Nerlens Noel

[slightly biased bias fan]

Philly had the rookie of the year in MCW who was putting up fantastic numbers and was meant to be a cornerstone for their future and they traded him without warning when the right offer came in.

They also have Saric who's a stretch 4 not a 3 and they may take with Okafor or Towns in this draft.

My point being there seems to be every opportunity to trade for Noel or Embiid for the right price and Noel is perfect for us.

[LarBrd33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  I'll upset people by saying this, but I don't think Smart is an elite guard prospect.  Can see him having a career like Tony Allen.

How many Tony Allens would it take to trade for a Marc Gasol or Blake Griffin?

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel. Noel didn't do much more than Smart this year, even given his much, much more prominent role on a much worse team.

I'll give you that a defensive anchor is more important than a defensive perimeter guy, but per their respective positions, there's not muc, if any, separation between the two as prospects and skill-wise. Plus, and I'll get torched for saying this, but I haven't seen the intangibles with Noel that are overflowing from Smart. Noel's effort and motivation have been questioned, even by Brown, but that is never something that you'll hear about Smart. The kid has leadership written all over him.

As much as I'd hate it, I'd probably do Smart and our pick this year for Noel, but that's purely due to Noel's position being more valuable. Taking position out of the equation, they're very similarly skilled prospects, and to suggest Noel is worth three Smarts is asinine.

[LarBrd33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel.

Sorry.  Not true for several reasons.  Not worth arguing with you about it.  I like Smart.  He should be a contributor in the NBA for many years.  I hope he develops into something special, but I'm not counting on it.  Nerlens Noel is on pace to be the foundation of a dominant defensive team.

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  I'll upset people by saying this, but I don't think Smart is an elite guard prospect.  Can see him having a career like Tony Allen.

How many Tony Allens would it take to trade for a Marc Gasol or Blake Griffin?

And TA for Gasol or Griffin? That's such a BS comparison. I love how you limit one similar prospect to a career defensive role player and laud the other similar prospect as a multi-time All-Star. That's a little ridiculously inconsistent.

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel.

Sorry.  Not true for several reasons.  Not worth arguing with you about it.

Right back at you.

[LarBrd33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel.

Sorry.  Not true for several reasons.  Not worth arguing with you about it.

Right back at you.

Don't lose sleep debating internally about whether or not Smart is worth trading for Noel.   We aren't getting Noel.   You might as well be arguing about whether or not Avery Bradley is worth trading for Blake Griffin.

[crimson_stallion]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

I wouldn't go that far. 

Smart is a defensive role player right now, but so is Noel really. 

Thing is though, it's not really that uncommon to find big men who can change a game with their defense.  They are pretty much a dime a dozen - Emeka Okafor, Omer Asik, Nerlens Noel, Roy Hibbert, the list goes on.  If Noel goes on to develop some offensive game, then he'll be a special player, but it remains to be seen whether he really has any offensive potential.  If he doesn't develop that part of his game, then the best he'll ever become is a Tyson Chandler / Roy Hibbert type.  Not that I'd complain about having one of those, but it does limit his potential. 

On the other hand, Smart isn't just a defender.  IIRC his Offensive RPM is actually better than his Defensive RPM if you look at the numbers - I do recall both were positive.  Smart isn't the greatest passer, ball handler or shooter but he is capable at all of those things.  He can put up decent assist numbers, he manages to keep turnovers low (even when handling the ball a lot) and he can hit open three's consistently enough to make the defense pay.  That means he's not ONLY a defensive role player - he can contribute in other ways too.

Also finding a PG who can dominate a game defensively the way Smart (unlike with bigs) is pretty rare.  Finding one who also has the size to defend shooting guards some small forwards, even rarer.  About the only guy I can think of is Tony Allen, but he doesn't have anything even resembling point guard skills...or a jump shot.  Yet his value in the league is still pretty high.

I don't disagree that Noel has more value on the market then Smart does, but Smart might actually have higher potential and may even be more valuable to a team.

[tazzmaniac]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  I'll upset people by saying this, but I don't think Smart is an elite guard prospect.  Can see him having a career like Tony Allen.

