Author Topic: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...  (Read 4489 times)

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Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Toni Kroos should win it.

http://www.espnfc.com/real-madrid/story/2252758/johan-cruyff-cristiano-ronaldo-didnt-deserve-ballon-dor

I mean, I'm new to football, and I'm still learning. I know Cruyff is a legend, but is he serious? Toni Kroos? I'm new to the sport, but I think I know enough to say this is bonkers, right?

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: January 19, 2015, 06:49:24 PM by Yoki_IsTheName »
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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2015, 05:38:45 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Toni Kroos should win it.

http://www.espnfc.com/real-madrid/story/2252758/johan-cruyff-cristiano-ronaldo-didnt-deserve-ballon-dor

I mean, I'm new to football, and I'm still learning. I know Cruyff is a legend, but is he serious? Toni Kroos? I'm new to the sport, but I think I know enough to say this is bonkers, right?

Thoughts?
Haven't followed football for a full decade now, but there's no way that Butterfingers Neuer belongs anywhere close to the top 3.

 ::)
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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2015, 05:43:20 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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Toni Kroos should win it.

http://www.espnfc.com/real-madrid/story/2252758/johan-cruyff-cristiano-ronaldo-didnt-deserve-ballon-dor

I mean, I'm new to football, and I'm still learning. I know Cruyff is a legend, but is he serious? Toni Kroos? I'm new to the sport, but I think I know enough to say this is bonkers, right?

Thoughts?
Haven't followed football for a full decade now, but there's no way that Butterfingers Neuer belongs anywhere close to the top 3.

 ::)

I'd put him over Toni Kroos, I can safely say that...
"The Boston Celtics are not a basketball team, they are a way of life."

- Red


Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2015, 06:26:55 PM »

Offline Who

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I agree. It should have been a German after winning the World Cup. Kroos was the guy who made the team tick so I think a strong case can be made he was the most decisive player on the World Cup winning team. So Kroos is a worthy choice.

The Ballon d'Or has become a popularity contest. Too many voters from all around the world. It comes down to who is the most famous.

The type of winners you have nowadays is completely different to how things were done in the past. I don't have much a problem with Ronaldo winning it this year because Real Madrid did win the Champions League but I absolutely hated seeing him win it the year previously when a massive club like Real Madrid finished with zero trophies. That was a disgrace. Like I said, it is a popularity contest nowadays. Not about achievements. You had a wonderful Bayern team led by Ribery that received no recognition for what they accomplished in winning the Treble. I thought that was awful.

I still think it is a disgrace that nobody from Spain (Xavi!) ever won the Ballon d'Or despite unprecedented success (two Euros and a WC in a row) and a style of football never seen before.

The award means less nowadays than it did 10+ years ago. The voting changes they made have ruined it. It used to be a blend of individual achievements & team achievements. That is why there were so many different award winners in past. It's not like that any more though. We'll never see someone like Matthias Sammer win the award again. I think that is a shame.

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2015, 06:30:52 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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I agree. It should have been a German after winning the World Cup. Kroos was the guy who made the team tick so I think a strong case can be made he was the most decisive player on the World Cup winning team. So Kroos is a worthy choice.

The Ballon d'Or has become a popularity contest. Too many voters from all around the world. It comes down to who is the most famous.

The type of winners you have nowadays is completely different to how things were done in the past. I don't have much a problem with Ronaldo winning it this year because Real Madrid did win the Champions League but I absolutely hated seeing him win it the year previously when a massive club like Real Madrid finished with zero trophies. That was a disgrace. Like I said, it is a popularity contest nowadays. Not about achievements. You had a wonderful Bayern team led by Ribery that received no recognition for what they accomplished in winning the Treble. I thought that was awful.

I still think it is a disgrace that nobody from Spain (Xavi!) ever won the Ballon d'Or despite unprecedented success (two Euros and a WC in a row) and a style of football never seen before.

The award means less nowadays than it did 10+ years ago. The voting changes they made have ruined it. It used to be a blend of individual achievements & team achievements. That is why there were so many different award winners in past. It's not like that any more though. We'll never see someone like Matthias Sammer win the award again. I think that is a shame.

But Who, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Ballon D'or not just about the World Cup, but club performance as well?

