Author Topic: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?  (Read 3196 times)

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Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« on: March 07, 2015, 02:10:06 PM »

Offline saltlover

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Welcome to DeMarcus Cousins day on Celticsblog.  I thought I'd contribute.

Firstly, I want to point out this trade only makes sense if George Karl would like the Kings to go in a different direction and move Cousins.  If the Kings view Cousins as the player they should build around for the next half-decade or so, he will not be traded, and I recognize that.

That said, I think the problem with getting Cousins is that the hoard of draft picks we can offer will just not be that appealing to Sacramento.  If they trade Cousins, they will want a high-level player in return, and so if we want Cousins, we need to find a team with such a player that would be willing to move him for draft picks.

Denver seems to be just such that team.  Ty Lawson is a talented point guard, but that entire locker room needs some major cleaning.  There were rumors he was on the block at the deadline, and it seems as if two first rounders might get it done.  There were even rumors that the Celtics had expressed interest.

Meanwhile, Ty Lawson seems just the sort of player Sacramento would want headlining a package for Cousins.  He thrived under Karl in Denver, so he's pretty low-risk.  He plays a position that they have a void in.  He's a good up-tempo PG.  They can show him to the fan base as an example that they're not starting from scratch again.  There have even been rumors that the Kings would like to acquire him.

Furthermore, the Nuggets are one of the few teams where Cousins would not be a great fit.  They have Nurkic and Faried already upfront, so there is no positional need.  They also have a team that just quit on its coach, which probably is a bad environment for Cousins to walk into.  Additionally, the Kings don't have that much more they can offer Denver for Lawson.  They're short on expirings, and while they have this year's pick, they owe a protected one for several years into the future.

Enter the Celtics.  They have picks they can offer Denver to compensate for Lawson, and additional assets to send to SAC to make up for the difference in value between Cousins and Lawson.  Accordingly, I propose the following draft night trade:

To Denver: Celtics own 2015 1st, Dallas 2016 1st, top 7 protected, Philadelphia 2016 2nd, Gerald Wallace.

To Sacramento: Ty Lawson, Kelly Olynyk (or Jared Sullinger or Tyler Zeller - whichever SAC wanted), Clippers 2015 1st, Philadelphia 2015 2nd.

To Boston: DeMarcus Cousins.

The Kings get one of Karl's favorite PGs, a big on a rookie deal, and two decent draft picks this year.  The Nuggets get two good first round picks, both of which could be in the top half of their drafts, as well as an early 2016 2nd.  The Celtics give up three firsts, two seconds, and a player on a rookie deal, but a) get to keep their most valuable picks (from Brookyln) and have a gazillion seconds, b) trade a player who was going to lose minutes to Cousins anyway, c) keep most of their current rotation players, and d) preserve their cap space to add a max free agent this summer (to a roster that now has Cousins, which makes Boston much more attractive as a destination.)

I think this deal gives Sacramento and Denver both fair prices on their players, while still allowing the Celtics to not give up anything they couldn't afford.

Happy DeMarcus Cousins Day!

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2015, 02:14:59 PM »

Online jpotter33

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I think Sac insists on one of the Brooklyn picks over the Clips pick, and I'd venture to guess they want us to take a bad contract with it, too.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2015, 02:20:37 PM »

Offline saltlover

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I think Sac insists on one of the Brooklyn picks over the Clips pick, and I'd venture to guess they want us to take a bad contract with it, too.

Not in a world where they're getting Lawson, I don't think they hold out for that.  Karl really likes Lawson.  The bad contract and Brooklyn picks make sense if they aren't getting a top player back.  But that's the entire point of this trade.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2015, 02:37:02 PM »

Offline mahcus smaht

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Best, most eloquent and logical Cousins proposal, I have seen. I think you are coming up a little short on the Cousins front.

I copied in your overview and will add in what I think would need to be done.

To Denver: Celtics own 2015 1st, Dallas 2016 1st, top 7 protected, Philadelphia 2016 2nd, Philadelphia 2015 2nd, Gerald Wallace, .

To Sacramento: Ty Lawson, Kelly Olynyk (or Jared Sullinger or Tyler Zeller - whichever SAC wanted), Clippers 2015 1st, Philadelphia 2015 2nd, Brooklyn 2016 1st.

To Boston: DeMarcus Cousins

Net: 4 1sts(2 lottery), 2 2nds, KO, Gerald Wallace for Demarcus Cousins.

That is just my opinion. TP for the great write up and proposal.

Edit: Looking at it again, I think we could get away without including the Brooklyn 2016. With Karl getting his guy in Lawson, and with it being stipulated that they are looking to move Cousins, I could certainly see them taking a deal that netted them a guard he really liked plus a lottery pick and a good young big man. That being said, I think it would still require another late1st (maybe our own 2018 or something like that)

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2015, 02:44:34 PM »

Offline mahcus smaht

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I think Sac insists on one of the Brooklyn picks over the Clips pick, and I'd venture to guess they want us to take a bad contract with it, too.

