Bob Cousy thinks we should go all in on Hassan "Bill Russell" Whiteside

[Yoki_IsTheName]

Over the last 8 games, the Heat are -42 with Whiteside in the game.  He's averaging 11 points and 8.6 rebounds, along with 2.5 blocks.  He has also missed three games, one due to suspension.

To me, that's not a Bill Russell impact, and it's not worth three #1s.

17 points, 15 rebounds, 4 blocks per 36 minutes. 26.4 PER.

Top 10 in Defensive Plus/Minus among Centers, 11th in Real Plus/Minus among Centers. His Block % is better than Rudy Gobert, who leads the league in Block % right now only because Whiteside did not played enough games to qualify for the spot. His rebounding rate is BETTER than DeAndre Jordan, who leads the league in Rebounding % only because, again, he didn't have enough games.

Is that Bill Russell? Of course not. But is that Bill Russell impact, if it isn't, it's pretty darn close. Definitely worth three #1's.

11 points, 9.8 rebounds, 2.5 blocks in 22 minutes (22 MINUTES) per game. A center who posts that kind of numbers in 30+ minutes per game will be highly coveted if he's a free agent. And here he is, doing it on significantly less time on the floor. Heck, he had 7 points, 8 rebounds, 2 blocks in 12 minutes before he injured his hand against Milwaukee.

That per 36 stat, you give it on player x and there will be arguments that he will be worth three 1st, but Whiteside isn't?

And for the "the league figured him out". Yeah, they figured him out. He's still averaging a double-double and 2-3 blocks per game. What happens if he figures out the league?

[Roy H.]

But is that Bill Russell impact, if it isn't, it's pretty darn close.

Bill Russell is the best defensive player of all-time.  In his last 15 years of organized basketball, he won 2 college championships, 11 NBA titles, and a gold medal.  The Heat are 16-25 when Whiteside plays.  That's the opposite of a Bill Russell impact.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

But is that Bill Russell impact, if it isn't, it's pretty darn close.

Bill Russell is the best defensive player of all-time.  In his last 15 years of organized basketball, he won 2 college championships, 11 NBA titles, and a gold medal.  The Heat are 16-25 when Whiteside plays.  That's the opposite of a Bill Russell impact.

C'mon Roy. Of course no one compares to Rus.

I'm merely stating that Whiteside is a force on the defensive end, ala Russell on defense. His impact is close to Russell in a sense that he'll block a lot of shots and he'll control the boards and be imposing in the paint. Of course he's not going to have Bill Russell's impact overall, he's not the leader nor does he have the mentality to be Russell. But defensively, you gotta at least take the numbers for what it is, he's a great defensive player and he can make a tremendous impact on defense, just like #6... On defense.

[D.o.s.]

That's like saying Nick Young has a "Jordan-esque" shot because when he hits a Jumper it's worth two points, Same as MJ.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

That's like saying Nick Young has a "Jordan-esque" shot because when he hits a Jumper it's worth two points, Same as MJ.

Except it isn't. Find me Centers who can get you 10 rebounds and 2-3 blocks per game on 22 minutes. If you can, then I will take that point of yours.

[Eddie20]

That's like saying Nick Young has a "Jordan-esque" shot because when he hits a Jumper it's worth two points, Same as MJ.

Except it isn't. Find me another Center who can get you 10 rebounds and 2-3 blocks per game on 22 minutes. If you can, then I will take that point of yours.

Rudy Gobert

[Yoki_IsTheName]

That's like saying Nick Young has a "Jordan-esque" shot because when he hits a Jumper it's worth two points, Same as MJ.

Except it isn't. Find me another Center who can get you 10 rebounds and 2-3 blocks per game on 22 minutes. If you can, then I will take that point of yours.

Rudy Gobert

And you're not going to give three 1st for Gobert if you have a chance?

[D.o.s.]

No.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

No.

Fair enough. I would. And I would so with Whiteside as well. So agree to disagree then.

[GreenWarrior]

even if he is what cousy believes, that cheap shot on Kelly was not enough for me to care for him.

I would take the guy even after the cheapshot but he does have some temper issues.   We 'd not be looking for a rim protector, sorry to the inconsistent Hippie, err I mean KO. JK

Enforcers are ok as long as they on your side.

enforcers certainly are ok. what was whiteside enforcing? I could see if KO did something earlier in the game to him or a teammate, like wade injuring Thomas. I would expect some retaliation in the form of some harder fouls.

there's being an enforcer and there's just being a clown. this guy may have all the ability in the world, but i'll go out on and a limb and say this guy's career falls well short of Bill Russell's. due in large part to his make up.   

[Roy H.]

But is that Bill Russell impact, if it isn't, it's pretty darn close.

Bill Russell is the best defensive player of all-time.  In his last 15 years of organized basketball, he won 2 college championships, 11 NBA titles, and a gold medal.  The Heat are 16-25 when Whiteside plays.  That's the opposite of a Bill Russell impact.

C'mon Roy. Of course no one compares to Rus.

I'm merely stating that Whiteside is a force on the defensive end, ala Russell on defense. His impact is close to Russell in a sense that he'll block a lot of shots and he'll control the boards and be imposing in the paint. Of course he's not going to have Bill Russell's impact overall, he's not the leader nor does he have the mentality to be Russell. But defensively, you gotta at least take the numbers for what it is, he's a great defensive player and he can make a tremendous impact on defense, just like #6... On defense.

