Great C's article by Zach Lowe

[celticsclay]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Thank you for being a second voice of reason. In our darkest seasons I was never saying Allan Ray or similar players were discovered gems. I knew we had a lot of really crappy players cause we were a crappy team. Its frustrating the level of hinkieology we are dealing with

[celticsclay]

I think the core of his argument is here:

Once players have played for multiple seasons in the league where they were drafted has absolutely no bearing on their skill, ability, or staying power.

Which seems to be a fairly uncontroversial statement to me.

Yes.  That is my point.  He also keeps saying Philly found all these players in one year, which also isn't true as Sampson is the only rookie.  Sims and Covington played for other NBA teams before ending up in Philly and Thompson is now in his second year for the team (so is Sims).  These aren't 10 day contract players that won't be back.  These are guys that have firmly established themselves as NBA level players over the course of time and extending into multiple seasons. 

And I'm not sure I'd actually call Zeller's teams better than Sims to the point it would make a difference (i.e. they were all bad teams).  I mean the Cavs weren't exactly world beaters and sure Boston is better than Philly, but I don't think anyone would call Boston a good team.   

I mean here is a description of a player.  You tell me if you think he can stick as a quality bench player on a good team.

6'8" SG/SF, 23 years old
141 games with 63 starts about 24 minutes a game
39.2% from three on just under 3 shots a game
47.1% from two on about 4 and a half shots a game
7 points over 3 boards and an assist
Doesn't turn ball over or commit fouls at a significant rate

To me that says classic rotation player.  A guy that is going to come in, hit some open shots and generally play ok all around basketball.

Obviously that is Hollis Thompson, but it also pretty much fits the description of Kyle Korver his first two years in the league (also on Philly no less).  I have no idea if Thompson will turn into a Korver level player, I'm just pointing out the similarity.

When Philly plays the Hawks the Hawks sit the whole [dang] starting lineup. Thats the difference between Tyler Zeller and Henry Sims

This is another valid point

[mahcus smaht]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Thank you for being a second voice of reason. In our darkest seasons I was never saying Allan Ray or similar players were discovered gems. I knew we had a lot of really crappy players cause we were a crappy team. Its frustrating the level of hinkieology we are dealing with

As I read through the thread, I am realizing you have articulated this argument extensively. TP for hitting it first and also for managing to not drop f bombs left and right in your responses I was rather fired up.

[fairweatherfan]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

See Tony Campbell before and after he played for the expansion T-Wolves.  Or any of the Knicks' current flotsam and jetsam rotation.

NBA-caliber players, outside of the handful who are just physical freaks but never learn to play, are all really, really good at basketball.  Give almost any one of them enough opportunities and they might not win many games, but they will put up numbers. 

[celticsclay]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

See Tony Campbell before and after he played for the expansion T-Wolves.  Or any of the Knicks' current flotsam and jetsam rotation.

NBA-caliber players, outside of the handful who are just physical freaks but never learn to play, are all really, really good at basketball.  Give almost any one of them enough opportunities and they might not win many games, but they will put up numbers.

It seemed like I was inventing  the concept of putting up good numbers on a bad team here. So glad to see others chiming in. What is particularly mind blowing for me is that we all just saw this on the Celtics in the past decade. We had Brandon Hunter having a 20 rebound game and pulling down crazy boards. Allen Ray stringing together 16-20 point games at the end of 1 season. Orien Green, Justin Reed... oh man 

[Moranis]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

[D.o.s.]

I absolutely agree with that post, Moranis. Well said.

[slamtheking]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

They're all just bench-quality players on the C's.  the Philly roster is loaded with players that if they made someone's bench they'd be at the very tail end of the bench if not in street clothes.  The C's players though would actually make the rotation on other teams.

is there really anyone playing for Philly right now that you'd add to the C's roster other than Noel?  I wouldn't.  Smith, Canaan and Sims are the bigger names there but even our bench-quality players are better than them.

[cman88]

We cant really say the Sixers way is the better way until about 5 years from now to see where both teams sit.

the sixers plan seems to be get as HORRIBLE as you can and hope you draft guys who become superstars. Luck plays into a lot of that. Theres a chance Embiid may  be another greg oden. we don't know what he will be in the NBA.

