

Evan Turner + Isaiah Thomas > Rondo + Green.

in terms of effort, sure.  in terms of general talent, no. 

the problem was that their level of talent was no match for their lack of effort night in and night out.

Turner was the #2 overall pick so I would say his overal talent level is on par with Green's depsite the difference in athleticism.

Rondo before his ACL injury was more talented than Thomas, but not now. Rondo can't shoot, score, finish at the rim, penetrate, or draw fouls like Thomas. It's not an effort thing, it's a talent thing.

[slamtheking]

Evan Turner + Isaiah Thomas > Rondo + Green.

in terms of effort, sure.  in terms of general talent, no. 

the problem was that their level of talent was no match for their lack of effort night in and night out.

Turner was the #2 overall pick so I would say his overal talent level is on par with Green's depsite the difference in athleticism.

Rondo before his ACL injury was more talented than Thomas, but not now. Rondo can't shoot, score, finish at the rim, penetrate, or draw fouls like Thomas. It's not an effort thing, it's a talent thing.

had a longer rebuttal but my pc crashed so I'll provide the abbreviated version because don't want to retype the whole thing again.

1. Draft position doesn't matter.  every draft is loaded with players taken too high or too low based on their performance in the league.  IIRC, Green had more interest coming out than Turner.
2. Green is a legit starting-quality SF in this league, like his effort or not.  Turner been debated constantly if he should be starting on this team of role players.  Green's the superior over-all talent.
3. IT can outshoot Rondo from the field and the line but that's about it.  Passing and ballhandling -- Rondo has the advantage all day long and twice on Sunday.  Defense, engaged Rondo all day long.  of course that's been the argument with his D the past 2-3 years.  IT is a defensive sieve and can be posted up at will by any other PG in the league.  I'd even take a shot at posting him up and I'm 5'5". 

Also, for all the hoopla about IT's shooting, his % isn't particularly high.  he can certainly get hot and hit from anywhere but he takes a number of questionable shots that would qualify as 'heat checks'.

C's have done better since Rondo and Green were traded - no argument there -- but if I've got a choice of who to build a team with based on talent, I'd take Rondo and Green.  not saying they're building blocks at this point but they can be starters on a title contender.  IT and Turner, not so much

[manl_lui]

Evan Turner + Isaiah Thomas > Rondo + Green.

in terms of effort, sure.  in terms of general talent, no. 

the problem was that their level of talent was no match for their lack of effort night in and night out.

Turner was the #2 overall pick so I would say his overal talent level is on par with Green's depsite the difference in athleticism.

Rondo before his ACL injury was more talented than Thomas, but not now. Rondo can't shoot, score, finish at the rim, penetrate, or draw fouls like Thomas. It's not an effort thing, it's a talent thing.

had a longer rebuttal but my pc crashed so I'll provide the abbreviated version because don't want to retype the whole thing again.

1. Draft position doesn't matter.  every draft is loaded with players taken too high or too low based on their performance in the league.  IIRC, Green had more interest coming out than Turner.
2. Green is a legit starting-quality SF in this league, like his effort or not.  Turner been debated constantly if he should be starting on this team of role players.  Green's the superior over-all talent.
3. IT can outshoot Rondo from the field and the line but that's about it.  Passing and ballhandling -- Rondo has the advantage all day long and twice on Sunday.  Defense, engaged Rondo all day long.  of course that's been the argument with his D the past 2-3 years.  IT is a defensive sieve and can be posted up at will by any other PG in the league.  I'd even take a shot at posting him up and I'm 5'5". 

Also, for all the hoopla about IT's shooting, his % isn't particularly high.  he can certainly get hot and hit from anywhere but he takes a number of questionable shots that would qualify as 'heat checks'.

C's have done better since Rondo and Green were traded - no argument there -- but if I've got a choice of who to build a team with based on talent, I'd take Rondo and Green.  not saying they're building blocks at this point but they can be starters on a title contender.  IT and Turner, not so much

actually your statement sparked a question from me

do you think a team (celtics or not), can actually rebuild by laying the foundation of role players/bench players first, clear cap space, then trade/sign a max player?

[kozlodoev]

2. Green is a legit starting-quality SF in this league, like his effort or not.  Turner been debated constantly if he should be starting on this team of role players.  Green's the superior over-all talent.

So Green went to a playoff team to ... come off the bench? This one is at best a wash, Green's scoring and defense for Turner's playmaking and rebounding.

3. IT can outshoot Rondo from the field and the line but that's about it.

Given the epic proportions to which Rondo's ability to shoot and score has declined, this is perfectly sufficient to declare Thomas the better player, and it won't even be very close.