Author Topic: 2015 Boston Red Sox  (Read 10503 times)

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Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2015, 03:24:03 PM »

Offline mahonedog88

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How long is Cherington's rope after winning a title in 2013?

The Sox are well on their way to the 3rd bottom of the barrel record through 4 years of Cherington's tenure.

Ben's proven largely inept in building a reliable bullpen, has made questionable decisions about the rotation, and seems to have struck out at least as often as he's hit in trying to find reliable bats for the lineup.

Pretty much everything went right for the Sox in 2013, but in 2012, 2014, and now this season, just as many things have gone wrong.

It would be silly to expect the Sox to win a title every season, or even go deep into the playoffs.  But when you have one of the biggest payrolls in the sport, is it unreasonable to expect that the team will at least be in the hunt for the wild card each season?  Anything less than that should be viewed as an utter failure, and people should lose their jobs as a result.

I think it's all but confirmed now that the 2013 world series had SO much luck involved.  Now they get credit because yes they played well, the pitching was legit.  But EVERY move made went well that year, they had Koji fall into their lap, Bucholz somehow someway went 10-1 with an era under 2.00 in the first 3 months of the season, Victorino stayed healthy all year, they were clutch all year long, they had such an abnormal amount of come from behind wins...they also had that "team of destiny" feel with everything that happened with the marathon bombing as well.

But now it's crunch time for Cherington.  If this team endures another last place finish, I fully expect Cherington to be fired, and then if Farrell isn't fired, next season will be his last chance to show he's a competent major league manager.

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2015, 03:28:24 PM »

Offline mahonedog88

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If the Sox were run like the Pats, they would have dumped Napoli at the deadline last year, or just outright cut him before the season.  Dude's toast. 

(Yes, the MLB doesn't have non-guaranteed contracts ... but there's also no salary cap)


One of the most irritating thing about how these Sox are run is the desire to hold onto certain guys well past the point where they've shown they cannot be relied upon.

Napoli, Vic, Buccholz, Craig.  Why did anybody expect these guys to help the team this season?

As much as the young guys have struggled, you expect that.  It wouldn't be an issue if Betts, Bogaerts, JBJ, etc were seen as complements to a roster that is comprised mostly of proven, reliable, productive veterans.

Napoli right now is a mess...but lets not forget, he had a July and August in 2013 that was incredibly similar to this.  It just looks extra bad right now because he's doing this to start the season.  Bucholz and Victorino I agree with you, time to move on.  Craig was a fantastic hitter just a couple of years ago, like led the national league in a few hitting categories type of fantastic.  Unfortunately his injury seems to have affected him to the point where he looks to be just about done.

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2015, 03:30:28 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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How much credit should we give to Theo for 2013?

I mean, Lester and Lackey played huge roles for that team.

Napoli, Victorino, Gomes worked out very well for Ben.  Koji was a great acquisition.

But Peavy and Dempster ... meh.

Pedroia, Ortiz, and Ellsbury were still the core of the team.



As for Nap, yes, he's had bad months and good months.  You know what, I'm tired of players who go from looking great to playing like utter dog filth month to month.  No wonder this team can't win consistently.  Too many trick or treat players.

Who can you really rely on with this team, night to night?  Pedroia and Ortiz.  Koji for the most part.  That's it.  Betts looks like he might be that kind of guy.  Porcello maybe, if you don't expect him to be more than pretty good.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2015, 04:14:06 PM »

Offline boscel33

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I pray for patience.  Owens and Rodriquez have the stuff to be top of the rotation aces.  Please don't panic and make a trade.  In 2016, those two should be anchoring the staff.
While the early bird catches the worm, the second mouse gets the cheese!

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2015, 04:22:23 PM »

Offline Atzar

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I pray for patience.  Owens and Rodriquez have the stuff to be top of the rotation aces.  Please don't panic and make a trade.  In 2016, those two should be anchoring the staff.

Owens really doesn't.  Rodriguez, if he refines his command, is as close as we have to a top-of-rotation prospect.

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2015, 04:45:12 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I pray for patience.  Owens and Rodriquez have the stuff to be top of the rotation aces.  Please don't panic and make a trade.  In 2016, those two should be anchoring the staff.


I'm done putting all my hopes on Red Sox prospects to save the day.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2015, 04:48:31 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Bucholtz still shows flashes of brilliance and then falls apart randomly. I think he's heading in the right direction though, and if he can become consistent, will finally be the pitcher some of us were hoping he could become.

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2015, 04:58:21 PM »

Offline jambr380

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2013 leaves a pretty long leash for those in charge. Winning a world series is always the ultimate goal and we did just the season before least. While I am not a huge Cherrington fan, he at least shows the willingness to go out there and make risky moves that may or may not work out for the franchise. There are players who I would like to see move on so we can try and make some noise with our younger players (Ortiz, Pedroia, and even Koji I am happy to have forever, though). We look to have ridiculously good young pitching and our future outfield looks out of this world. I guess we just have to be patient.