Celtics on the other hand have just as many picks, but seem intent on competing and developing assets as best they can. maybe those assets will be used in trades, maybe they will be used to move up in a draft for an impact player.

Considering how poorly the Celtics have fared in hoping for "luck" in the lottery im surprised Celtics fans want them to continue that path. they missed out in the Duncan draft, they missed out on Durant, and they missed out on Wiggins. all in years they had poor records. On the other hand, the only championship this team has had has come from ainge maneuvering his assets into a major trade.

so, I really have no problem with guys like Thomas, zeller, sullinger, olynyk playing well and leading the team to wins because if anything it ups their trade value for ainge to potentially jump on someone much better in the future. theres a better chance of that happening than landing a #1 pick, and that pick being an all-star to lead you to a finals win

[Who]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

They're all just bench-quality players on the C's.  the Philly roster is loaded with players that if they made someone's bench they'd be at the very tail end of the bench if not in street clothes.  The C's players though would actually make the rotation on other teams.

is there really anyone playing for Philly right now that you'd add to the C's roster other than Noel?  I wouldn't.  Smith, Canaan and Sims are the bigger names there but even our bench-quality players are better than them.

Jerami Grant is a good one too. Plays good defense. Rebounds. Hits the outside shot. Has size and athleticism. Good 3+D player. I think he has starter potential (at SF).

Noel and Grant. They are the only two guys I'd be interested in.

You could debate their backup quality wings vs Boston's backup quality wings but that is nothing to get excited about. I think James Young has best long term potential out of all of those players despite a couple of those Philly guys are out-playing him right now.

[Moranis]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

They're all just bench-quality players on the C's.  the Philly roster is loaded with players that if they made someone's bench they'd be at the very tail end of the bench if not in street clothes.  The C's players though would actually make the rotation on other teams.

is there really anyone playing for Philly right now that you'd add to the C's roster other than Noel?  I wouldn't.  Smith, Canaan and Sims are the bigger names there but even our bench-quality players are better than them.

Jerami Grant is a good one too. Plays good defense. Rebounds. Hits the outside shot. Has size and athleticism. Good 3+D player. I think he has starter potential (at SF).

Noel and Grant. They are the only two guys I'd be interested in.

You could debate their backup quality wings vs Boston's backup quality wings but that is nothing to get excited about. I think James Young has best long term potential out of all of those players albeit a couple of those Philly guys are out-playing him right now.

I'd take Wroten, Sims, Covington, and Thompson over Pressey, Randolph, Wallace, and Datome and wouldn't give it a second thought.  If Boston was better I'd certainly look Mbah a Moute, Canaan, and Smith as opposed to guys like Crowder and Zeller. 

Thomas Robinson I would add over every single guy on Boston I mentioned above. 

And I have no idea what to make of Furkan Aldemir who had a fairly decent career in Turkey before coming to Philly in December of this season.

[KeepRondo]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

Isaiah Thomas comes off the bench and is certainly not a scrub. You made a ton of solid points but you lost me on that one. Not to mention, some teams have terrible bench players and others have bench players who could easily start on other teams. Just because some team picked up a bench player on another team does not automatically devalue your team if you insert him as a starter.

[KeepRondo]

Double post. Removed.

[Evantime34]

I think it's fair to say their top assets (Noel, Embiid, pick this year) are better than our 3 top assets but after that I can't agree with their assets being as good as ours.

Hinkie has let it be known that pretty much anyone on the Sixers roster that can be had for a second round pick. The back end players on the Sixers would have been moved if they had any real value. That makes it really easy to know what the gms around the league think of the Sixers roster.

The Sixers have a bright future, but having a bright future and realizing it are something different. Even if all their players develop perfectly I don't see them being better than us for at least 3 more years.

Our ability to be competitive now gives us a huge edge over them in free agency and even in trades for established talent (no big name player is agreeing to go to Philly anytime soon). So the C's are better now and if they are able to leverage this into attracting talent that Philly won't be able to the C's will also be better long term.

[celticsclay]

Dear God, this is horrifying. When Sixers fans come on here and say our four best assets are all better than anything you have, they have a legit argument. I think Philly and Boston will be interesting to compare for the next decades as they took such different roots in the rebuild.

