Good Read from Pierce by Jackie MacMullan

[fairweatherfan]

Pierce is firm: Next season will be his last.

"I've had my time,'' he said.

Did anyone else pick up on this, or is it old news?

Yeah, I saw that.  When Pierce and KG  are gone from the league, it's going to be a little sad.  It's probably me just getting older, but I largely don't find the current generation of stars to be as likeable as the guys like Pierce, KG, Duncan, Dirk, etc.

I think the likability stems from what Pierce said; those guys worked hard. And it showed. These newer guys are more entitled and less apt to work, yet so tantalizingly talented. It also doesn't help that team like the Thunder have no camaraderie with the media; that must help paint a less-rosy picture when it comes to what we read.

They said the same thing about Pierce's generation when they were young, and the Shaq/Iverson generation before that, and so on.  In the 80s when I started watching people were grumbling that the Magic/Bird/Jordan crew were all flash and no substance (less so about Bird than the others to be fair), and didn't appreciate fundamentals, defense and hard work.  Heck, Pierce even acknowledges in the interview that he didn't work as hard as he could or take care of himself in his younger years.  Flash forward 10 years and we'll be holding up the "lazy kids" of today as respected vets who "play the right way" and complaining about how the new players are so spoiled and lazy.   So it goes.

Not going to re-read the article, but from what I recall the gist of what I gathered that Pierce was saying was:

1. Young people don't work hard enough, don't prepare enough to be great. He included himself, he now knows better and hopes the young players learn from his mistakes.

2. In the past, he alludes that there were not off days for practice for young players. Now that's more of an organizational thing to protect their assets more than anything rather than shot at young players that don't practice.

So, if I read it correctly, it wasn't really a "our generation did it better than yours" in the sense of calling these younger players lazy, but maybe from an organization context, they're not pushing the players to their limit while young... pampering them. And maybe that in turn causes entitlement and lack of focus to become great.

At least that's how I perceived it when I first read it.

I was more responding to the posts I quoted than what Pierce said.  For your points I agree fully on #1, I just tend to roll my eyes when people think it's something about this particular generation of young people, instead of just how young people have always tended to be at that stage.  #2 is definitely a shift in focusing on health and longevity over repetitions, and I can see why an older guy would find that baffling. 

Overall I just think every generation of players has tons of talent; a rare few guys take the league very seriously and work very hard from the get-go, a lot more start off lazy and lackadaisical but learn good habits as they go, and some never really work hard and usually wind up flaming out of the league.  I just don't like the notion that there's something uniquely flawed or negative about this group.

[Rosco917]

I was reading an interview Pierce recently gave, he spoke about many things. But when the subject of his one year in Brooklyn came up, he held nothing back. He spoke about how uninterested the Nets team were in general about getting better. How he and KG had to push them to take practice and winning seriously. He spoke of a lack of desire and hunger that the team had towards the dedication needed to compete for a championship.

This is something I suspected about some players in the NBA. Many NBA teams have some "big names" that simply do not give effort enough to consistently win. Some of these incredibly high paid athletes go through the motions and look for "theirs" and not worry about what the team needs to succeed.  He said his time in Brooklyn was terrible. (Why KG stayed I have no idea.)

We're lucky to have a Celtic team that "gets after it" like they do. It's a characteristic that is catchy.
Character does count, it's not only about getting "stars."

[pearljammer10]

What is the pt of telling the public about others in a negative viewpoint??

I think there is value in honesty, especially in retrospect when you're nearing the end.

What's the point in hiding your views of the past? What value does protecting the "feelings" of old teammates give?

Exactly.  If you're gonna be candid, you're gonna be candid.  I don't have an issue with it.

Yeah I don't understand why someone would call him out for speaking the truth. In a world filled with bogus rumors and he said-she said talk over the internet and through bogus media sources shouldn't we appreciate the actual true stories that an old vet has to tell? Why hide things that happened?

Loved this read and wish there was even more from Pierce's mouth.

[Forza Juventus]

Do you Pierce!

[celts10]

I'm liking this reflective, elder statesman version of Pierce. He's an honest guy who's seen a lot over his career and will likely be even more blunt now that he's just about ready to hang it up. His thoughts on Brooklyn are interesting for sure, always felt like something was off about that team that year.

I really enjoyed the segment on the Brooklyn experience and his thoughts on Deron Williams. Remember when Williams vs Chris Paul was a legitimate debate?

I always wanted to see KG and Pierce make it to the Finals last year. It makes sense about Williams' lack of desire to be in the New York spotlight. To be fair though, D-Will was playing on two bad ankles in the playoffs and getting cortisone shots. If he was fully healthy and committed, it would have been interesting to see just how far the Nets could have gone last season.

[Monkhouse]

I was reading an interview Pierce recently gave, he spoke about many things. But when the subject of his one year in Brooklyn came up, he held nothing back. He spoke about how uninterested the Nets team were in general about getting better. How he and KG had to push them to take practice and winning seriously. He spoke of a lack of desire and hunger that the team had towards the dedication needed to compete for a championship.

This is something I suspected about some players in the NBA. Many NBA teams have some "big names" that simply do not give effort enough to consistently win. Some of these incredibly high paid athletes go through the motions and look for "theirs" and not worry about what the team needs to succeed.  He said his time in Brooklyn was terrible. (Why KG stayed I have no idea.)

We're lucky to have a Celtic team that "gets after it" like they do. It's a characteristic that is catchy.
Character does count, it's not only about getting "stars."

Too bad without stars, you're not going to go far.

KG/Pierce/Allen were stars even past their prime.

[LarBrd33]

Pierce is still pretty effective at his age.  He'd probably even start over Turner on this team.   I don't think we even made an offer to him this summer... which is likely because Ainge expected to bottom out this season.  Playoffs wasn't really something that was part of the plan.

I think Pierce can opt out this summer, though.  I can't see Boston trying to reverse course and tank next season... so what's the chance we can get Paul back here for what he says will be his final season?

[barefacedmonk]

Its been MANY months since I last signed on to CB forums....but I had to for this article. Thanks OP. TP.

I love Paul Pierce. He is and will always be THE Captain for me.

Nice read.

[GetLucky]

Pierce is still pretty effective at his age.  He'd probably even start over Turner on this team.   I don't think we even made an offer to him this summer... which is likely because Ainge expected to bottom out this season.  Playoffs wasn't really something that was part of the plan.

I think Pierce can opt out this summer, though.  I can't see Boston trying to reverse course and tank next season... so what's the chance we can get Paul back here for what he says will be his final season?

Probably low, as much as everyone would love it. It would just completely alter the locker-room dynamic, as everyone would immediately pay homage to Pierce. This would make our young up-and-coming leaders step down for a year, only to try to take the reigns the following year after Pierce retires. It would be too big a shake up, and it could potentially derail the intangible development of the future Celtics leaders (Bradley, Smart, etc.).

[celts10]

Probably low, as much as everyone would love it. It would just completely alter the locker-room dynamic, as everyone would immediately pay homage to Pierce. This would make our young up-and-coming leaders step down for a year, only to try to take the reigns the following year after Pierce retires. It would be too big a shake up, and it could potentially derail the intangible development of the future Celtics leaders (Bradley, Smart, etc.).

Yeah, it would probably be too soon especially since Pierce can still contribute to a certain extent. It reminds me of when AI returned to the Sixers for his final season. After three seasons away, he's back and the team's philosophy had changed too much.

I'm glad its working for KG though. He's cooked so he can't contribute anything anymore other than mentorship and leadership.

[celtics2030]

Now it all makes sense with the Ray thing..yeah Rondo and Ray had their problems, but it just really seemed like Ray wasn't really a "team" guy and he was ready to go..the narrative was easier to blame it on Rondo.

I found it strange when Doc had said that PP and KG didn't reach out to Ray during the free agency to woo him. I love these types of interviews, Truth riding into the sunset and letting it all hang out..lol.

Yea ok.

Paul said Ray was great on the court...

one thing that Ray is on the court is REAL...he will give you 100% , always go to practice, and always do whats hes asked.

Pierce is cool for airing this all out....

He basically just told everyone how Ray is....which IMO is not bad.

Being a nuisance like rondo is what's bad.