Edit: You make a great point for last year's. That's point taken.
"The Boston Celtics are not a basketball team, they are a way of life."

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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2015, 06:32:33 PM »

Offline Who

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I agree. It should have been a German after winning the World Cup. Kroos was the guy who made the team tick so I think a strong case can be made he was the most decisive player on the World Cup winning team. So Kroos is a worthy choice.

The Ballon d'Or has become a popularity contest. Too many voters from all around the world. It comes down to who is the most famous.

The type of winners you have nowadays is completely different to how things were done in the past. I don't have much a problem with Ronaldo winning it this year because Real Madrid did win the Champions League but I absolutely hated seeing him win it the year previously when a massive club like Real Madrid finished with zero trophies. That was a disgrace. Like I said, it is a popularity contest nowadays. Not about achievements. You had a wonderful Bayern team led by Ribery that received no recognition for what they accomplished in winning the Treble. I thought that was awful.

I still think it is a disgrace that nobody from Spain (Xavi!) ever won the Ballon d'Or despite unprecedented success (two Euros and a WC in a row) and a style of football never seen before.

The award means less nowadays than it did 10+ years ago. The voting changes they made have ruined it. It used to be a blend of individual achievements & team achievements. That is why there were so many different award winners in past. It's not like that any more though. We'll never see someone like Matthias Sammer win the award again. I think that is a shame.

But Who, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Ballon D'or not just about the World Cup, but club performance as well?

The World Cup is the pinnacle.

Winning that tournament is greatest achievement possible. Hard to top that.

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2015, 06:37:45 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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Read it too quickly, thought this was another Rondo thread.

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2015, 06:37:58 PM »

Offline letsgoblue86

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Ronaldo has probably been the best player in the last year though...

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon D'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2015, 06:38:27 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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I agree. It should have been a German after winning the World Cup. Kroos was the guy who made the team tick so I think a strong case can be made he was the most decisive player on the World Cup winning team. So Kroos is a worthy choice.

The Ballon d'Or has become a popularity contest. Too many voters from all around the world. It comes down to who is the most famous.

The type of winners you have nowadays is completely different to how things were done in the past. I don't have much a problem with Ronaldo winning it this year because Real Madrid did win the Champions League but I absolutely hated seeing him win it the year previously when a massive club like Real Madrid finished with zero trophies. That was a disgrace. Like I said, it is a popularity contest nowadays. Not about achievements. You had a wonderful Bayern team led by Ribery that received no recognition for what they accomplished in winning the Treble. I thought that was awful.

I still think it is a disgrace that nobody from Spain (Xavi!) ever won the Ballon d'Or despite unprecedented success (two Euros and a WC in a row) and a style of football never seen before.

The award means less nowadays than it did 10+ years ago. The voting changes they made have ruined it. It used to be a blend of individual achievements & team achievements. That is why there were so many different award winners in past. It's not like that any more though. We'll never see someone like Matthias Sammer win the award again. I think that is a shame.

But Who, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Ballon D'or not just about the World Cup, but club performance as well?

The World Cup is the pinnacle.

Winning that tournament is greatest achievement possible. Hard to top that.

But that's a LOADED German squad compare to Ronaldo's Portugal, who's also injured. I'm not making excuses for Cristiano, but the he has been on a tear in 2014, just dominating. I get it that he didn't have a massive World Cup resume', but Toni Kroos wasn't having that great a club performance in 2014 as Ronaldo.

I get you on 2013 though. Now that you have said it, you're absolutely right. I think Johan Cruyff makes this point in 2013, it will be absolutely valid. But not this year.
"The Boston Celtics are not a basketball team, they are a way of life."

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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2015, 07:45:08 PM »

Offline Casperian

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Meh, I don't care. I think the Ballon d'Or has become a farce, anyway. Ronaldo can win all the individual awards in the world.

What I do care about is the WORLD CUP, BABY!!!

Btw, Portugal are certainly no pushovers. There are several players on that team who have deep runs in the CL every year. When the tournament started, many pundits had written us off because of "a slow defence, only one real striker, and he's 36, key figures injured" etc.

