turner stays or goes?

[konkmv]

If someone gives us a first rounder... keep him or sell him?

[Monkhouse]

If someone gives us a first rounder... keep him or sell him?

No brainer.. Even a late first round pick is overpaying for ET. One good game doesn't offset his limited skill sets. We are lucky if ET is worth two seconds. Although the Wolves may dole out a few seconds for ET.

[colincb]

Gone. Still hasn't shown much consistency and still doesn't have a position.

[incoherent]

He probably stays because his contract is so small and fills a need at the SF. 

[JBcat]

If we can get a dominant center like Cousins I think it can work for now, otherwise we'll probably need an upgrade at some point.

[csfansince60s]

With ET, we get a lot of versatility for not a lot of money.

He is finally in a situation and system in which he can grow. That wasn't the case in Philly and Indiana. Despite so many saying he has no upside, I disagree.

[rollie mass]

give him a summer,give him some stability and goals ,give him some time with isiah,his passing sometimes leaves me dumbfounded-maybe brads skill is in not criticizing evan-telling him to keep shooting-he struggled after he hurt his wrist,he was never in a situation like boston,he is attempting to remake himself on defense and working on all aspects of his game-some of his passing and decisions seem unforgivable but maybe he was damaged by philly and last year-he gets rebounds and certainly fits playing multiple positions and he hits some clutch baskets-anybody who can score 30pts and carry this team deserves some credit-this season has not been easy-just stop those lazy cross court passes and too low bounce passes,they make you look bad like running out of gas in your ferrai

[csfansince60s]

give him a summer,give him some stability and goals ,give him some time with isiah,his passing sometimes leaves me dumbfounded-maybe brads skill is in not criticizing evan-telling him to keep shooting-he struggled after he hurt his wrist,he was never in a situation like boston,he is attempting to remake himself on defense and working on all aspects of his game-some of his passing and decisions seem unforgivable but maybe he was damaged by philly and last year-he gets rebounds and certainly fits playing multiple positions and he hits some clutch baskets-anybody who can score 30pts and carry this team deserves some credit-this season has not been easy-just stop those lazy cross court passes and too low bounce passes,they make you look bad like running out of gas in your ferrai

TP, rollie. I almost bumped your January thread on ET for rookie of the year.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=75823.msg1812527#msg1812527

I too believe, as I said in my post above, that Turner still has upside, because in some ways, this is like his first year.

Below is a quote from a Philly fan poster on the Celtic Board of RealGM. (I know, talk about an attenuated connection, right, but it gave me insight, if it is true, about ET's stunted development in Philly, particularly.):

voodooguru wrote:
I'm a Sixers phan who, as a young vinnie del, saw Wilt Chamberlain play for both the Philadelphia Warriors and the Philadelphia 76ers.

The one "thing" missin' from y'alls ET debate is Doug Collins. If you want me to do the research on Doug's overbearing, hyper-emotional, failed stints in Chicago, DETROIT, and Washington I will. I do believe that some guy named Michael Jordan once said that Doug Collins cried e'ry day.

My one-fan's-opinion might sound, in part, crazy, but this is it, summarized :

1. Doug Collins intentionally ruined ET's development. Doug is real close with Jrue Holiday's daddy and was determined to make Jrue The Man in Illadelphia. Jrue's daddy, Jrue and Doug are all 24-7-365 christians, which deepened Doug's devotion to making Jrue a star (the crazy part?). ET was a Number Two pick on-baller who could easily crash Doug's donkey cart.

2 Doug didn't want ET coming out of college, he wanted a big. That was fair enough, but the GM (Stiff-phan-ski?) took the BPA, ET.

3. ET recently said that anyone who tries to make him a catch and shoot player is no genius. That's exactly what Doug did. Exclusively. On 75ish% of offensive sets he had ET come down the court and plant himself behind the arc in the corner and raise his hand if he was open. It's true, he had Holiday and some Iguodala to initiate his "offence", but thanks to your coach, you guys already know how effective ET can be on the ball.

4. I'm not saying that ET would have made a better PG than Jrue, but dang - ET had just won the NCAA MVP playing on the ball, you'd think he'd get some time there. Jrue would have been better at SG than PG, but Doug wanted him to have the spotlight, exclusively

5. I don't remember exactly when it was but there was a stretch of 4 games, coinciding with a rare (only?) trip to Philly by ET's "agent", where ET spent most of the games at PG on offence. The team won three of four, scored over a century in 3 and 90+ in the othe. Everybody (ET, Holiday and Enigmadala) got theirs. In the fifth game Evan was back in the corner (for the duration) waving his hand. Predicatbly, the losing, losing, losing recommenced and Doug got fired [EDIT-resigned before he got fired] from his final coaching job.

Right from the beginning Doug would bench ET after every mistake and after virtually every little run of form. Compare John "Two Major Injuries" Wall's career minutes with Evan's, and while you're there compare their shooting percentage. Don't worry about "Brick" Wall's turnovers, Evan has yet to spend any significant time on the ball like Wall.

If anything good came out of the Reverend Doctor Doogie Wowser, NBA Coach/Couch's utterly cactus approach to ET, it's that Evan can probably hit the trey at at a break even percentage, he has a money stop and pop on the baseline, and he can play some decent SF. My ideal perimeter for Philly was ET - PG/SF, Jrue SG/PG and Enigmadala SF/PtF (o-f-o).