Not in a world where they're getting Lawson, I don't think they hold out for that.  Karl really likes Lawson.  The bad contract and Brooklyn picks make sense if they aren't getting a top player back.  But that's the entire point of this trade.
Their worst contract is probably Rudy Gay. Do we have the cap space to take him in? If we did I would actually still do it, but Id pull the Brooklyn pick off the table.

With Gay we could go:
Smart IT4
Bradley Young
Gay Crowder
Sully
Cousins Zeller

That is a pretty legit lineup: a lot of scoring with Gay, Cousins, IT4, Sully, and hopefully James Young, but also a lot of good D with Smart, Bradley, Crowder, and Cousins

That being said, I have know idea if that would work or if SacTown feels Gay's contract is so bad theyd rather get out from under it than pick up a better 1st

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2015, 02:52:42 PM »

Offline BDeCosta26

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I like where your going with that, but if we can get DMC and keep Smart were just gonna have to lose one of the Brooklyn picks. Even if you get them Lawson, they'd probably say either keep Sully/KO or keep the LAC and PHI picks and give a BK pick. At the very least the swap rights to the BK 2017 pick. Those picks are our most valuable asset at the moment. Just the price you gotta pay for one of the games top 15 players. May even have to take a bad contract as well.

Your right in that Sacto needs to stay competitive if they deal Cousins, but they need an asset that can they put on a pedestal for their fans and say "This is why we traded him!". Like the Wolves got with Wiggins. An extra lottery pick with the roster they would have after the trade would then be justifiable to fans. No one wants to look like OKC after the Harden trade and Sacto won't be good enough to withstand that like they did.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2015, 02:57:30 PM »

Offline saltlover

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I think Sac insists on one of the Brooklyn picks over the Clips pick, and I'd venture to guess they want us to take a bad contract with it, too.

Not in a world where they're getting Lawson, I don't think they hold out for that.  Karl really likes Lawson.  The bad contract and Brooklyn picks make sense if they aren't getting a top player back.  But that's the entire point of this trade.
Their worst contract is probably Rudy Gay. Do we have the cap space to take him in? If we did I would actually still do it, but Id pull the Brooklyn pick off the table.

With Gay we could go:
Smart IT4
Bradley Young
Gay Crowder
Sully
Cousins Zeller

That is a pretty legit lineup: a lot of scoring with Gay, Cousins, IT4, Sully, and hopefully James Young, but also a lot of good D with Smart, Bradley, Crowder, and Cousins

That being said, I have know idea if that would work or if SacTown feels Gay's contract is so bad theyd rather get out from under it than pick up a better 1st

Their worst contract is unquestionably Jason Thompson.  I'm fairly sure Sacramento would want draft picks for trading Gay away, and are not at all looking to dump him.  They just signed him to a reasonable extension.  Thompson, on the other hand, they would like to dump.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2015, 03:02:34 PM »

Offline gpap

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Interesting idea.

I also thought about this when I read the article I posted a week ago about how George Karl COULD look to deal Cousins and wants Ty Lawson in Sactown.

The question is, why would Denver deal Lawson to Sactown and not want Cousins back?
I mean they could just bring Jusuf whatever his name is off the bench.

But, let's suspend that notion for a second.

This could work but I think both Denver and Sac would need more in the deal like

Celts get Cousins, Darren Collison and eat up Thompson's bad deal
Denver gets Smart, Olynyk, Sully, Wallace, our 2015 1st rounder and 2016 Brooklyn 1st rounder
Sacramento gets Ty Lawson, Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller, and whatever other picks necessary to make it work.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2015, 03:19:09 PM »

Offline saltlover

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Interesting idea.

I also thought about this when I read the article I posted a week ago about how George Karl COULD look to deal Cousins and wants Ty Lawson in Sactown.

The question is, why would Denver deal Lawson to Sactown and not want Cousins back?
I mean they could just bring Jusuf whatever his name is off the bench.

But, let's suspend that notion for a second.

This could work but I think both Denver and Sac would need more in the deal like

Celts get Cousins, Darren Collison and eat up Thompson's bad deal
Denver gets Smart, Olynyk, Sully, Wallace, our 2015 1st rounder and 2016 Brooklyn 1st rounder
Sacramento gets Ty Lawson, Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller, and whatever other picks necessary to make it work.

Honestly, I'd pass a bazillion times over on that deal.  I want Cousins on the Celtics, not the Sacramento Kings in Boston.  Essentially you'd be paying $27 million a year for Cousins, since that's what you get including the deadweight the team takes on.  In order to do that, you want to trade four players on rookie deals and at least two first.  Denver should take that in a heartbeat (three players on rookie deals and two very good draft picks).  So should Sacramento.

Ugh, just ugh.  I'm not even sure Billy King would do that.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2015, 03:21:13 PM »

Online jpotter33

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Interesting idea.

