Report: Celtics turned down multiple offers for Avery Bradley

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

[Ilikesports17]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

[Monkhouse]

Even if you think about it, I still think Isaiah Thomas is someone that Ainge will definitely trade.

The Celtics think Isaiah Thomas is a better asset to trade than the protected 2016 first-round pick from Cleveland that they gave up to get him from the Suns at the deadline, according to Lowe. The C’s talked about waiting to do the Thomas deal to avoid winning too many games down the stretch this year, but decided against that, with Ainge informing coach Brad Stevens, whom he normally keeps in the loop, of the deal just an hour before it happened, as Lowe examines. “Ideally, he might have been someone you pick up in the summer,” Ainge said. “But someone else might trade for him. You might be in a bidding war. You have to move while the iron is hot.”

[Eja117]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Ainge isn't gonna resign all our expiring guys. We'll have room for a max free agent if one is willing to sign here. Possibly even two is he's willing to dump the two PHI 2nds or maybe the DAL 1st to get rod of Wallace's deal a year early. He would of we really had two max-level guys wanting to play here .

Bradley's only 23, he's on a fair-value and soon to be good-value contract. He's a 40% 3 point shooter who plays top-tier defense and by all accounts is a good guy to have around your franchise. The kinda deals Danny left on the table for him this year will be there again. No reason to just dump him off for mediocre return. Cap room is over-valued in my opinion.

Avery is a 36% 3pt shooter which is good but not great.

His advanced metrics suck since he doesn't penetrate. Doesn't get to the FT line. Doesn't rebound and is one of the worst passing SG in the NBA.

He is also undersized, and gets bullied by opposing SG who have 2"5" height and 20-40 lbs weight advantage on him. He is a bench player on a good team - and should not even start for our team. I am not hating on the guy - but he is a SG stuck in a PG body and that is a big problem in the NBA.....

and yet, Doc started him over Ray Allen on a good team with Hall of Famers.

Which was the beginning of the end for the big three. Doc made a lot of dumb decisions as coach of the celtics.

Are you sure it wasn't when Ray Allen stopped playing defense?

As opposed to how Rondo and Bradley both stopped playing defense?

Yes. Definitely.

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

[mahcus smaht]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

I would, so I guess that we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's okay. No big deal.

[slamtheking]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

have to agree. for all AB's flaws, he's still much better than both of those guys combined.  anyone that seriously believes someone as good as AB will be available between 25-30 this year is fooling themselves

[SHAQATTACK]

Bradley solid D  .     He has got a improved jumper going. Some nice catch n shoot......but I don't trust the ball in his hands for longer than it takes him to shoot.

I still see him telegraph ALOT of his passes.  Seriously needs improvement moving the ball around.

Passing accuracy is very poor.

[mahcus smaht]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

I would, so I guess that we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's okay. No big deal.

TP for offering a rare peaceful disagreement instead of launching into a tirade about how only an imbecile could prefer Bradley to Markel Brown

[BDeCosta26]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Ainge isn't gonna resign all our expiring guys. We'll have room for a max free agent if one is willing to sign here. Possibly even two is he's willing to dump the two PHI 2nds or maybe the DAL 1st to get rod of Wallace's deal a year early. He would of we really had two max-level guys wanting to play here .

Bradley's only 23, he's on a fair-value and soon to be good-value contract. He's a 40% 3 point shooter who plays top-tier defense and by all accounts is a good guy to have around your franchise. The kinda deals Danny left on the table for him this year will be there again. No reason to just dump him off for mediocre return. Cap room is over-valued in my opinion.

Avery is a 36% 3pt shooter which is good but not great.

His advanced metrics suck since he doesn't penetrate. Doesn't get to the FT line. Doesn't rebound and is one of the worst passing SG in the NBA.

He is also undersized, and gets bullied by opposing SG who have 2"5" height and 20-40 lbs weight advantage on him. He is a bench player on a good team - and should not even start for our team. I am not hating on the guy - but he is a SG stuck in a PG body and that is a big problem in the NBA.....

and yet, Doc started him over Ray Allen on a good team with Hall of Famers.

