Author Topic: its simple-missing sully's bulk  (Read 3143 times)

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its simple-missing sully's bulk
« on: March 30, 2015, 07:45:23 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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the celts against some teams just don't match up .And some teams can adapt to small ball and devour it-lets face it -the whole team is small ball,brad has defeated several teams that could not adapt ,the clippers were not one-

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2015, 07:59:12 AM »

Offline clover

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Sully could always land some boards, which helps, but he's been pretty reliably overmatched by bigger and/or more athletic opposition.

Where he's always feasted, shall we say, is on average and below average frontcourt opponents.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2015, 08:17:33 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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sully was smart on d ,i thoght his type of bulk disrupted some of bigger slower centers- but zeller ,kelly jerebko were so clearly out of their depth and i still believe that isiah should not play till healed -did you see him crawling in pain-he has to inititate contact and have his balance last night was at rex moment in more respects than one-5 much better well coached players beat our well coached band of over achievers-
« Last Edit: March 30, 2015, 09:42:31 AM by rollie mass »

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2015, 08:26:14 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Denny's stock is dropping as Sully sheds the pounds.

Sell now !

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2015, 08:31:35 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I 'll take ball movement over laziness and fat every day.  Sully was productive on the offensive end, pathetic on the other and didn't bother to run the floor. 

We were 18-31 with Sully this year.   We are 12-10 without him.   Now there are other factors like losing Green and Rondo and adding IT.   But there is a big difference of being a .55% win team without and a .37% with him.   Is it all on Sully, nope but some of it was folks.

In all honesty, we need more talent on this team.   Some of that talent needs to be athletic.  I miss Sully about as much as I miss hitting my thumb with a hammer.

Sully does not help us play small ball because he is out of shape and does not run.   He literally was too lazy to run baseline to baseline and would launch threes as a result.   He has does not help us play big ball either as he is a short 6-9 PF who does not match up well with athletic ability.   So he only is useful in certain circumstances and he needs a rim protector to cover his butt on D.  The kid can rebound and has nice hands but clover is right he is a bottom feeder.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2015, 09:53:14 AM »

Offline Hemingway

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Where he's always feasted, shall we say, is on average and below average frontcourt opponents.

Looks to me like he is feasting at McDonalds every day.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2015, 10:07:08 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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I think commmitting to play small for the most part has worked out for the C's. Though matchup wise we could use another banger like Sully for sure.

And by worked out they're a .500 team when playing a pretty easy EC schedule. The hot steak post all-star game isn't something I put much stock in, though it was fun to watch a some good games for a while.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2015, 10:09:21 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Where he's always feasted, shall we say, is on average and below average frontcourt opponents.
Not really, he had plenty of big games against All-stars and all-nba type players.

He's just not good enough to do so consistently game to game, especially with his fitness level.

If anything I wish he'd beat up on weaker frontcourts more often, really good players will do that more consistently than when matched with equal talent. Have to capitalize when you do have the advantage.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2015, 10:32:06 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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sully had good reach and good hands are you saying crowder and bass are better on cousins or in last nights game or against lopez or mozogov-nobody is going to push a sully boxout-zeller and jerbko both who run the floor looked like waifs last night-luigi  took 12 shots-

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2015, 10:34:01 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I think he will be a better player if he gets in shape.   But that is a huge if and his athletic base is not a good one.   A guy who can run and jump and has length will always cause him problems.   But too suggest we lost this game because we did not have him is pure folly.   There is a huge talent differential between the teams.

The thing I would like to see him do is get down to 260.   Improve his mobility so he can stay in front of his man more and slide over on help.   He needs to quit shooting threes and focus on what he does well, which is rebound and nifty post moves that get him to the line.   Tell him up front that you do not play D or run the court then you do not play.   He has a lot on his plate ( know that will get some funny comments) and it is really a critical time in his career.  It will be a time whether he becomes a professional or just a guy who played in the NBA.