In a way, the Celtics are ET's first team. Your coach knows his game. As an old-arsed Philly phan I'd venture to say that in spite of his ill treatment in "'Illy", he's still got what could end up as Ye Olde Celtic Spirit.

We're megalithic, ocean-going supertankers in Philly, good luck with ET y'all. He could do 14-5-5, minimum.

OT - Turner's middle name is Marcel. My full nickname for him was He's NOT the Doctor, he's the EMT, and EMT for short, e'ryday use.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1348691&start=60#start_here

I think this perspective,if valid, explains a lot and gives much hope for ET's future. which I hope is here.

EDIT:  The Philly fan above uses nicknames such as Enigmadala and 'Illy. Entertaining read that probably has some element of truth to it.

[alley oop]

...

In a way, the Celtics are ET's first team. Your coach knows his game. As an old-arsed Philly phan I'd venture to say that in spite of his ill treatment in "'Illy", he's still got what could end up as Ye Olde Celtic Spirit.

We're megalithic, ocean-going supertankers in Philly, good luck with ET y'all. He could do 14-5-5, minimum.

OT - Turner's middle name is Marcel. My full nickname for him was He's NOT the Doctor, he's the EMT, and EMT for short, e'ryday use.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1348691&start=60#start_here

I think this perspective,if valid, explains a lot and gives much hope for ET's future. which I hope is here.

Why didn't it work out in Indiana?

[csfansince60s]

...

In a way, the Celtics are ET's first team. Your coach knows his game. As an old-arsed Philly phan I'd venture to say that in spite of his ill treatment in "'Illy", he's still got what could end up as Ye Olde Celtic Spirit.

We're megalithic, ocean-going supertankers in Philly, good luck with ET y'all. He could do 14-5-5, minimum.

OT - Turner's middle name is Marcel. My full nickname for him was He's NOT the Doctor, he's the EMT, and EMT for short, e'ryday use.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1348691&start=60#start_here

I think this perspective,if valid, explains a lot and gives much hope for ET's future. which I hope is here.

Why didn't it work out in Indiana?

Excellent, valid question.

ET went into a  situation in Indiana that was toxic and hostile for a couple of reasons.

First, he was NOT Danny Granger. Granger was the glue and veteran presence that held that locker room together, not David West (and I know I'm biased against West because I'm still bummed he didn't come here, where he could have made a championship difference for us). In addition, Paul George, Granger's heir apparent, idolized Granger. George was angry that Granger was no longer there, so the locker-room was not exactly a welcoming place for Turner, right off the bat. Add that to Turner being in direct competition with another George favorite, Sir Lance, for minutes with both being in a contract year, and the friction increases.


Second, since the locker-room lack of cohesion showed itself in Indiana's precipitous drop off in play at the end of last season, tempers were very short all-around come playoff time.

In a pre-playoff game practice, Sir Lance (the real gentleman that he isn't) allegedly called out Hibbert in front of everyone about his poor play, saying that Hibbert was bum-sore because "Catfish" George was banging Hibberts girlfriend. ET, the class act and gentleman that he IS, stood up to Stevenson, defending Hibbert, and the fists started flying and the blood literally and figuratively flowed.

The Pacers bled out in the playoffs.

That's why it didn't work out in Indy.

[2short]

He probably stays because his contract is so small and fills a need at the SF.

Agree completely.  Unless someone requests him in a trade you keep him.  Even if he just plays out contract and you let him walk.  He can give minutes at three positions, has the best mid range game on team and helps facilitate offense.

Anyone saying dump him must think his contract is a lot more $$$$

[slamtheking]

He probably stays because his contract is so small and fills a need at the SF.

Agree completely.  Unless someone requests him in a trade you keep him.  Even if he just plays out contract and you let him walk.  He can give minutes at three positions, has the best mid range game on team and helps facilitate offense.

Anyone saying dump him must think his contract is a lot more $$$$

this .

he's able to swing between the 1-3 spots although I don't consider him to be better than bench quality at any of those spots and that's low bench quality.  can't see anyone trading for him even though his contract isn't very much.

[P stoff]

Also the Indy stint was under Frank Vogel. You saw the "offense" he ran last night vs the Celtics. He has as much imagination as a bowl of oatmeal... and has no clue how to utilize strengths other than Paul George going one-on-one.

[KeepRondo]

You ever hear a horse talk who uses a voice box?

[jambr380]

The biggest problem with Evan is that he was drafted 2nd. I think we can say that he will never be the superstar everyone pegged him to be, but he can still be a very effective player. His versatility alone makes him an asset to any playoff caliber team.

Evan's game isn't based off of pure athleticism so there is no reason to believe he won't continue to improve as he matures as a player and a person. I am not a humongous Turner fan, but as a low cost option who can play all over the court and even be a go-to option at the end of the games, I would be happy to keep him around for the long-haul.

One of the reasons Evan came to Boston was to press the reset button on his career and play for a coach and a system that understood him - I think we are seeing his confidence finally come out a bit more consistently. Throw in the fact that he actually gets rebounds and assists (yes, I am looking at you Jeff Green - who I actually like), and you have a nice player.