Author Topic: noel and embid cannot play together  (Read 6089 times)

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noel and embid cannot play together
« on: January 30, 2015, 08:34:41 AM »

Offline konkmv

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trade bradley sullinger to the sixers for noel kirilienko and sims. wiiliams bradley saric sullinger and embid will be fine for them... for us... smart olynyc young and noel will be a start... and yes i do not like sully and bradley... low ceiling

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2015, 09:10:02 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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Why not

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2015, 09:14:30 AM »

Offline manl_lui

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I'm guessing that he meant that they couldn't play together because they are both centers? idk but it would be nice if we could get either ;), preferably Noel, local town hero

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2015, 09:20:57 AM »

Offline Sketch5

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I've been saying the Sixers were dumb to take Embiid last year, with Okafor and Towns coming out this year, and taking Noel the year before. Now there are rumors of them wanting Okafor, and that Embiid isn't working to get into shape.

I think either center is on the block at this point depending were in the draft they fall. This puts DA in a good spot. We need a center, and we could take Noel who has a year under his belt, and it may only cost us a draft pick. If we don't get into the top 5, I wouldn't be surprised if DA trades our pick for Noel. He would be a great defensive anchor. Bring in KG to mentor the kid/s.

I think Sully would be a good fit next to him. Noel needs some one that can shoot next to him, and Sully needs some one that can help defend.


Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2015, 09:32:38 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I've been saying the Sixers were dumb to take Embiid last year, with Okafor and Towns coming out this year, and taking Noel the year before. Now there are rumors of them wanting Okafor, and that Embiid isn't working to get into shape.

I think either center is on the block at this point depending were in the draft they fall. This puts DA in a good spot. We need a center, and we could take Noel who has a year under his belt, and it may only cost us a draft pick. If we don't get into the top 5, I wouldn't be surprised if DA trades our pick for Noel. He would be a great defensive anchor. Bring in KG to mentor the kid/s.

I think Sully would be a good fit next to him. Noel needs some one that can shoot next to him, and Sully needs some one that can help defend.
Embiid was the only player it made sense for Philly to take with the 3rd pick.  Now perhaps they could have worked a trade with a team (like swap picks with the Celtics and pick up another asset or two), but at 3 they had to take Embiid.  If they end up with Okafor or Towns, who cares, that puts them in the enviable position having too many centers, which is the hardest position in the league to fill.  Also there is no guarantee that all 3 end up being great players.  Noel has certainly looked better of late, but he is never going to be an elite offensive player, but still has very good trade value.  Embiid still hasn't played a game and has a back injury, who knows what happens with him.  Towns/Okafor, etc. are still in college.  When you are bad you take the best player available and worry about roster construction later. 
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

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Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2015, 09:33:05 AM »

Offline manl_lui

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I've been saying the Sixers were dumb to take Embiid last year, with Okafor and Towns coming out this year, and taking Noel the year before. Now there are rumors of them wanting Okafor, and that Embiid isn't working to get into shape.

I think either center is on the block at this point depending were in the draft they fall. This puts DA in a good spot. We need a center, and we could take Noel who has a year under his belt, and it may only cost us a draft pick. If we don't get into the top 5, I wouldn't be surprised if DA trades our pick for Noel. He would be a great defensive anchor. Bring in KG to mentor the kid/s.

I think Sully would be a good fit next to him. Noel needs some one that can shoot next to him, and Sully needs some one that can help defend.

I agree with this statement, I have one question though

how about putting a defensive center near Kelly...would you take Kelly + defensive center or a Sully + defensive center?

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2015, 10:10:57 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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how about putting a defensive center near Kelly...would you take Kelly + defensive center or a Sully + defensive center?

How about getting two athletes in the front maybe even three and abandon these guys?

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2015, 10:52:00 AM »

Offline TheTruthFot18

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how about putting a defensive center near Kelly...would you take Kelly + defensive center or a Sully + defensive center?

How about getting two athletes in the front maybe even three and abandon these guys?

I don't understand the KO and Sully bashing on this board. Sure they won't become Anthony Davis or Tim Duncan or KG but how many other pf's and centers out there will be?

