#DeflateGate (Court of Appeals Reinstates Suspension)

[Eja117]

But what if ...gasp...he's innocent? And just doesn't want to hand them his phone?  They can't prove anything even happened....so naturally he's supposed to hand the incredibly honest and leakless NFL his phone.  Absurd.

Oh he won't let them invade his privacy. 4 games. 

Does he get their phones and emails? Do we get to look into whether this whole thing was a setup?  We don't, do we? 

Who investigates the NFL?

[Rondo2287]

Replaced isn't more accurate. He doesn't have the old phone to give them, because it (and the sim card) were (apparently) deliberately destroyed. If Brady had the phone destroyed and had confirmed with the carrier that they couldn't retrieve the texts, how was he going to assist the NFL in gathering those texts? A seance?

You realize that when you send a text, it goes to another device right?

It just so happens that Brady provided the league with a complete list of the people he texted (in addition to the phone company printouts). However, the NFL deemed it "impractical" to follow up with those people. Yes, the same league that apparently thought it very practical to spend a ton of time an money on an external investigation of an equipment violation.

Cue in the applause.

  Sure, it goes to another device. Do you realize that the other person may have deleted the text? And obviously it's impractical to follow up on each of the thousands of texts to see if there was any relevant information, and probably well beyond the reach of the investigation. That's the point of doing what he did. He wasn't trying to cooperate with the investigation, he was trying to thwart it and still claim that he was cooperating.

Actually its not really that impractical.  The NFL already has all communications between brady and patriots employees.  Im sure the majority of those texts are brady's family and friends. 

Assuming the NFL doesn't want to look through brady's texts to Giselle, how many of the 10,000 texts does the NFL not already have that might be relevant?  really it would just be other players I would imagine

[PhoSita]

Michael McCann ?@McCannSportsLaw 7h7 hours ago

Key legal pt by Tom Brady in his FB post: NFL had no right to his personal phone, so its destruction doesn't matter.

A lot of people here doing exactly what the NFL wants them to: focus so much on the optics of the "destroyed phone" thing that you forget that it has no actual relevance to determining whether or not the NFL's punishment was appropriate.

[mef730]

From Brady's statement this morning:

I also disagree with yesterdays narrative surrounding my cellphone. I replaced my broken Samsung phone with a new iPhone 6 AFTER my attorneys made it clear to the NFL that my actual phone device would not be subjected to investigation under ANY circumstances. As a member of a union, I was under no obligation to set a new precedent going forward, nor was I made aware at any time during Mr. Wells investigation, that failing to subject my cell phone to investigation would result in ANY discipline.

Clearly this whole thing is just an elaborate scheme devised by Brady and his secret corporate sponsor, Apple, to promote the iPhone 6.

I personally think switching from Android to Apple is an unforgivable offense that merits even more than a 4 game ban. 

one of my friends posted the same thing on facebook today. Is the iphone really inferior to the android style? I have a flip phone so i don't know the difference besides some restrictions with apple

Yeah, my wife had a flip phone but sold it after getting it valued on Antique Roadshow.

Mike ducks.

Mike

[BudweiserCeltic]

Brady's agent on this:
http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/tom-bradys-agent-says-nfl-mischaracterized-cell-phone-issue

Good read, this has become an entertaining he said / she said situation about an issue that is of little to no relevance with what actually matters.

I really think that by the end of this the NFL and Goodell will en up looking very very bad. I think Brady, and more importantly, the Player's Union will be going full court press on this and they'll come out ahead.

[colincb]

Unfortunate for me then that your feelings doesn't extend to an impulse to elaborate.
¯\_(^,^)_/¯

Probably starts with your characterization of Munson as great and your statement that Munson's way smarter than you. Gives one the sense that arguing with you will not be very fruitful.

In light of the NFL's poor record in court, I'd be extremely wary of Munson's characterization that this is in essence a slam dunk for the NFL. Having dealt with many attorneys on contractual, criminal, and regulatory issues, I cannot recall one who ever offered an opinion that anything in court was a sure thing.