This team needs to run like it has since he left the team.  In some ways if he got in shape, he would be the perfect center for small ball as he is such a gifted rebounder.  But he tries to be something he is not and that is Kyle Korver Jr.  Smart guys focus on what they do well and work on what they do not in the offseason.

Quote
Jerbko both who run the floor looked like waifs last night
  This pretty much proves to me, that you do not watch the games or understand what you see.   Jonas had eight rebounds.  He led us in rebounds and he only played 22 minutes

http://www.nba.com/games/20150329/LACBOS/gameinfo.html?ls=eref:google:1b:post

« Last Edit: March 30, 2015, 10:52:05 AM by Celtics4ever »

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2015, 10:48:09 AM »

Offline clover

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Where he's always feasted, shall we say, is on average and below average frontcourt opponents.

Looks to me like he is feasting at McDonalds every day.

So who's the Ronald McDonald of the NBA?

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2015, 10:57:42 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Here is some info about his matchups with Blake.  It's fantasy but the head to head stats on the bottom are actual.   It is obvious he does not help us much given this matchup.   The incredible bulk does not play well against BG.   BG is the more talented of the two, that is a given.

http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/los-angeles-clippers/players/blake-griffin/comparison/15/12/187/25

He has a history of foul trouble against him, sometimes indicative of being slower than your man.  Does well on the boards  but not as well as one would think and he has shot poorly vs the Griff, one would expect this given BG is taller and can jump.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2015, 08:45:21 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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Where he's always feasted, shall we say, is on average and below average frontcourt opponents.
I never found that to be the case. The best games of his career have come against Cousins, Gasol (16 and 16, 23 and 10), Davis (27 and 10), Horford (22 and 9), Bogut (22 and 11), Love(24 and 11), Grizz frountcourt(23 and 12), Tim Duncan (19 and 17), Aldridge (26 and 8 )

If you count Toronto as above average hes also lit them up for 19 and 16, 26 and 8, 25 and 20.

In fact one of my favorite things about sully was that he came to play against the studs of the NBA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDmoH1TMgNw
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2015, 08:55:03 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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I 'll take ball movement over laziness and fat every day.  Sully was productive on the offensive end, pathetic on the other and didn't bother to run the floor. 

We were 18-31 with Sully this year.   We are 12-10 without him.   Now there are other factors like losing Green and Rondo and adding IT.   But there is a big difference of being a .55% win team without and a .37% with him.   Is it all on Sully, nope but some of it was folks.

In all honesty, we need more talent on this team.   Some of that talent needs to be athletic.  I miss Sully about as much as I miss hitting my thumb with a hammer.

Sully does not help us play small ball because he is out of shape and does not run.   He literally was too lazy to run baseline to baseline and would launch threes as a result.   He has does not help us play big ball either as he is a short 6-9 PF who does not match up well with athletic ability.   So he only is useful in certain circumstances and he needs a rim protector to cover his butt on D.  The kid can rebound and has nice hands but clover is right he is a bottom feeder.

And keeps ignoring how the Celtics throughout the season have been steadily improving, in particular after that incredibly difficult start to the season, which I believe as among the top 3 most difficult schedules in the NBA.

It also ignores how the Celtics were already in an upward trend WITH Sullinger before he got injured, and right after that we got the influx of talent.

So this talk about how we've been better without Sullinger is just a bunch of nonsense.

I've been disappointed with Sullinger's defense this particular year, he was very good defensively for us previously, so hope he comes back to form on THAT regard going forward.

But the notion that the reason for our success has been because we don't have Sullinger on the floor is crap. We'd be even better right now, and there's little doubt on that.

Re: its simple-missing sully's bulk
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2015, 10:03:28 PM »

Offline Rosco917

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I think we miss Sully's scoring, rebounding, and put backs more than anything else.
I'm willing to give Sully a chance. I want to see what a 260 lb. Sully plays like. 

Sully had some solid games for the Celtics, where he carried the offense with timely interior scoring and rebounding. If he can become a two way player, that we all want... that would be a positive. On the other hand if he comes in 10 lighter with a smile and a story, then it's time to look for a replacement.