I also thought about this when I read the article I posted a week ago about how George Karl COULD look to deal Cousins and wants Ty Lawson in Sactown.

The question is, why would Denver deal Lawson to Sactown and not want Cousins back?
I mean they could just bring Jusuf whatever his name is off the bench.

But, let's suspend that notion for a second.

This could work but I think both Denver and Sac would need more in the deal like

Celts get Cousins, Darren Collison and eat up Thompson's bad deal
Denver gets Smart, Olynyk, Sully, Wallace, our 2015 1st rounder and 2016 Brooklyn 1st rounder
Sacramento gets Ty Lawson, Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller, and whatever other picks necessary to make it work.
[/quote/]

You're probably right in that's probably what it would take to get him, but I think that's an overpay that's not quite worth it, imo.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2015, 03:23:41 PM »

Online jpotter33

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Interesting idea.

I also thought about this when I read the article I posted a week ago about how George Karl COULD look to deal Cousins and wants Ty Lawson in Sactown.

The question is, why would Denver deal Lawson to Sactown and not want Cousins back?
I mean they could just bring Jusuf whatever his name is off the bench.

But, let's suspend that notion for a second.

This could work but I think both Denver and Sac would need more in the deal like

Celts get Cousins, Darren Collison and eat up Thompson's bad deal
Denver gets Smart, Olynyk, Sully, Wallace, our 2015 1st rounder and 2016 Brooklyn 1st rounder
Sacramento gets Ty Lawson, Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller, and whatever other picks necessary to make it work.

You're probably right in that's probably what it would take to get him, but I think that's an overpay that's not quite worth it, imo.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2015, 03:34:22 PM »

Offline pearljammer10

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No way the Kings trade Cousins for that package. Sure Lawson's talented, and either KO or Sully is a nice potential, but they could most likely get more prosepcts elsewhere.

Lawson, KO, Sully, and three firsts might get us in conversation, but I think Sac would still just rather hold onto Cousins with that offer.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2015, 03:38:44 PM »

Online SHAQATTACK

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Cousins has to ask to be traded publicly or beat up the coach to get traded.

Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2015, 03:50:58 PM »

Offline gpap

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Interesting idea.

I also thought about this when I read the article I posted a week ago about how George Karl COULD look to deal Cousins and wants Ty Lawson in Sactown.

The question is, why would Denver deal Lawson to Sactown and not want Cousins back?
I mean they could just bring Jusuf whatever his name is off the bench.

But, let's suspend that notion for a second.

This could work but I think both Denver and Sac would need more in the deal like

Celts get Cousins, Darren Collison and eat up Thompson's bad deal
Denver gets Smart, Olynyk, Sully, Wallace, our 2015 1st rounder and 2016 Brooklyn 1st rounder
Sacramento gets Ty Lawson, Kenneth Faried, Tyler Zeller, and whatever other picks necessary to make it work.

Honestly, I'd pass a bazillion times over on that deal.  I want Cousins on the Celtics, not the Sacramento Kings in Boston.  Essentially you'd be paying $27 million a year for Cousins, since that's what you get including the deadweight the team takes on.  In order to do that, you want to trade four players on rookie deals and at least two first.  Denver should take that in a heartbeat (three players on rookie deals and two very good draft picks).  So should Sacramento.

Ugh, just ugh.  I'm not even sure Billy King would do that.

Well, that's what I think it would take to get Cousins.

In my opinion, there's no way Sacramento trades him for Ty Lawson, Kelly Olynyk and a couple of picks which may or may not have much value.


Re: Can Denver be the missing link to get Cousins?
« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2015, 08:52:24 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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Best, most eloquent and logical Cousins proposal, I have seen. I think you are coming up a little short on the Cousins front.

I copied in your overview and will add in what I think would need to be done.

To Denver: Celtics own 2015 1st, Dallas 2016 1st, top 7 protected, Philadelphia 2016 2nd, Philadelphia 2015 2nd, Gerald Wallace, .

To Sacramento: Ty Lawson, Kelly Olynyk (or Jared Sullinger or Tyler Zeller - whichever SAC wanted), Clippers 2015 1st, Philadelphia 2015 2nd, Brooklyn 2016 1st.

To Boston: DeMarcus Cousins

Net: 4 1sts(2 lottery), 2 2nds, KO, Gerald Wallace for Demarcus Cousins.

That is just my opinion. TP for the great write up and proposal.

Edit: Looking at it again, I think we could get away without including the Brooklyn 2016. With Karl getting his guy in Lawson, and with it being stipulated that they are looking to move Cousins, I could certainly see them taking a deal that netted them a guard he really liked plus a lottery pick and a good young big man. That being said, I think it would still require another late1st (maybe our own 2018 or something like that)
I think this deal with the Brooklyn first makes the most sense.

I don't see Cousins being a good fit in Denver, a team that i already having problems listening to their coaches.

I don't see any way we give up Smart so the package someone mentioned that includes him is unlikely.
DKC:  Rockets
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