Kessler's has a proven track record vs the NFL, he's been very aggressive in his statements, and I don't get the sense that there's ever really been an offer to settle on Brady's part other than to accept a slap-on-the-wrist fine to avoid the greater expense of going to court. That is not the stance of someone who thinks his client has a very long shot of winning.

On the face of it, the ability of Goodell to sit as arbitrator, even if the CBA allows it, is subject to being thrown out. The quality of the evidence in the Wells Report is very suspect too without which the case against Brady is not only circumstantial, but one in which the NFL or its agents has overstated from the start with its firs, egregious leak to ESPN. The entire process is subject to review and given some of the actions of the NFL, one could question whether the process was fair. Then there is the penalty phase...

[footey]

Unfortunate for me then that your feelings doesn't extend to an impulse to elaborate.
¯\_(^,^)_/¯

Fair enough.  Several legal experts (including Roger Smith (?) on Mike and Mike this morning) expressed the view, with much thought, that Brady has a decent chance of winning in court. In addition, other players who lost in arbitration were successful in having the rulings overturned in court.  Lester Munson for months has been stating the view that Tom Brady has no chance on appeal, long before the phone stuff was ever raised.  He may be right, but I feel his opinion is very slanted towards the NFL. He has expressed the view previously that the Wells Report was highly credible, which to me got me off on the wrong foot with him. He may be right, that Brady indeed has no case on appeal.  It also is contrary to what has happened with similar cases in the courts recently.  (of course he covers himself by saying they will end up getting overturned in an appeals court). 

That's all I got.

[Eja117]

Replaced isn't more accurate. He doesn't have the old phone to give them, because it (and the sim card) were (apparently) deliberately destroyed. If Brady had the phone destroyed and had confirmed with the carrier that they couldn't retrieve the texts, how was he going to assist the NFL in gathering those texts? A seance?

You realize that when you send a text, it goes to another device right?

It just so happens that Brady provided the league with a complete list of the people he texted (in addition to the phone company printouts). However, the NFL deemed it "impractical" to follow up with those people. Yes, the same league that apparently thought it very practical to spend a ton of time an money on an external investigation of an equipment violation.

Cue in the applause.

  Sure, it goes to another device. Do you realize that the other person may have deleted the text? And obviously it's impractical to follow up on each of the thousands of texts to see if there was any relevant information, and probably well beyond the reach of the investigation. That's the point of doing what he did. He wasn't trying to cooperate with the investigation, he was trying to thwart it and still claim that he was cooperating.

Actually its not really that impractical.  The NFL already has all communications between brady and patriots employees.  Im sure the majority of those texts are brady's family and friends. 

Assuming the NFL doesn't want to look through brady's texts to Giselle, how many of the 10,000 texts does the NFL not already have that might be relevant?  really it would just be other players I would imagine

Wait. We're assuming the NFL has no interest in texts between the best player ever and the best supermodel ever?  Really? Because it's a very professional league on the up and up?

[Eja117]

How many thousands of texts have all of you gotten? What? You deleted some? You don't actually have every phone you ever touched? Then you're guilty of whatever they try to find.

[kozlodoev]

Sure, it goes to another device. Do you realize that the other person may have deleted the text? And obviously it's impractical to follow up on each of the thousands of texts to see if there was any relevant information, and probably well beyond the reach of the investigation.

Yeah, and all of this is true for Brady's phone as well.

Also, there's no telling how many actual recipients there were of the "thousands of texts".

By the way, Kraft said that they NFL received access to the phone of every non-NFLPA employee that it requested, including Belichick (so much about the crackpot theory of him being "protected" here).

[D.o.s.]

Unfortunate for me then that your feelings doesn't extend to an impulse to elaborate.
¯\_(^,^)_/¯

Fair enough.  Several legal experts (including Roger Smith (?) on Mike and Mike this morning) expressed the view, with much thought, that Brady has a decent chance of winning in court. In addition, other players who lost in arbitration were successful in having the rulings overturned in court.  Lester Munson for months has been stating the view that Tom Brady has no chance on appeal, long before the phone stuff was ever raised.  He may be right, but I feel his opinion is very slanted towards the NFL. He has expressed the view previously that the Wells Report was highly credible, which to me got me off on the wrong foot with him. He may be right, that Brady indeed has no case on appeal.  It also is contrary to what has happened with similar cases in the courts recently.  (of course he covers himself by saying they will end up getting overturned in an appeals court). 