[celtics2030]

I don't really have a problem with what Pierce says about Ray.  Everyone is different and it's pretty unfair to judge someone based on a few anecdotes.   Ray may be a horrible and difficult person, but he also just may do things differently. Maybe he prioritized time with his wife and children over anything else -- would that make him a jerk?   Maybe he figured that as an NBA player who spends nights, weekends and half the season on the road away from his kids that whatever time is left is sacrosanct -- for family.  Or maybe not, but we don't have enough information to judge.

It might be fair to say that we don't have enough information to fully judge. However, there is a decent amount of details given. It wasn't like Pierce thought Ray should have spent more time with the guys drinking beer or going bowling. He says it was pretty weird that they would have fundraising events and they would show up at his, but he would never come to theirs. It also doesn't sound like he only made a few times, but more like he never made it.

I think it is similar in most people's workplace where he have things that we really should do. I know sometimes when someone is new to the office or leaving we have the occasional event that I definitely don't want to go to, but still go cause it is part of being a good coworker. I still do skip some of the, but if I never went my coworkers might think a bit less of me.

It would be especially weird if I was asking them to come to events for me but never going to theirs.

To be clear this isn't ray drunk driving or breaking any laws, I just respect Paul Pierce, particularly as he entered the later stages of his career. To hear him speak like this carries some weight with me. I can understand if it doesn't for others.

I don't do jack with my co-workers and I like it that way. I hate how some places want you to be all buddy-buddy with your co-workers. It's a business man, if I get fired tomorrow, they won't give a you-know-what.

Ray knew it was all business, I like that

Judging by how much complaining Ray did about potentially getting traded when he was here, I'll go out on a limb and say he wasnt and shouldnt be on some all knowing high horse about this all being a business

Find one piece of evidence where he COMPLAINED

[celtics2030]

Article kind of partially explains why Danny tried to trade Ray every year starting in 2009.  It doesn't sound like the other players would have cared.

Yeah, that's why I found it weird when Doc said that PP and KG weren't talking to Ray before he left or something like that..and when they said that they weren't recruiting Ray during his FA..I should have figured something then.

Both of you have terrible memories. Paul and Garnett did all they could to prevent Ray being traded. They actually did stop Ainge according to rumours, but the damage was done from a organization point of view.

[LarBrd33]

Article kind of partially explains why Danny tried to trade Ray every year starting in 2009.  It doesn't sound like the other players would have cared.

Yeah, that's why I found it weird when Doc said that PP and KG weren't talking to Ray before he left or something like that..and when they said that they weren't recruiting Ray during his FA..I should have figured something then.

Both of you have terrible memories. Paul and Garnett did all they could to prevent Ray being traded. They actually did stop Ainge according to rumours, but the damage was done from a organization point of view.

Literally the first time I've ever heard that.  As I remember it, Danny traded Ray for OJ Mayo and the deal fell apart, because Memphis backed out. 

Had the widely reported deal of Ray Allen being sent to Memphis in his final year in Boston actually gone down, Celtics would surely remember Allen differently. Instead of being booed and vilified, he?d probably be greeted fondly by the Boston crowd, as Doc Rivers was in his return with the Clippers. The hypocrisy of that isn?t lost on Allen, who opened up about the near-trade in an interview with SLAM magazine. ?I was actually traded to Memphis,? Allen tells Datwon Thomas. ?I got the phone call and [was] told that I was traded for O.J. Mayo. I was in San Francisco to play the Warriors. Danny Ainge and I talked, and he asked me how I felt about it. I told him I was upset, that I couldn?t believe it. ?I said, ?I can?t knock you. You have to do what you do for your team. I understand it?s a business [and] there?s nothing I can do about it.'? Allen told his family he had been traded, but the deal broke down and Allen finished the season with the Celtics.

[gpap]

Pierce is firm: Next season will be his last.

"I've had my time,'' he said.

Did anyone else pick up on this, or is it old news?

Yeah, I saw that.  When Pierce and KG  are gone from the league, it's going to be a little sad.  It's probably me just getting older, but I largely don't find the current generation of stars to be as likeable as the guys like Pierce, KG, Duncan, Dirk, etc.

Boy, I'd love to have Paul back for one final hurrah here in Boston before he retires!