But when you start acting like Jakarr something or other and Henry Sims and Ish Smith...Ish Smith, and Isiah Canaan are worth anything in the whole world you lose all, and I mean all credibility. Go back and look at any big time tank operation and you will see a bunch of guys putting up reasonable stats, because someone has got to put the ball in the basket. Lets look at last year. Evan Turner and MCW put up great stats for philly, better stats than anyone that you guys are touting as hidden gems. Since then it has been discovered that these players are not good.

STOP BONING PHILLLY!!!!*

When discussing Embiid, Noel, a top5 pick, and Saric boning is permitted, but not when you are talking about ish ****ing smith

Ish Smith and Isiah Canaan were bench players on playoff teams before coming to Philly.  Hell Canaan even started 9 games for Houston this year.  Sure they are getting more minutes and thus producing better on Philly because Philly is not a playoff team, but if they could be bench players on playoff teams in the past, one would reason they would be bench players on playoff teams in the future. 

MCW post trade on a per minute basis is scoring the same, has upped his steals, lowered his turnovers, though his assists and rebounds are down.  He went from a terrible team to the 6th seed in the East and is about the same player.  And he is a volume scorer type player. 

A guy like Hollis Thompson isn't going to forget how to shoot if he was on a better team and there aren't many guys 6'8" who enter the league and are over 39% from three that early on.  Most players take awhile to get up to that sort of real shooting. 


Again these guys are bench players that are being forced to start because Philly only has one quality starter (Noel).  You aren't going to win if you are starting and playing bench players huge minutes.  My point in this thread has been merely there isn't much difference between guys like Zeller and Crowder and guys like Sims and Thompson.  You can't call the Boston players assets and the Philly guys scrubs.  The numbers just don't bear that out.  I'd be perfectly fine if you called them all scrubs though because lets face it they are all nothing more than bench players.

They're all just bench-quality players on the C's.  the Philly roster is loaded with players that if they made someone's bench they'd be at the very tail end of the bench if not in street clothes.  The C's players though would actually make the rotation on other teams.

is there really anyone playing for Philly right now that you'd add to the C's roster other than Noel?  I wouldn't.  Smith, Canaan and Sims are the bigger names there but even our bench-quality players are better than them.

Jerami Grant is a good one too. Plays good defense. Rebounds. Hits the outside shot. Has size and athleticism. Good 3+D player. I think he has starter potential (at SF).

Noel and Grant. They are the only two guys I'd be interested in.

You could debate their backup quality wings vs Boston's backup quality wings but that is nothing to get excited about. I think James Young has best long term potential out of all of those players albeit a couple of those Philly guys are out-playing him right now.

I'd take Wroten, Sims, Covington, and Thompson over Pressey, Randolph, Wallace, and Datome and wouldn't give it a second thought.  If Boston was better I'd certainly look Mbah a Moute, Canaan, and Smith as opposed to guys like Crowder and Zeller. 

Thomas Robinson I would add over every single guy on Boston I mentioned above. 

And I have no idea what to make of Furkan Aldemir who had a fairly decent career in Turkey before coming to Philly in December of this season.

It would be kind of cool if you could quit making up straw man arguments and staying stuff that is blatantly inaccurate.

The part in bolded isn't what anyone is, or has been talking about in this conversation. You mentioned the 4 worst players on Boston who play a combined 12 minutes a game with 3 of them usually receiving DNPs and compared them to 4 guys on Philly who play, when healthy a combined 100 minutes a game and all of whom have started at times this seasons. That a BS comparison and you know it.

Secondly you talk about Ish Smith getting minutes on a playoff team. He has played in 4 games combined in 3 years in the playoffs and taken a grand total of 4 shots. He has never ever been in a playoff rotation. Canaan actually did get a few minutes on Houston because they have probably the worst point guard rotation in the league. He still did not play a single minute in the playoffs for them last year.

We have a pretty astute Philly fan on these boards and he gave a legit run down on the players on his team in the love of Philadelphia friend. The fact that your evaluation of their talent exceeds his by a very wide margin, as well as the fact that you are constantly making up and stretching facts, says a lot about you and your "evaluation."

Finally Cannaan and Smith over Crowder? Crowder is no all star, but his value as an nba player compared to Smith in particularly is not really debatable and Crowder will score a much better contract than either of those guys this offseason.