Is Khris Middleton the Celtics most likely attainable free agent this o/season?

[chambers]

Why wouldn't the Bucks just match any Middleton offer?  I feel like if that kid was playing for a big market team like the Lakers or Knicks, we'd be hearing about how he's the second coming of Reggie Miller or something.  He's only 23 years old.  This year he averaged 13.4 points, 4.4 rebounds, 2.3 assists, 1.5 steals on 47%/41%/86% shooting.  That's elite shooting.  He's a big part of why his team made the playoffs.   Since the all-star break he's averaged 17 points, 4.4 rebounds, 3 assists, 1.4 steals on 46%/39%/88%.   

A big playoff performance probably ruins any hope of signing him, I'd think.

They just might match any offer. My point is that even a max contract with a guy like this is never going to be a franchise proverbial black cloud once the salary cap basically doubles.

Read the post I made at the top of page 5 of this thread about him post all star break with the Zach Lowe and NBA TV interviews. Really cool kid.
Very humble.

[Csfan1984]

Just because cap will rise shouldn't mean you spend to the max on a lesser value player. That is short sighted and a less hopeful approach. Players may want to pair up and a team with more cap space can make that happen. Have to think long term in resigning guys too. I'm for Middleton but not even at "off-rookie" max. So what if C's don't land a big fish this year, just means more cap to get two "new" max guys in 2016 off-season.

[byennie]

Just because cap will rise shouldn't mean you spend to the max on a lesser value player. That is short sighted and a less hopeful approach. Players may want to pair up and a team with more cap space can make that happen. Have to think long term in resigning guys too. I'm for Middleton but not even at "off-rookie" max. So what if C's don't land a big fish this year, just means more cap to get two "new" max guys in 2016 off-season.

That's exactly what you should do. When the cap rises to $108M in 2 years, the maximum salary for a guy coming off his rookie deal will be $27M / year, and will go all the way to $38M for a 10-year veteran.

If you pass on guys like Middleton for $15M now, they'll cost $20M+ later.

[Csfan1984]

Follow up to my previous post above on why not to max Middleton to try and get true max guys later by the #s.

Projected salary of C's with rookies, no resigns and a max Middleton would be about 62 million. That is 5 million under cap full roster with a lot of young guys. Cap jump in 2016 is 89 but add 4% yearly salary hike, multiple more rookies. (Keep in mind Turner, Z, and Sully all FAs unsigned or extended) The salary is 45 million on 11 guys 7 of which would be under 4 years experience.

Now max break down is, "under 6 years/ 7-9 years(prime)/10+"
2016=22.5 million/ 26.7 million/ 31.15 million
2017=27/ 32.4/37.8

So in 2016 off season with Middleton at max, IT, AB, Smart, KO, Young and a bunch of sophomores you can sign just one max guy. (Not even 2 max under 6 year guys)

Now without Middleton you are looking at 59 million under and capable of signing 2 prime Max players. With Middleton at 11 million (not the max) you can get a max prime player and a under 6 year max player.


So very different scenario financially if you Max Middleton verse you pay him what he is worth 11 million.

P.s. hope the #s settle the Max debate at the very least.

[Evantime34]

Why wouldn't the Bucks just match any Middleton offer?  I feel like if that kid was playing for a big market team like the Lakers or Knicks, we'd be hearing about how he's the second coming of Reggie Miller or something.  He's only 23 years old.  This year he averaged 13.4 points, 4.4 rebounds, 2.3 assists, 1.5 steals on 47%/41%/86% shooting.  That's elite shooting.  He's a big part of why his team made the playoffs.   Since the all-star break he's averaged 17 points, 4.4 rebounds, 3 assists, 1.4 steals on 46%/39%/88%.   

A big playoff performance probably ruins any hope of signing him, I'd think.

The optimistic thinking from our end is that the Bucks moved Knight because they didn't want to sign him to a max contract in the offseason so they don't want to commit the same money to Middleton.

Overpaying Middleton and Biyombo would lock this team into mediocrity.  Neither is a star -- let alone a superstar --and this team shouldn't be committing large chunks of salary cap space for role players.

I think paying for both those guys and then having them outplay their contracts is exactly how a team gets out of mediocrity. If we can add those two guys without giving up any assets and improve their value with good coaching/player development then we have added more assets we can use to acquire a top notch asset.

Even if we didn't have any cap space, I expect our future picks would be enough assets for us to trade our way out of mediocrity.

[Monkhouse]

Follow up to my previous post above on why not to max Middleton to try and get true max guys later by the #s.

Projected salary of C's with rookies, no resigns and a max Middleton would be about 62 million. That is 5 million under cap full roster with a lot of young guys. Cap jump in 2016 is 89 but add 4% yearly salary hike, multiple more rookies. (Keep in mind Turner, Z, and Sully all FAs unsigned or extended) The salary is 45 million on 11 guys 7 of which would be under 4 years experience.