That's all I got.

TP for the explanation -- Those are legitimate and justified criticisms. Like I said earlier, I find his analysis solid in spite of the fact that he works for ESPN (aka is biased towards the league, if only for the sake of continued employment) and there's a reason I only quoted the bits that I agreed with/felt were worth discussing initially (I have no desire to giggle like a schoolgirl over anything Goodell wrote, for example). Also like I said earlier, I don't think it's as much of an open and shut case as he thinks it is, but even though I disagree with the conclusion I can follow the process.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I'm just going to wait for the NFLPA to request Goodell's cell phone as a measure to make sure that no improprieties where made during this investigation.

[Beat LA]

From Brady's statement this morning:

I also disagree with yesterdays narrative surrounding my cellphone. I replaced my broken Samsung phone with a new iPhone 6 AFTER my attorneys made it clear to the NFL that my actual phone device would not be subjected to investigation under ANY circumstances. As a member of a union, I was under no obligation to set a new precedent going forward, nor was I made aware at any time during Mr. Wells investigation, that failing to subject my cell phone to investigation would result in ANY discipline.

Clearly this whole thing is just an elaborate scheme devised by Brady and his secret corporate sponsor, Apple, to promote the iPhone 6.

I personally think switching from Android to Apple is an unforgivable offense that merits even more than a 4 game ban. 

one of my friends posted the same thing on facebook today. Is the iphone really inferior to the android style? I have a flip phone so i don't know the difference besides some restrictions with apple

Yeah, my wife had a flip phone but sold it after getting it valued on Antique Roadshow.

Mike ducks.

Mike

TP for the laugh .

[Rondo2287]

Sure, it goes to another device. Do you realize that the other person may have deleted the text? And obviously it's impractical to follow up on each of the thousands of texts to see if there was any relevant information, and probably well beyond the reach of the investigation.

Yeah, and all of this is true for Brady's phone as well.

Also, there's no telling how many actual recipients there were of the "thousands of texts".

By the way, Kraft said that they NFL received access to the phone of every non-NFLPA employee that it requested, including Belichick (so much about the crackpot theory of him being "protected" here).

I believe Don Yee said texts were sent to 28 people

[Beat LA]

Replaced isn't more accurate. He doesn't have the old phone to give them, because it (and the sim card) were (apparently) deliberately destroyed. If Brady had the phone destroyed and had confirmed with the carrier that they couldn't retrieve the texts, how was he going to assist the NFL in gathering those texts? A seance?

You realize that when you send a text, it goes to another device right?

It just so happens that Brady provided the league with a complete list of the people he texted (in addition to the phone company printouts). However, the NFL deemed it "impractical" to follow up with those people. Yes, the same league that apparently thought it very practical to spend a ton of time an money on an external investigation of an equipment violation.

Cue in the applause.

  Sure, it goes to another device. Do you realize that the other person may have deleted the text? And obviously it's impractical to follow up on each of the thousands of texts to see if there was any relevant information, and probably well beyond the reach of the investigation. That's the point of doing what he did. He wasn't trying to cooperate with the investigation, he was trying to thwart it and still claim that he was cooperating.

Actually its not really that impractical.  The NFL already has all communications between brady and patriots employees.  Im sure the majority of those texts are brady's family and friends. 

Assuming the NFL doesn't want to look through brady's texts to Giselle, how many of the 10,000 texts does the NFL not already have that might be relevant?  really it would just be other players I would imagine

Wait. We're assuming the NFL has no interest in texts between the best player ever and the best supermodel ever?  Really? Because it's a very professional league on the up and up?

Hold on, are you saying that Tom Brady is the best player in nfl or patriots' history (I'm assuming it's the former, btw)?  I'm not going to touch the supermodel point with a ten foot pole (even though it's probably unwise on my part to put 'supermodel' and 'pole' in the same sentence, lol ), but, yeah, why would a model of ethics such as the nfl (sarcasm) have any interest in the sexts, I mean, personal messages , between the two ?