Could the Celtics now be a decent team?

[JBcat]

good thread and a christmas tp for you. this is an interesting topic and raises some potentially interesting discussions.

as you point out, a number of celtic loses are to good teams and not by a lot of points. this year a number of games were winnable going into the final few minutes, or at least the fourth quarter. to me, some loses were simply a lack of celtic talent. but others were due to execution or inconsistency by players who COULD have made the play.

next...

the celtics are 7th in total offense this year, scoring 103.7 points per game. pretty good for a team with a lot of young kids and no "go to" super star scorer.

the celtics are tied for 26th in defense, however, coughing up 104.3 per game. this is bad and may be less a case of talent in players.

in terms of differential between points scored and points yielded, the celtics are 16th, right in the middle of the pack.

are the celtics, as constituted, better than their record? my quick and dirty point is no, your record is who you are. but under that, a key question is if this young roster played consistently with the current talent, would they at least be a decent team?

my belief is yes. how many games did the celtics lose because of poor starts or poor finishes? consistency is the main devil this year, in terms of not being "decent" as a team.

now if the question is the celtics rising up to championship level, that is a different debate and involves serious star talent.

but if this current celtic team were consistent (and i do include mr. green) this team would be close to .500...decent.

Thank you for the kind words, your added insights to my post and Christmas TP.
A Merry Christmas to you...and a TP from Santa   

Also if you check out ESPN's strength of schedule our expected win loss record should be 12 and 14, 2 games better than it is now.

[revtodd64]

I think this team will settle down after the trade deadline and play decent basketball.  Right now they have a team that can run 9 or 10 deep and really push the pace, and steal some games from tired veteran teams.  I like Nelson and Smart sharing the point, letting Smart learn from a veteran while getting quality minutes.  Bringing Turner, Crowder, Wright and Olynk off the bench is a solid second team.  I like how Zeller is developing.  I think Danny will make one more move to alleviate the PF logjam.  Who leaves depends on what other teams want, but I don't think we finish the year with Bass, Sullinger and Wright all on the team.  Wright goes only if we get a 1st, Sullinger goes if someone in the playoff hunt needs a rebounder.  As we have seen with Josh Smith released and Verajo going down with an injury, there could be some movement before the trade deadline. 

I think we see some decent basketball after the dust settles and finish 7th in the terrible east.  I would rather see this team make the playoffs and get a taste of blood in their mouths, even if they get swept.  We don't have to tank to be good.  We have the picks and cap room to make a major move offseason.  Go Celtics!

[Kuberski33]

You can't change 20% of your roster and have one of the guys you lose be your starting PG and not have it affect your team in a negative way. You have no training camp to incorporate the new guys and not enough practices so they have to pick it up on the fly.  Overall the team may actually have a higher talent level post trade, but I doubt we see it play out in results. 

CBS is a very good coach and may be good enough to get this team into a 7 or 8 seed barring a Green or Bass trade, but that's about the ceiling. 

The biggest priority now is trying to identify guys who are capable of being here when this team finally turns it around and also raising the value of guys they can deal off.  Winning games is 3rd or 4th on the list.

[Eja117]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

[slamtheking]

Can't be a decent team without decent players. Still waiting for that to happen.

nicely summed up

[mgent]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Um, I don't understand.

I'd much rather be decent than really bad.

I guess that means I'm dumb?  Or at least ignorant?

[Chief]

Yes. Decent in the Eastern conference. That's not saying much though.

[Eja117]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Um, I don't understand.

I'd much rather be decent than really bad.

I guess that means I'm dumb?  Or at least ignorant?

It is possibly you are either ignorant of, or forgetting, or surprisingly or boldly optimistic in regards to nba purgatory when you are continuously picking in the 8-12 range.

[Neurotic Guy]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Yes, I think everyone probably understands the sentiment, but not everyone agrees.  I think this team offers a unique circumstance where being "decent" right now may be very much in the C's best interest.  If the C's are decent now (which I don't really think they are) they'd still be sitting with a potential treasure trove of draft picks to use or sell.  If next year rolls around and the C's have graduated from being decent to being pretty good -- they then have their own pick, Dallas' possibly in the teens, Cleveland's, and Brooklyn's.  Brooklyn may be a top pick.  AND cap-room (not to mention all the 2015 picks).   