Well, first, I'm not the one who said that Whiteside was having a impact "pretty darn close" to Russell's.

I think his defensive impact is overrated, though.  In his most frequent lineup with Miami, they're giving up 108 points per 100 possessions.  That's very poor.  In five of his top eight lineups, the Heat give up 106+ points per 100 possessions, with them giving up 123 points per 100 possessions in three of the top eight lineups (horrifically bad). 

His overall defensive rating is 106.2.  Coincidentally, that matches Miami's overall defensive rating, that ranks 20th in the NBA.

His Defensive Real Plus Minus has been falling like a brick lately, and is wedged between Timofey Mozgov and Zaza Pachulia.  His FG% allowed at the rim is 12th among the top-22 guys in FGAs at the rim per game.

By the numbers, Whiteside isn't a great defender.   Rather, he blocks a lot of shots, which isn't the same as great defense.  (For an example of a guy who is a great defender, look at Rudy Gobert's numbers.  He holds opponent's to 39.5% shooting at the rim.  Nobody else in the top-50 in terms of FGAs faced is sub-40%.)

[GreenFaith1819]

That CHI game was HUGE for Hassan....I'll never forget it.

CHI continuously challenged him, and he returned 12 shots in that game....keeping many in play.

Whatever his issues, immaturity, etc - the kid can play. He can still get better, being that he is only 25.

AND he can grow as a young man, and leave the mistakes he's made behind as well.

I've gotten so tired over the years of seeing 7 footers not care about defending the rim, and here comes Whiteside sending stuff back...and he rebounds well.

I love it.

As Roy alluded to - blocking shots does not mean a player is a great defender. But boy it's a step in the right direction, to me.

He can be taught.

I'd love for Brad to be the one to teach him more. Look what he's done with Zeller.

[SHAQATTACK]

Ha ha .....

That's like comparing my golf game to Arnold Palmer.

[sahara]

No.

[Beat LA]

But is that Bill Russell impact, if it isn't, it's pretty darn close.

Bill Russell is the best defensive player of all-time.  In his last 15 years of organized basketball, he won 2 college championships, 11 NBA titles, and a gold medal.  The Heat are 16-25 when Whiteside plays.  That's the opposite of a Bill Russell impact.

C'mon Roy. Of course no one compares to Rus.

I'm merely stating that Whiteside is a force on the defensive end, ala Russell on defense. His impact is close to Russell in a sense that he'll block a lot of shots and he'll control the boards and be imposing in the paint. Of course he's not going to have Bill Russell's impact overall, he's not the leader nor does he have the mentality to be Russell. But defensively, you gotta at least take the numbers for what it is, he's a great defensive player and he can make a tremendous impact on defense, just like #6... On defense.

Well, first, I'm not the one who said that Whiteside was having a impact "pretty darn close" to Russell's.

I think his defensive impact is overrated, though.  In his most frequent lineup with Miami, they're giving up 108 points per 100 possessions.  That's very poor.  In five of his top eight lineups, the Heat give up 106+ points per 100 possessions, with them giving up 123 points per 100 possessions in three of the top eight lineups (horrifically bad). 

His overall defensive rating is 106.2.  Coincidentally, that matches Miami's overall defensive rating, that ranks 20th in the NBA.

His Defensive Real Plus Minus has been falling like a brick lately, and is wedged between Timofey Mozgov and Zaza Pachulia.  His FG% allowed at the rim is 12th among the top-22 guys in FGAs at the rim per game.

By the numbers, Whiteside isn't a great defender.   Rather, he blocks a lot of shots, which isn't the same as great defense.  (For an example of a guy who is a great defender, look at Rudy Gobert's numbers.  He holds opponent's to 39.5% shooting at the rim.  Nobody else in the top-50 in terms of FGAs faced is sub-40%.)

You can cite all of these mumbo jumbo stats all you want, but the bottom line is that he's a great defender.  I mean, look who he's playing with most nights.  What's next - a formula for intimidation? This is the same argument that people use when comparing Giannis to Nolynyk - "well, he has a better defensive rating than the Greek Freak," and all I can do is roll my eyes, quite honestly.  GA is an athletic wing who can defend 2-4 of the toughest positions in basketball, who is also a better rebounder and shot blocker than a 7 footer who looks like he's running in molasses up a hill in January, but sure, let's let a computer and fancy analytics persuade us that a gifted athlete like Giannis is somehow the defensive equivalent of Nolynyk.

At some point, you have to realize that numbers never tell the whole story.  All of this is simply paralysis by over analysis.  Watch him play and then look at the normal stats, and tell us what you think.  Does he pass your eye test, because he certainly passed mine a long time ago.  I know that this is practically a yearbook quote, lol, but Whiteside is like a more athletic, quicker and faster version of Andrew Bynum without knee problems who actually cares, ahaha.

Btw, the last time I checked, blocking shots IS great defense, never mind his tremendous ability to rebound at both ends.  Seriously, man, how can you say that blocking shots isn't good defense?  That doesn't even make any sense.