Now max break down is, "under 6 years/ 7-9 years(prime)/10+"
2016=22.5 million/ 26.7 million/ 31.15 million
2017=27/ 32.4/37.8

So in 2016 off season with Middleton at max, IT, AB, Smart, KO, Young and a bunch of sophomores you can sign just one max guy. (Not even 2 max under 6 year guys)

Now without Middleton you are looking at 59 million under and capable of signing 2 prime Max players. With Middleton at 11 million (not the max) you can get a max prime player and a under 6 year max player.


So very different scenario financially if you Max Middleton verse you pay him what he is worth 11 million.

I agree and disagree with this thinking.

There are going to be a boatload of teams with a lot of cap space, and even then, a lot of teams can muster up picks/assets to free up cap space..

BOS isn't an ideal destination, but it beats out at least 10-12 teams like Bucks, Utah, etc. You got at least 8-10 teams that can compete with us in FA, and even then its slim pickings, as the NBA has become all 'buddy, buddy,' as players only want to play with other superstars...

I don't mind giving Middleton a 13-16 million year contract, because I already think Middleton is more than just a 'role,' player. If we picked up someone like Cousins, I would absolutely hope Ainge pulls the trigger on maxing out Middleton.

Hes the bonafide player that teams are looking for in FA. A great finishing, lanky, and shooting specialist that can defend. Opposing 2's are shooting a mere 11.6 PER, and 3s are 12.3.

[Csfan1984]

Follow up to my previous post above on why not to max Middleton to try and get true max guys later by the #s.

Projected salary of C's with rookies, no resigns and a max Middleton would be about 62 million. That is 5 million under cap full roster with a lot of young guys. Cap jump in 2016 is 89 but add 4% yearly salary hike, multiple more rookies. (Keep in mind Turner, Z, and Sully all FAs unsigned or extended) The salary is 45 million on 11 guys 7 of which would be under 4 years experience.

Now max break down is, "under 6 years/ 7-9 years(prime)/10+"
2016=22.5 million/ 26.7 million/ 31.15 million
2017=27/ 32.4/37.8

So in 2016 off season with Middleton at max, IT, AB, Smart, KO, Young and a bunch of sophomores you can sign just one max guy. (Not even 2 max under 6 year guys)

Now without Middleton you are looking at 59 million under and capable of signing 2 prime Max players. With Middleton at 11 million (not the max) you can get a max prime player and a under 6 year max player.


So very different scenario financially if you Max Middleton verse you pay him what he is worth 11 million.

I agree and disagree with this thinking.

There are going to be a boatload of teams with a lot of cap space, and even then, a lot of teams can muster up picks/assets to free up cap space..

BOS isn't an ideal destination, but it beats out at least 10-12 teams like Bucks, Utah, etc. You got at least 8-10 teams that can compete with us in FA, and even then its slim pickings, as the NBA has become all 'buddy, buddy,' as players only want to play with other superstars...

I don't mind giving Middleton a 13-16 million year contract, because I already think Middleton is more than just a 'role,' player. If we picked up someone like Cousins, I would absolutely hope Ainge pulls the trigger on maxing out Middleton.

Hes the bonafide player that teams are looking for in FA. A great finishing, lanky, and shooting specialist that can defend. Opposing 2's are shooting a mere 11.6 PER, and 3s are 12.3.

I want Middleton at a reasonable price. He is a good 3rd option. But he isn't a 1 or 2 to max. Now if you landed a Love or Cousins this off season then financially and team wise things change. Now if you have a good $ rate star  you could then max Middleton at the 15 million. Once cap goes up you can get the final big three piece. Yet this scenario still proves Middleton is a 2nd or third piece that you shouldn't max him without securing a star before hand.

[Monkhouse]

Follow up to my previous post above on why not to max Middleton to try and get true max guys later by the #s.

Projected salary of C's with rookies, no resigns and a max Middleton would be about 62 million. That is 5 million under cap full roster with a lot of young guys. Cap jump in 2016 is 89 but add 4% yearly salary hike, multiple more rookies. (Keep in mind Turner, Z, and Sully all FAs unsigned or extended) The salary is 45 million on 11 guys 7 of which would be under 4 years experience.

Now max break down is, "under 6 years/ 7-9 years(prime)/10+"
2016=22.5 million/ 26.7 million/ 31.15 million
2017=27/ 32.4/37.8

So in 2016 off season with Middleton at max, IT, AB, Smart, KO, Young and a bunch of sophomores you can sign just one max guy. (Not even 2 max under 6 year guys)

Now without Middleton you are looking at 59 million under and capable of signing 2 prime Max players. With Middleton at 11 million (not the max) you can get a max prime player and a under 6 year max player.


So very different scenario financially if you Max Middleton verse you pay him what he is worth 11 million.

I agree and disagree with this thinking.

There are going to be a boatload of teams with a lot of cap space, and even then, a lot of teams can muster up picks/assets to free up cap space..

BOS isn't an ideal destination, but it beats out at least 10-12 teams like Bucks, Utah, etc. You got at least 8-10 teams that can compete with us in FA, and even then its slim pickings, as the NBA has become all 'buddy, buddy,' as players only want to play with other superstars...