Which was the beginning of the end for the big three. Doc made a lot of dumb decisions as coach of the celtics.

Are you sure it wasn't when Ray Allen stopped playing defense?

As opposed to how Rondo and Bradley both stopped playing defense?

Bradley never stopped playing defense. That myth needs to be squashed. You don't generate 5 steals in ANY game if you stopped playing defense. What little drop off to ABs top-tier D there has been is easily explained by being a featured player on offense. When your a top option on offense it's impossible to give as much on D as a perimeter defensive specialist like Bradley used to be.

He started over Ray because that Cs team needed his energy and defense. He could easily start on a bunch of other teams in this league. And he's one of the most important reasons we've played so well since the trades. The Anti-Bradley sentiment from some folks around here is just crazy. It's like you expect him to be some kind of a star. For what he is, he's a very good and improving player .

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

have to agree. for all AB's flaws, he's still much better than both of those guys combined.  anyone that seriously believes someone as good as AB will be available between 25-30 this year is fooling themselves

Naturally, I don't agree, which is fine, but I have to ask - have you seen either one of them play at all this year?

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

I would, so I guess that we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's okay. No big deal.

TP for offering a rare peaceful disagreement instead of launching into a tirade about how only an imbecile could prefer Bradley to Markel Brown

Haha. I do what I can, lol.

[BDeCosta26]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

I would, so I guess that we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's okay. No big deal.

TP for civility! Naturally, I disagree.

In every draft there's good, useful players in both rounds. But the chance of finding another player as good as AB at #19 where we drafted him is really low. At #26 it's even lower. Is it possible? Sure, but unlikely. Even the best drafters in the league have more misses than hits in that area of the draft.

It's the same thing as saying. "Giannis is gonna be a star, Ainge is a fool for picking KO instead!" It's disingenuous. The draft is a crapshoot, especially after the top 5-10 picks. Getting Bradley at #19 is a great pick, and trading him at 23 years old after how much he's improved here for a new pick even later in the draft is just silly.

I love KJ too, but I'm not trading Bradley for him straight up. Need at least a conditional first to even consider that

[Beat LA]

I liked the idea of dumping Bradley's contract and getting a 1st.  He's not that good and the money can probably be better spent on the free agent market.  But once we committed money to Thomas that cut into our cap space, it kinda put a damper on my hope of luring a couple max contract players here through free agency.  If we ever land a star here it's going to have to be through a trade package.

Apparently Danny liked Bradley more than a pick that may be in the 25-30 range.

And yet he took a very similar return for Rondo. Umm...

The difference is Rondo was gonna be a free agent, and had expressed already that he wanted out.

Bradley was signed on for a few more years.

Plus we got two first round picks, and two decent role players in Crowder/Wright, who was traded for another protected first round pick. So ultimately, for Rondo we got 3 first round picks.

Thanks for correcting me, TP.  There have been so many trades this year that I can't remember the details of all of them, lol.  I do wish that we could have gotten a 1st for Bradley, though.

Even in the 25-30 range? keep in mind AB is still getting better and isnt on an albatross of a contract. My question is could you do better at 25? I tend to doubt it, but that all depends on how you feel about Bradley.

Bradley is solid, but he still can't dribble or pass, and Smart looks like his replacement, anyway.  Now, could we get a comparable player to AB in the 25-30 range?  Absolutely.  KJ McDaniels and Markel Brown were both second round picks last year.

I dont know about you but I wouldnt trade AB for either of those guys and thats not even taking into account the risks of drafting a jajuan johnson

I would, so I guess that we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's okay. No big deal.

TP for civility! Naturally, I disagree.

In every draft there's good, useful players in both rounds. But the chance of finding another player as good as AB at #19 where we drafted him is really low. At #26 it's even lower. Is it possible? Sure, but unlikely. Even the best drafters in the league have more misses than hits in that area of the draft.