Build from an already decent team and we may get to contention faster.  So, this is a case where being OK and on the rise may work well in the Celtics favor.

[2short]

IMO with rondo being moved the celtics have officially given up on
 This season.  And before the rondo haters attack I do not mean we are better or worse without him.    the hard core rondo haters should join mavericks blog and complain about him there.
What I mean is now that rondo is gone, bass is gone, green and thorton probably and don't be surprised if turner and sully are traded as well.
We won't be a decent team and it doesn't really matter.  More good players that have value to other teams are being shopped as I type. 
We have to enjoy the development of smart, ko, young and zeller .  See how wright looks if good Ainge tries to resign him.
Long haul lads....enjoy the little things for the next three to five years and hope Danny can make his vision work

[Celtics18]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Um, I don't understand.

I'd much rather be decent than really bad.

I guess that means I'm dumb?  Or at least ignorant?

It is possibly you are either ignorant of, or forgetting, or surprisingly or boldly optimistic in regards to nba purgatory when you are continuously picking in the 8-12 range.

It's most likely you who are ignorant if you mistakenly believe that being a mediocre NBA basketball team leads to a state of that mediocrity necessarily lasting in perpetuity. 

That's obviously not true.  It's reached near comedic levels that folks just keep repeating this as some kind of truism despite there being absolutely no evidence to support the theory. 

[KGs Knee]

I think the trade made us a little bit better. 

Sure, whatever. Keep on believing whatever you wish, so long as it fits your 'narrative'.

I haven't watched a single game since the infamous 'trade', and won't, not at least until Ainge gets some legit talent on this team. Trading away your best player for scraps is disgusting, and is blatant tanking. Not worthy of my attention.

But, based on the results and what I have read of the game recaps, the team is clearly worse, which is to be expected.

[Eja117]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Yes, I think everyone probably understands the sentiment, but not everyone agrees.  I think this team offers a unique circumstance where being "decent" right now may be very much in the C's best interest.  If the C's are decent now (which I don't really think they are) they'd still be sitting with a potential treasure trove of draft picks to use or sell.  If next year rolls around and the C's have graduated from being decent to being pretty good -- they then have their own pick, Dallas' possibly in the teens, Cleveland's, and Brooklyn's.  Brooklyn may be a top pick.  AND cap-room (not to mention all the 2015 picks).   

Build from an already decent team and we may get to contention faster.  So, this is a case where being OK and on the rise may work well in the Celtics favor.

I suppose by the end of the season this could be the case, but that was an awful lot of ifs in there.

[Eja117]

Who the hell wants to be decent?  Either be really bad or really good.  Decent sucks.

This is a pretty decent point that probably most people should be able to understand.

Um, I don't understand.

I'd much rather be decent than really bad.

I guess that means I'm dumb?  Or at least ignorant?

It is possibly you are either ignorant of, or forgetting, or surprisingly or boldly optimistic in regards to nba purgatory when you are continuously picking in the 8-12 range.

It's most likely you who are ignorant if you mistakenly believe that being a mediocre NBA basketball team leads to a state of that mediocrity necessarily lasting in perpetuity. 

That's obviously not true.  It's reached near comedic levels that folks just keep repeating this as some kind of truism despite there being absolutely no evidence to support the theory.

There are a lot of teams that this happens to. You just never think of them because they are just always the 6th, 7th, 8th seed, or just outside or just doing nothing. The Jazz, the Hawks, the Bucks, the T Wolves, the Nuggs, the Hornets, the Knicks, the Trailblazers, the Suns.  All respectable teams and that's about it. By the time they get something going their star player is tired of the losing and wants to leave. Happened to the T Wolves twice now.  Or they fire a coach or something. It will be interesting to see what happens to the Pelicans soon and the Trailblazers.  The Celtics were lucky to break out of it. Basically got lucky on timing. The Bulls got lucky to get D Rose.

[inverselock]

I think the trade made us a little bit better. 

Sure, whatever. Keep on believing whatever you wish, so long as it fits your 'narrative'.

I haven't watched a single game since the infamous 'trade', and won't, not at least until Ainge gets some legit talent on this team. Trading away your best player for scraps is disgusting, and is blatant tanking. Not worthy of my attention.

But, based on the results and what I have read of the game recaps, the team is clearly worse, which is to be expected.

Informed opinions.   Could use some more of that around here.