How many Tony Allens would it take to trade for a Marc Gasol or Blake Griffin?

And TA for Gasol or Griffin? That's such a BS comparison. I love how you limit one similar prospect to a career defensive role player and laud the other similar prospect as a multi-time All-Star. That's a little ridiculously inconsistent.

I agree those aren't good comparisons.  I'd say how many TAs for Jordan (DeAndre not Michael  )

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel.

Sorry.  Not true for several reasons.  Not worth arguing with you about it.

Right back at you.

Don't lose sleep debating internally about whether or not Smart is worth trading for Noel.   We aren't getting Noel.   You might as well be arguing about whether or not Avery Bradley is worth trading for Blake Griffin.

I won't lose sleep, but if I did it'd be more about me worrying about giving up Smart for a lanky, weird-named, potentially good defensive anchor who has already tore his ACL, had his motor and effort questioned by his coach, and had ONE decent season on a God-awful squad that people are overvaluing and taking a bit out of context. I mean, that and the criminally undervaluing and underestimating of our own young prospect, that is.   

[slightly biased bias fan]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

If Smart isn't an elite prospect yet, then neither is Noel.

Sorry.  Not true for several reasons.  Not worth arguing with you about it.

Right back at you.

Don't lose sleep debating internally about whether or not Smart is worth trading for Noel.   We aren't getting Noel.   You might as well be arguing about whether or not Avery Bradley is worth trading for Blake Griffin.

You keep making these ridiculous comparisons, what we are doing is making an educated analysis of the current trade market according to leverage, GM history, pick value and team situation all you're doing is essentially trolling, if you don't like the discussion topic simply don't click on it.

Also two years ago if I told you Lebron was back in Cleveland and Atlanta won the East you would probably have laughed too.

[LarBrd33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

I wouldn't go that far. 

Smart is a defensive role player right now, but so is Noel really. 

Thing is though, it's not really that uncommon to find big men who can change a game with their defense.  They are pretty much a dime a dozen - Emeka Okafor, Omer Asik, Nerlens Noel, Roy Hibbert, the list goes on. 

Lol.  I'm done with this crazy thread.   Yeah, it's a piece of cake to find a dominant defensive big.  We've been trying to find one for 5+ years.

Nerlens after the all-star break averaged 14 points, 10 rebounds, 2.5 blocks, 2.5 steals.  He's 20 years old.   His team had the highest defensive rating in the entire league in minutes he was on the court.   He's coming off a major injury.   

Again, if you guys don't understand the difference between a Thabo Sefolosha/Tony Allen/Bruce Bowen... and a Ben Wallace,  I dunno what to tell ya.   We spent a handful of years watching post-prime Kevin Garnett lead us deep into the playoffs with his defense.  Maybe watch the Celtics get swept without interior defense and give it some thought.   Nerlens Noel isn't happening.  These Noel threads are actually more ridiculous than the Andre Drummond threads of a couple years ago, because at least Rondo had theoretical trade value as a 4x All-star. 

Smart, both 2015 1sts, Brooklyn's 2016.  That probably gets Philly to pick up the phone.  They'd have better offers.   

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  I'll upset people by saying this, but I don't think Smart is an elite guard prospect.  Can see him having a career like Tony Allen.

How many Tony Allens would it take to trade for a Marc Gasol or Blake Griffin?

And TA for Gasol or Griffin? That's such a BS comparison. I love how you limit one similar prospect to a career defensive role player and laud the other similar prospect as a multi-time All-Star. That's a little ridiculously inconsistent.

I agree those aren't good comparisons.  I'd say how many TAs for Jordan (DeAndre not Michael  )

That's a good one. And though I agree to an extent that a defensive big is more important than a perimeter defensive guy, the best players of the modern era have been wing players, and having a perimeter defensive guy to slow down the KDs, Lebrons, and Jordans of the world is pretty important, too.

[jpotter33]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  Smart isn't an elite guard prospect.  Do the math.

I wouldn't go that far. 

Smart is a defensive role player right now, but so is Noel really. 

Thing is though, it's not really that uncommon to find big men who can change a game with their defense.  They are pretty much a dime a dozen - Emeka Okafor, Omer Asik, Nerlens Noel, Roy Hibbert, the list goes on. 

Lol.  I'm done with this crazy thread.   Yeah, it's a piece of cake to find a dominant defensive big.  We've been trying to find one for 5+ years.

Nerlens after the all-star break averaged 14 points, 10 rebounds, 2.5 blocks, 2.5 steals.  He's 20 years old.   His team had the highest defensive rating in the entire league in minutes he was on the court.   He's coming off a major injury. 

Again, if you guys don't understand the difference between a Thabo Sefolosha/Tony Allen/Bruce Bowen... and a Ben Wallace,  I dunno what to tell ya.   We spent a handful of years watching post-prime Kevin Garnett lead us deep into the playoffs with his defense.  Maybe watch the Celtics get swept without interior defense and give it some thought.   Nerlens Noel isn't happening.  These Noel threads are actually more ridiculous than the Andre Drummond threads of a couple years ago, because at least Rondo had theoretical trade value as a 4x All-star. 

Smart, both 2015 1sts, Brooklyn's 2016.  That probably gets Philly to pick up the phone.  They'd have better offers.

He's 21, just a month younger than Smart. And I could sit there and cherry pick time periods with Smart to make him look as good as possible while neglecting to look at the other stuff, too. 

And that's not even counting the vastly differing roles the two occupied, too. I'm sure Smart would've looked much better stat-wise if he was playing on a team full of D-League scrubs and actively trying to lose. Again, context matters. 

[tazzmaniac]

This post is going down the path that hundreds of similar threads have gone.
i/ We identify a player that would be useful for the team.
ii/We set a price we consider fair
iii/We speculate how great the team would be with this or that player.
Anyone pointing to the obvious fact that if a team makes a talented player available there are 28 other teams interested is either ignored or gets some rude remark.
For instance, I pointed out that the price suggested by a commenter for Noel is too low, and that given there are doubts about Embiid's condition, Philly might not even be interested to trade. And I got an answer ... about Embiid's condition being fine (so what? does this make Noel any cheaper?). Just sayin...

yup... not getting Noel/Embiid for the same reason we weren't getting Drummond for Rondo.  Teams don't give away superstar big man prospects. 

I'd like to say that if Philly landed Townes, they'd consider trading their least favorite of the 3 bigs for a package of Marcus Smart, both our 2015 1sts and Brooklyn's 2016 1st, but they'd have safer routes to take.  Why trade an elite big man prospect with superstar potential for a defensive role player and a few picks with bust potential.  They could hold onto the three bigs for a season and trade one of them for an all-star at a position of need.  Or if they insist on making a move on draft night... they could just trade down a pick or two and pick up a guy like Mudiay or Russell.  No point to trading for some weak package of mid Boston 1sts.

You criminally underestimate Smart lol

Nah.  He's aiight.  You'd have to trade multiple Marcus Smarts to get a Nerlens Noel.   I like Smart and he might have a future beyond defensive role player, but elite big men prospects are FAR more valuable than elite guards prospects.  I'll upset people by saying this, but I don't think Smart is an elite guard prospect.  Can see him having a career like Tony Allen.

How many Tony Allens would it take to trade for a Marc Gasol or Blake Griffin?

And TA for Gasol or Griffin? That's such a BS comparison. I love how you limit one similar prospect to a career defensive role player and laud the other similar prospect as a multi-time All-Star. That's a little ridiculously inconsistent.

I agree those aren't good comparisons.  I'd say how many TAs for Jordan (DeAndre not Michael  )

That's a good one. And though I agree to an extent that a defensive big is more important than a perimeter defensive guy, the best players of the modern era have been wing players, and having a perimeter defensive guy to slow down the KDs, Lebrons, and Jordans of the world is pretty important, too.

Unfortunately Smart is 6'4" not 6'7" so I don't see him slowing down the KDs and Lebrons.  Good defensive bigs get paid big bucks.  Good defensive wings not so much.