It's the same thing as saying. "Giannis is gonna be a star, Ainge is a fool for picking KO instead!" It's disingenuous. The draft is a crapshoot, especially after the top 5-10 picks. Getting Bradley at #19 is a great pick, and trading him at 23 years old after how much he's improved here for a new pick even later in the draft is just silly.

I love KJ too, but I'm not trading Bradley for him straight up. Need at least a conditional first to even consider that

Actually, it might not be as improbable as you think, because funnily enough, nbadraft.net has compared a guy to AB.  Where he'll be drafted is uncertain, but I can see him falling to the second round like KJ.  His name is Gary Payton II, lol! How about that?  Here's their assessment, which was written on February 28 of this year -

NBA Player Comparison: Avery Bradley

Strengths:Late bloomer with great athletic attributes… Payton is a jack of all trade player at Oregon State where he can play any position 1 through 4 … He has been a statistical monster on the defensive end: Averaging 3 steals 7.5 rebounds and 1.3 blocks per game as a guard … Payton, like his dad, has his hands on nearly every entry pass, has an uncanny ability to shot block as a guard without fouling, and is a game changer defensive force that opponents must game plan for … On the offensive end Payton has a quick step and takes great angles when driving to the hoop leading to nearly a 50% field goal percentage … Getting to the hole is where he is most dangerous as he is very creative and skillful in absorbing contact and finishing strong to the hole … Explosive athlete at 6”3 he has the ability to catch and finish one handed and two handed alley oops … Payton has good form and rotation on his jump shot and has a developing mid range and long distance game. While he is an older prospect Paton’s biggest strength is his strong work ethic: his havoc causing intensity on defense and his development over the course of this season is remarkable ... He has made great strides in his development into a lead guard as early on this season he was viewed more as a 2 -3 and has become more into a 1-2 combo guard which would be required at the next level ... He is the star player on one of the surprise teams in the NCAAs as Oregon State was thought to be the doormat of the Pac 12 in preseason rankings and will be at worst NIT Bound ...

Weaknesses:As mentioned, Payton is older than most of his competition at 22 years old having spent a prep season in Arizona limiting his potential upside for most analytics ... To complicate things as a late bloomer he has limited experience playing at the elite level. Furthermore his time spent in Utah Junior college has limited his exposure to scouts and to competition… Thus putting greater risk on an organization to see him perform at a consistent level…He needs to work on his ability to set teammates up and running a team averaging over 2 turnovers per game to only 3 assist per game ... Handles could be honed some in particular his left… His outside shooting is his biggest weakness… While rotation and release is clean on his shot his release speed and arc could use some refining… He has improved his free throw shooting from the JC by 15% but still is only at 67% for the season at Oregon State and is under 30% from 3 point range…

Notes: Son of NBA Hall of Famer Gary Payton… Attended Salt Lake City Community College ...

Check out his stats, too, btw -

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/3134903/gary-payton-ii

In fairness, I don't think I can give you the Giannis-KO argument, though, because, well, I've made it, lol. Taking Nolynyk was bad enough, but Ainge compounded his mistake by trading up to get him.  If he was going to trade up at all, it should have been for the Greek Freak.  Even if we'd stayed at 16, guys like Schrodinger's cat (sarcasm), Dieng, Hardaway Jr., and Rudy Gobert were all available, and on draft night, I'll admit it, I would have taken Hardaway Jr., who has actually turned out to be a much better player than I thought he'd be, lol.

I also don't think that the draft is a crap shoot.  Saying that sounds like a cop-out to me.  Look at it this way - if Ainge had still blown up the team and had done a couple of other moves, our frontline of the future could very well have been Giannis as our small forward, Julius Randle as our 4, and Hassan Whiteside as our center, in addition to also having guys like James Young, KJ McDaniels, Markel Brown, and perhaps even Mitch McGary.  Sure, we still would have missed out on Embiid , but that core looks promising.  Well, to me, at least, but I'm an idiot lol. I'm sure that you disagree, right?