My point is they are both starting caliber players. If you put any real center next to either of them they can flourish since neither are really fit to battle down low for 30+ minutes a game. Also by keeping them at the 4 we can invest more cap space(Leonard, Butler, Green) / draft choices( SJohnson, Winslow) into the 2 and 3 spots.

While I like the idea of getting WCS, Turner, or even Towns (opinion would change but less likely to draft) I think drafting Johnson would be ideal and then adding a center in FA.

Smart
AB/ Young
Johnson
Sully/ KO
FA? (Hibbert, Jordan, Gasol)

The Nets will finish with the worst record and the Celtics will end up with the 4th pick.

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Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2015, 10:59:51 AM »

Offline TheFlex

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how about putting a defensive center near Kelly...would you take Kelly + defensive center or a Sully + defensive center?

How about getting two athletes in the front maybe even three and abandon these guys?

I don't understand the KO and Sully bashing on this board. Sure they won't become Anthony Davis or Tim Duncan or KG but how many other pf's and centers out there will be?

My point is they are both starting caliber players. If you put any real center next to either of them they can flourish since neither are really fit to battle down low for 30+ minutes a game. Also by keeping them at the 4 we can invest more cap space(Leonard, Butler, Green) / draft choices( SJohnson, Winslow) into the 2 and 3 spots.

While I like the idea of getting WCS, Turner, or even Towns (opinion would change but less likely to draft) I think drafting Johnson would be ideal and then adding a center in FA.

Smart
AB/ Young
Johnson
Sully/ KO
FA? (Hibbert, Jordan, Gasol)

Celtics4ever apparently believe athleticism is the sole determinant of basketball impact. He ignores all indicators of Sullinger's competent D (his "statistical" argument for Sullinger being a bad defender is Sully's poor results on some draft day workouts) as well as all indicators of both Sully + Kelly's good-to-really-good offensive skills.


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Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2015, 11:17:43 AM »

Offline footey

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Seriously doubt Sixers have given up on Embiid.  He is the closest thing I have ever seen to a 7 footer with Akeem Olajowon moves.  He has incredible foot quickness.

I could see them moving Noel, and see how Noel would make great sense here. But would Sixers agree to trade him here?  Very doubtful.

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2015, 12:36:29 PM »

Offline bmac934

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Disagree with a lot of what is on here.  I believe Noel and embiid would have no problems playing together.  Sully absolutely 100% does not have a low ceiling and avery bradley is a very talented player.  Both of them for Noel is selling Boston short.

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2015, 12:56:02 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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I've been saying the Sixers were dumb to take Embiid last year, with Okafor and Towns coming out this year, and taking Noel the year before. Now there are rumors of them wanting Okafor, and that Embiid isn't working to get into shape.

I think either center is on the block at this point depending were in the draft they fall. This puts DA in a good spot. We need a center, and we could take Noel who has a year under his belt, and it may only cost us a draft pick. If we don't get into the top 5, I wouldn't be surprised if DA trades our pick for Noel. He would be a great defensive anchor. Bring in KG to mentor the kid/s.

I think Sully would be a good fit next to him. Noel needs some one that can shoot next to him, and Sully needs some one that can help defend.
Scouts were saying Embiid was "by far" the best player in a loaded draft.  They think the kid has Hakeem potential.  He was never falling past 3rd.  Some felt the cavs should have taken him 1st in spite of his injury.  I imagine Philly explored moving embiid to the cavs for wiggins and offering some compensation, but the Lebron situation probably changed stuff.

If embiid turns into the type of dominant 2-way big man everyone expects he will be once healthy, that's a franchise player you build championships around.  I imagine they'd move noel (who has a very bright future as well).  It will get very interesting if they also land okafor.

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2015, 01:19:35 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I don't understand the KO and Sully bashing on this board. Sure they won't become Anthony Davis or Tim Duncan or KG but how many other pf's and centers out there will be?

My point is they are both starting caliber players. If you put any real center next to either of them they can flourish since neither are really fit to battle down low for 30+ minutes a game. Also by keeping them at the 4 we can invest more cap space(Leonard, Butler, Green) / draft choices( SJohnson, Winslow) into the 2 and 3 spots.

I disagree completely with your point.   Sully is flawed on D.   You think KO is a starter?   Sully is a starter on a bad team, one that other teams routinely exploit.  Sure he puts up numbers, but he is still taking ill advised threes and arguably gives up more points than he makes and is routinely the focus of the other team's attack.  I would argue that both are bench players ideally.  We really only need one of them going forward when our talent upgrades.     

I find the the concept that either one one them is good enough that they require a particular type of center behind as evidence that both are deeply flawed as players.  The NBA where we hope to couple two players into a complete player?  That is what your proposing.  Why not get a non flawed player, who is athlete and can play?   I would not get too attached to these guys they are both completely  upgradeable. 

When did this become the compensate for a player league?   I could see it if they were better players but they are not.  Bird was not fast but he could anticipate and impact the game in s about fell out of my chair laughing when you said Olynyk is a starting caliber player.   Sully is a deeply flawed player and I have not even mentioned weight or conditioning issues which are a problem for him.   The are starters, maybe with the passive tanking that has been  going on as your going to lose plenty with those two in there.   I would not even remotely consider them starters on a championship level team.

Quote
Celtics4ever apparently believe athleticism is the sole determinant of basketball impact. He ignores all indicators of Sullinger's competent D (his "statistical" argument for Sullinger being a bad defender is Sully's poor results on some draft day workouts) as well as all indicators of both Sully + Kelly's good-to-really-good offensive skills.

You completely ignore the eyetest  TheFlex.    Most of the times, other teams let him shoot because Sully is such a poor shooter.   Here are some stats and you have ignored them every time I posted them so I do not know why I bother.   

Sully is only shooting .45% from the field and .30% from the three point line.   Since when did those shooting numbers constitute good shooting for a big?   I am not even going to waste the time on the Olynyk stats because is that big of a joke.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sullija01.html

Other teams, seem to score more in the clutch when he is on the court and his clutch shooting percentages seem to shot not real good offensive skills that you are presenting.  They are mediocre.  I suppose if that that is what you like.

Opposing Cs are average 18 PPG against him and PF are averaging 21 PPG.  He scores 14 PPG.   Please take note of Opponent Counterpart 48-Minute Production:

http://www.82games.com/1415/14BOS15.HTM#pstats


Minus -7 points.  39% FG and a 7 and 8 Win Loss record in the clutch.  Clutch has often been the decider of a player's mettle.   Are those really that good?  Maybe for your standards which are apparently much lower than mine.

http://www.82games.com/1213/12BOS15.HTM#clutch

We're a bad team and he is one of the best players we have on a bad team.  That does mean he is good NBA player like you present.  How is he doing with the All Star voting and the team? Springfield MASS here Sully comes.

I think your in the minority here and more and more people are seeing it.  Does he pay you post this drivel?  Are you one of those folks that post positive reviews to counter truthful ones? NOTE what you posted was opinion and the above is actual stats. 

ON TOPIC, I think having talent is a problem I wish we had.  I think they could play together and if not they will be easier to move for an asset than our flawed talent.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 01:45:41 PM by Celtics4ever »

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2015, 01:22:02 PM »

Offline sofutomygaha

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Disagree with a lot of what is on here.  I believe Noel and embiid would have no problems playing together.  Sully absolutely 100% does not have a low ceiling and avery bradley is a very talented player.  Both of them for Noel is selling Boston short.

I couldn't agree more. Those two guys are long, quick, and athletic. I don't see any reason why they won't compliment each other beautifully.

Re: noel and embid cannot play together
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2015, 01:35:23 PM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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Disagree with a lot of what is on here.  I believe Noel and embiid would have no problems playing together.  Sully absolutely 100% does not have a low ceiling and avery bradley is a very talented player.  Both of them for Noel is selling Boston short.

I couldn't agree more. Those two guys are long, quick, and athletic. I don't see any reason why they won't compliment each other beautifully.

How's spacing?
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