I don't mind giving Middleton a 13-16 million year contract, because I already think Middleton is more than just a 'role,' player. If we picked up someone like Cousins, I would absolutely hope Ainge pulls the trigger on maxing out Middleton.

Hes the bonafide player that teams are looking for in FA. A great finishing, lanky, and shooting specialist that can defend. Opposing 2's are shooting a mere 11.6 PER, and 3s are 12.3.

I want Middleton at a reasonable price. He is a good 3rd option. But he isn't a 1 or 2 to max. Now if you landed a Love or Cousins this off season then financially and team wise things change. Now if you have a good $ rate star  you could then max Middleton at the 15 million. Once cap goes up you can get the final big three piece. Yet this scenario still proves Middleton is a 2nd or third piece that you shouldn't max him without securing a star before hand.

Well I guess we'll wait and see what magic Ainge can conjure up

I think Middleton has been the most underrated player this year. I really love and like Draymond Green, because hes very versatile. But after watching how Middleton just rains threes, and seems to always make the right plays so effortlessly.

[Csfan1984]

Follow up to my previous post above on why not to max Middleton to try and get true max guys later by the #s.

Projected salary of C's with rookies, no resigns and a max Middleton would be about 62 million. That is 5 million under cap full roster with a lot of young guys. Cap jump in 2016 is 89 but add 4% yearly salary hike, multiple more rookies. (Keep in mind Turner, Z, and Sully all FAs unsigned or extended) The salary is 45 million on 11 guys 7 of which would be under 4 years experience.

Now max break down is, "under 6 years/ 7-9 years(prime)/10+"
2016=22.5 million/ 26.7 million/ 31.15 million
2017=27/ 32.4/37.8

So in 2016 off season with Middleton at max, IT, AB, Smart, KO, Young and a bunch of sophomores you can sign just one max guy. (Not even 2 max under 6 year guys)

Now without Middleton you are looking at 59 million under and capable of signing 2 prime Max players. With Middleton at 11 million (not the max) you can get a max prime player and a under 6 year max player.


So very different scenario financially if you Max Middleton verse you pay him what he is worth 11 million.

I agree and disagree with this thinking.

There are going to be a boatload of teams with a lot of cap space, and even then, a lot of teams can muster up picks/assets to free up cap space..

BOS isn't an ideal destination, but it beats out at least 10-12 teams like Bucks, Utah, etc. You got at least 8-10 teams that can compete with us in FA, and even then its slim pickings, as the NBA has become all 'buddy, buddy,' as players only want to play with other superstars...

I don't mind giving Middleton a 13-16 million year contract, because I already think Middleton is more than just a 'role,' player. If we picked up someone like Cousins, I would absolutely hope Ainge pulls the trigger on maxing out Middleton.

Hes the bonafide player that teams are looking for in FA. A great finishing, lanky, and shooting specialist that can defend. Opposing 2's are shooting a mere 11.6 PER, and 3s are 12.3.

I want Middleton at a reasonable price. He is a good 3rd option. But he isn't a 1 or 2 to max. Now if you landed a Love or Cousins this off season then financially and team wise things change. Now if you have a good $ rate star  you could then max Middleton at the 15 million. Once cap goes up you can get the final big three piece. Yet this scenario still proves Middleton is a 2nd or third piece that you shouldn't max him without securing a star before hand.

Well I guess we'll wait and see what magic Ainge can conjure up

I think Middleton has been the most underrated player this year. I really love and like Draymond Green, because hes very versatile. But after watching how Middleton just rains threes, and seems to always make the right plays so effortlessly.

I'm hopeful something gets done by DA. Maybe making playoffs will help Middleton buy into the team. Then DA can do a S&T where they take KO and full tpe. That at least puts Middleton over 12 million very close to rookie max and relieves some salary without giving up a pick. Opening almost the same 1 max prime player $ along with the  1 under 6 year max $ player flexibility team should try to keep.

[Endless Paradise]

Olynyk doesn't fit the profile of the team they're building in Milwaukee, so I don't see any way they'd be interested in him.

[Csfan1984]

Olynyk doesn't fit the profile of the team they're building in Milwaukee, so I don't see any way they'd be interested in him.

Even if they slot him as a stretch 4/5? KO is mobile, thought Bucks wanted to be a running team with space.

[Endless Paradise]

They're going for a long, rangy kind of team that's lockdown on defense. They need a better interior defender/presence more so than they need a guy to essentially replicate what they have Ilyasova for.

[Endless Paradise]

Also, pairing Olynyk with Parker just seems like a disaster waiting to happen defensively.

[Csfan1984]

Parker will improve. I think adding offense spacing for Parker, MCW and GF would be nice.

[Csfan1984]

KO thing aside, the point is the team has to try at securing Middleton for less than max. At max I say you have to pass because hurts your shot financially later.

Would you just worry about cap space later and max Middleton?