The greats of the past were able to elevate their team to the next level, that's what made them "great" in the first place. The Ballon d'Or used to be an award for that kind of achievement. Ronaldo couldn't do it. For all the records he's broken for Real Madrid, people shouldn't forget the advantages he has there. He plays basically zero defence, gets most of the through passes, takes all the penalties...all on a team that, as a whole, is better than 99% of their opponents, anyway. The fact the world's top talent nowadays, far more so than in the past, is concentrated on only a handful of teams certainly plays a role, too.

As for Cruyff, it's all about playmaking and passing ability for him. No surprise he loves Kroos.
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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2015, 02:44:22 AM »

Offline ederson

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Cruyff would be more credible had he made the comment a few years ago when Messi won the golden ball although  Inesta was the mvp of the w.champion Spain. Or when Robert got snabbed...

His is talking about Kroos but he wasn't even the wc mvp.... Messi was but Cruyff has no problem with it.


Golden ball has indeed become a popularity contest and it's not anymore about the truly greatest player of the year. Crruyff's comments are no more than p.r. trick to support Messi.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2015, 03:41:36 AM by ederson »

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2015, 03:59:53 AM »

Offline AidaCelt

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Ballon d'Or is more about club football than international. WC winner plays a total of 7 games, every 4 years. At club level, you play 38-44 league games, 10 champions league, 6-7 cup games and leagues like EPL have a "league" cup as well. Plenty of opportunities to lift your team as compared with WC.

I would argue that taking your club side to CL victory is "almost" as big as being a WC winner. You might say that's madness but you spend so much time at club level that the communication and teamwork are much better than international, therefore the football is generally a better quality. Generally!

Is the Ballon a popularity contest. You could say that. Was CR more deserving than Kroos, absolutely. No matter the process, the correct decision was made (if it's a H2H thing).
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Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2015, 04:42:24 AM »

Offline Sixth Man

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The Ballon D'Or is a popularity contest.  That being said, it is not awarded to the player judged to be the best in the squad of the World Cup winner, so Neuer or Kroos are ridiculous suggestions (love Cruyff, but he's just stirring the pot here, as he often does). 

Both international and club play are taken into consideration by voters.

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2015, 05:25:33 AM »

Offline ederson

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The Ballon D'Or is a popularity contest.  That being said, it is not awarded to the player judged to be the best in the squad of the World Cup winner, so Neuer or Kroos are ridiculous suggestions (love Cruyff, but he's just stirring the pot here, as he often does). 

Both international and club play are taken into consideration by voters.

And most importantly the play during the whole year!

I don`t think that suggesting Kroos or Neuer is so ridiculous. They both had a very good season. Neuer is redefining his position by playing as sweeper-keeper and Kroos is the German Xavi moving the ball with almost 100% accuracy,setting the tone for the team and feeding with assists his strikers very effectively.

But as always the one scoring goals shines the most.Unfair maybe but that`s true and that causes a lot of discussions.  I`m not sure though that this season CR was the wrong option. He is been phenomenal.

Re: Johan Cruyff thinks Ronaldo didn't deserve Ballon d'Or, and he thinks...
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2015, 06:58:22 AM »

Offline Casperian

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I don`t think that suggesting Kroos or Neuer is so ridiculous. They both had a very good season. Neuer is redefining his position by playing as sweeper-keeper and Kroos is the German Xavi moving the ball with almost 100% accuracy,setting the tone for the team and feeding with assists his strikers very effectively.

But as always the one scoring goals shines the most.Unfair maybe but that`s true and that causes a lot of discussions.  I`m not sure though that this season CR was the wrong option. He is been phenomenal.

Agreed, Ronaldo has been great this year. I just don't think it was as lop-sided as people say. The WC was a reminder that Ronaldo has one of the best club sides in the world completely geared towards his strengths, which makes it a lot easier to shine. In that sense, Ronaldo didn't "take" Real Madrid to the CL title any more than, say, Di Maria, Modric or Sergio Ramos did.

Quote
Ballon d'Or is more about club football than international.

Quote
That being said, it is not awarded to the player judged to be the best in the squad of the World Cup winner

Yeah, but that's not how it used to be. Back in the day, the Ballon d'Or was as much an individual award as it was an award for the greatest team of the year. That's why people were okay with goalscorers winning it more often than defenders, because the winner was mostly just representing the biggest team success in football.

If you think about it, individual awards in football are kinda silly, anyway.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2015, 07:03:27 AM by Casperian »
"In Danny we trust" is so 2016.