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2015, 05:17:16 PM »

Offline mahonedog88

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2013 leaves a pretty long leash for those in charge. Winning a world series is always the ultimate goal and we did just the season before least. While I am not a huge Cherrington fan, he at least shows the willingness to go out there and make risky moves that may or may not work out for the franchise. There are players who I would like to see move on so we can try and make some noise with our younger players (Ortiz, Pedroia, and even Koji I am happy to have forever, though). We look to have ridiculously good young pitching and our future outfield looks out of this world. I guess we just have to be patient.

Patient?  They had a historic collapse in 2011, last place finish in 2012, last place finish in 2014, and looking to be well on their way to a last place finish in 2015.  Yes, they won the world series in 2013 and nobody can take that away from them.  But the fact is, they had a horseshoe stuck up their butts for that whole season.  Even WITH the world series year, they have a well below .500 record when you combine the records of the last 4 years. 

This is a team with a $200 million payroll and a reactionary ownership group.  And while I keep hearing about all these young prospects, the fact is, they haven't had any homegrown power hitting in a LONG time, I've been unimpressed with any young pitching they bring up, and whenever they do bring up young pitching that seems to show promise, it doesn't take long for them to regress.


Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2015, 05:31:34 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I guess I just have a different standard for excellence.  Winning a championship is great, but that is just one success that should not excuse all failures.

The ultimate goal is winning a championship, but titles aren't EVERYTHING.  Also very important is putting a quality product on the field, i.e. assembling a team each year that plays well on a regular basis and actually keeps fans entertained and interested.

Maybe it seems strange, but I wouldn't be happy to watch a team that finishes last in the division 4 years out of 5 but wins a title every fifth year.  I get fed up trying to follow the team through all of the dreadful years in between and can't allow myself to buy in when they're actually good.

At some point, being able to actually enjoy the team relatively often in any given year has to mean something.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2015, 05:34:56 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Bucholtz still shows flashes of brilliance and then falls apart randomly. I think he's heading in the right direction though, and if he can become consistent, will finally be the pitcher some of us were hoping he could become.

Is this a direct quote from 2011? 2012? 2014?  We've been saying some version of this every year.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2015, 05:39:05 PM »

Offline mahonedog88

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I guess I just have a different standard for excellence.  Winning a championship is great, but that is just one success that should not excuse all failures.

The ultimate goal is winning a championship, but titles aren't EVERYTHING.  Also very important is putting a quality product on the field, i.e. assembling a team each year that plays well on a regular basis and actually keeps fans entertained and interested.

Maybe it seems strange, but I wouldn't be happy to watch a team that finishes last in the division 4 years out of 5 but wins a title every fifth year.  I get fed up trying to follow the team through all of the dreadful years in between and can't allow myself to buy in when they're actually good.

At some point, being able to actually enjoy the team relatively often in any given year has to mean something.

That's a great point.  It's also about putting a good product on the field to watch.  And it's not like this is even enjoyable to watch.  Why would anyone want to watch a team that's constantly down at least 4-0 by the 4th inning?  As much as John Henry must be upset at the team on the field, he's probably more upset because he just can feel countless people changing the channel by the 5th inning

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #27 on: May 31, 2015, 01:19:46 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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How many last place finishes should a GM in a major media market get before he's shown the door?
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain

Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #28 on: May 31, 2015, 02:37:32 AM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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before this season, everyone assumed the sox had one of the top offenses in baseball and the question most asked was whether the offense could compensate for the starting pitching.

well...what a difference 50 games make. in the month of May, the sox averaged 2.8 runs per game. NO ONE ELSE IN BASEBALL AVERAGED LESS THAN 3 RUNS PER GAME IN MAY.

the starting pitching has been worse than worried about. the starters are not bad in the sense of lack of talent. they fluctuate between good and crappy, with too many visits to the world of crapocity. it is as if the entire starting rotation decided to become bi-polar this season.

the "heros" right now are wright and rodriquez, both of whom started the season in AAA. i am a big fan of wright, but if he is one of your top starters, you have troubles.

buchholz is showing you can never know what he will do. miley and kelly may best be part of the bullpen. porcello? the "ace" is anything but. his non-performance is perhaps the biggest problem on the starting staff.

the bull pen has the usual stars, but the middle innings guys are worse than sucky. can anyone tell me why breslow still has a job in major league baseball?

the offense, what to say? they seem to take turns in failing to hit when it counts. is big papi toast? i dont know, but he does seem to have butter and jelly spread all of him. yet, slow starts are not unusual for him. so hope, or at least denial, abounds.

napoli, after the film sessions with peddy seems to be back on track. but panda still cant hit left handers. hanley is inconsistent and let's be kind and NOT discuss his defense. the OF is a mess in general. catching? ha, swihart may emerge out of all this as an all star, but for now he is still a rookie.

so, this team is disappointing on all fronts. i dont know how much longer farrell can hang onto his job. unless this team performs remotely to their abilities his future as manager of the sox may not be a long and happy one.

cripes, this team is disappointing this year.  :(
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Re: 2015 Boston Red Sox
« Reply #29 on: May 31, 2015, 02:58:54 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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Quote
Red Sox Stats ?@redsoxstats  May 27
The 3 worst Red Sox team OBP seasons from 1960-2015: 2015, 2012, 2014. In 2013 they won the World Series. The Cherington Era.
You値l have to excuse my lengthiness葉he reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain