Author Topic: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?  (Read 11960 times)

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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #30 on: January 29, 2015, 10:20:49 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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People try to compare assist rates etc on an OKC team that is markedly different from our own. Durant /Westbrook dont need people to set them up,  so you would expect Jackson to have less assists. While not a great shooter, he would give this team what it NEEDS, which is a guy who can get to the rim, draw fouls, and break defenders down. There's a reason we dont shoot freethrows much folks.
Reggie doesn't really get a ton of free throws either though. He does have a good driving game though.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #31 on: January 29, 2015, 10:34:21 AM »

Offline P stoff

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You are right...but again, Jackson is not going to get as many chances to impact the game when Westbrook/Durant are their meal tickets. Rightfully so.

With us, Jackson would be encouraged more to initiate IMO... without having to differ to two all stars. Every team (except us) has at least one guy who can consistently drive the ball into the paint... I think Jackson is the best (and most attainable) guy for this job.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #32 on: January 29, 2015, 10:48:20 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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Just curious for the Reggie Jackson fans out there -- what does he bring that Evan Turner hasn't brought this year?  He scores more, but he seems to shoot more (which also seems to be why OKC is willing to move on).  A bit better at free throws, although Turner gets to the line at a higher rate, but worse at 3-pointers, and passing is a bit of a wash (fewer assists but fewer turnovers).  They get to the rim at about the same rate and shoot roughly the same percentage when they get there (which happens to be a little worse than the much-maligned Bradley).  But say we got Jackson to run the point -- how much better would this team be, if at all?  It's fine for people here to want to exile Bradley, but Jackson wouldn't be stepping into Bradley's role, he'd be stepping into Turner's.

My point isn't to say that Turner is amazing.  But he's been serviceable, and is under contract next year at a bargain rate for his production -- how does Jackson get us that giant step forward we need, if he's largely going to take Turner's role on the team?

Are we really comparing Jackson to Turner?

Jackson is a true point guard, something Evan Turner is not in any way shape or form. Jackson is ready to take his own to under control and get his minutes and his payday. He could be a starting PG in this league for the next ten years. Turner is already a journeyman on a cheap contract.

I'm not a huge Jackson supporter and wouldn't sell the farm to get him but for the right deal and or money, I would be happy with him taking over the reigns as our teams starting PG in this rebuild.

For a true point guard, his assist rate is pretty sad, and less than Turner's.  I don't for a second think that Turner is a "true point guard", but he's functioning as one reasonably well in Stevens' offense.  I mean, he was brought in to back up Jeff Green -- that he resembles a point guard at all is pretty impressive after half a season.  On the other hand, OKC seems fed up enough with Jackson's shot selection that they'd prefer Dion Waiters, who does not have the greatest reputation for shot selection.  Durant does not have LeBron's reputation for getting down on his teammates, but he seems pretty done with Jackson at this point.

Jackson has developed a reputation as a shoot-first, pass-second type of player, which doesn't seem to be what Stevens is looking for.  I see Turner as a placeholder for someone better -- I'm just not convinced Jackson is appreciably better at that role to be viably considered as a major upgrade.

I can definitely agree with both of these statements. However, from my eyes, in regards to Turner playing PG anyone in the league would be an upgrade besides Avery Bradley.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #33 on: January 29, 2015, 11:29:51 AM »

Offline colincb

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Not a starting PG in my book (nor is ET).  Very bad defender, not a good outside shooter, mediocre assist man (and plays with KD or RW only a third of the time), and he thinks he's better than he is.

We need an upgrade or Smart has to grow into the PG role though he seems more a combo Dennis Johnson/Chauncey Billups type than a pure PG.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #34 on: January 29, 2015, 12:27:26 PM »

Offline marlon.oddo

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Fafnir:

Yes, Reggie makes shots.  I haven't looked up what his shooting percentage was in Nov.  He had several 20+ point games in November when he was the primary scorer on the floor, so other teams definitely had to guard him.  He also had a 14 assist game and a game with 8 assists, so he can be a playmaker.

Moiso:

Reggie is a talented player.  He wants to start and feels he should.  When he got his opportunity, he took advantage of it.  When Westbrook came back and they acquired Waiters, he moped and let it affect his game.  This is a classic situation for a talented young player who might be acquired on the cheap because he is sulking a little bit and because his current team probably won't have the cap space to sign him long term.

The only other issue for the Celtics is it worth paying RJ about $8 million next year if you have Smart at about $2 million?  Is RJ 4 times the player?  I don't think Smart will ever score as much as Reggie and they are probably equal as passers.  If we acquire RJ, we should still keep Smart as the 3rd guard and if RJ doesn't perform, we can always trade him again.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2015, 01:58:04 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

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I like Jackson's game.  I think ultimately whoever we put in the backcourt with Smart has to be a primary scorer and playmaker. 

What do we think of Jackson's defense?  Average?

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2015, 02:48:42 PM »

Offline jambr380

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The only other issue for the Celtics is it worth paying RJ about $8 million next year if you have Smart at about $2 million?  Is RJ 4 times the player?  I don't think Smart will ever score as much as Reggie and they are probably equal as passers.  If we acquire RJ, we should still keep Smart as the 3rd guard and if RJ doesn't perform, we can always trade him again.

I don't think OKC would even think about trading Jackson if they thought they could keep him for $8 Million. Unfortunately, whatever team decides to give him a big (maybe close to max) contract is probably going to regret going as high as they did.

But, yes, I would gladly take Jackson if he could be had for $10 Mill a year - no problem. He would fit nicely with Smart.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #37 on: January 29, 2015, 03:09:46 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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Fafnir:

Yes, Reggie makes shots.  I haven't looked up what his shooting percentage was in Nov.  He had several 20+ point games in November when he was the primary scorer on the floor, so other teams definitely had to guard him.  He also had a 14 assist game and a game with 8 assists, so he can be a playmaker.
I don't think a good way to evaluate whether someone is an effective shooter is to avoid looking up his percentages but bring up "a few 20 point games". But to each their own, He had a TS% of .506 in November and .500 in December for what its worth.

Similarly I think he's shown to be a playmaker in the Brandon Jennings sense, he'll make some pretty passes but doesn't really setup his teammates or run an offense.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #38 on: January 29, 2015, 03:14:19 PM »

Offline TheFlex

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Fafnir:

Yes, Reggie makes shots.  I haven't looked up what his shooting percentage was in Nov.  He had several 20+ point games in November when he was the primary scorer on the floor, so other teams definitely had to guard him.  He also had a 14 assist game and a game with 8 assists, so he can be a playmaker.
I don't think a good way to evaluate whether someone is an effective shooter is to avoid looking up his percentages but bring up "a few 20 point games". But to each their own, He had a TS% of .506 in November and .500 in December for what its worth.

Similarly I think he's shown to be a playmaker in the Brandon Jennings sense, he'll make some pretty passes but doesn't really setup his teammates or run an offense.

FWIW, the Thunder are better offensively when Reggie is on the floor (simple 82games splits). It's defense where he seems to be a net negative.*

edit: *Of the five-man lineups most utilized when Jackson is on the floor, Roberson is replaced by Jeremy Lamb, so even that defensive dropoff should be taken with a grain of salt.


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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #39 on: January 29, 2015, 03:35:17 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Bradley, Prince / Bass and pick(s)  for Perkins and Jackson.  This is what we should do now to solve the lack of attacking players. Then add bigs later.  OKC could use bradley for defense and Prince and Bass for depth.

Not sure if it works but sub in any combo of players and picks. Dont think we are doing much better than Jackson to pair with Smart.

I like this trade; We add perk (a center - albeit a slow moving behemoth) and Reggie Jackson (who can be paired with Smaht); And we get rid of Kobe Bradley;

Would love to see this trade. Let Jackson become our go to PG of the future and let Smart play alongside him at the two.
We can just sign him as a free agent and lose nothing. I would rather go for Thomas since he is under contract.

Jackson is a restricted free agent, so it's not guaranteed that you would be able to sign him.
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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #40 on: January 29, 2015, 03:38:15 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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Bradley, Prince / Bass and pick(s)  for Perkins and Jackson.  This is what we should do now to solve the lack of attacking players. Then add bigs later.  OKC could use bradley for defense and Prince and Bass for depth.

Not sure if it works but sub in any combo of players and picks. Dont think we are doing much better than Jackson to pair with Smart.

I like this trade; We add perk (a center - albeit a slow moving behemoth) and Reggie Jackson (who can be paired with Smaht); And we get rid of Kobe Bradley;

Would love to see this trade. Let Jackson become our go to PG of the future and let Smart play alongside him at the two.
We can just sign him as a free agent and lose nothing. I would rather go for Thomas since he is under contract.

Losing Bradley would be the equivalent to losing nothing.

I don't think I would trade Bradley for Jackson, especially if it looks like you will have to overpay Jackson to keep him.
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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #41 on: January 29, 2015, 03:47:38 PM »

Offline LooseCannon

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I like Jackson's game.  I think ultimately whoever we put in the backcourt with Smart has to be a primary scorer and playmaker. 

What do we think of Jackson's defense?  Average?

He tends to be described as a defensive liability.
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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #42 on: January 29, 2015, 03:49:21 PM »

Offline JBcat

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I think someone like Dragic who will be a free agent could be a better fit for our team, and maybe little more of a team player.

Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #43 on: January 29, 2015, 05:09:02 PM »

Offline action781

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Fafnir:

Yes, Reggie makes shots.  I haven't looked up what his shooting percentage was in Nov.  He had several 20+ point games in November when he was the primary scorer on the floor, so other teams definitely had to guard him.  He also had a 14 assist game and a game with 8 assists, so he can be a playmaker.
I don't think a good way to evaluate whether someone is an effective shooter is to avoid looking up his percentages but bring up "a few 20 point games". But to each their own, He had a TS% of .506 in November and .500 in December for what its worth.

Similarly I think he's shown to be a playmaker in the Brandon Jennings sense, he'll make some pretty passes but doesn't really setup his teammates or run an offense.

Yeah, Nate Robinson has also frequented the 20+ point club and 10+ assist club in spans as short as Reggie has.  I doubt we'll hear anybody pining for him to be our starting PG though.
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Re: Rumor Reggie jackson almost traded to denver?
« Reply #44 on: January 29, 2015, 05:12:27 PM »

Offline action781

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I'm a RJ supporter and have advocated for trading for him.  He is not a true PG but he is a PG in today's NBA-in the Westbrook/Kyrie mold.  He is a scorer first.  When starting this year, he averaged 17/5 in Nov.  He makes shots.
I feel like Jackson is more of a Darren Collison type rather than a James Harden.
This is the exact comparison that comes to my mind as well.  I thought Collison was a sure-fire starting PG in the league during that stint in NO when CP3 was hurt.

On the other hand, he could turn out to be the next Jeff Teague.
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