Author Topic: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade  (Read 110889 times)

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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #240 on: December 18, 2014, 11:15:43 AM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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I think other teams would value Wright more than we would. We want younger prospects IMO.

Would something like this work? With CHA maybe getting the Clips pick too?

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=lckzu6r

To Boston: C. Zeller, Felton, Hairston

To Dallas: Rondo

To CHA: Wright

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #241 on: December 18, 2014, 11:15:44 AM »

Offline CeltsAcumen

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For the record I do not want to trade Rondo, we will not get anything comparable to him in return.  Not even potential.  Remember how Rondo plays in playoff games, the guy is a stud.

Now reality is reality and I do agree the Celtics should get value and not let a player just walk in Free agency.

So I am conflicted.  But I would say, Rondo is the perfect person to lead these young guys as a potential east playoff team, which they are.

You cannot rely of the draft to "save" the franchise, the ping pong balls are too fickle and players are overrated and underrated all the time.

SO again I am conflicted.  I like this team, yes it needs more, but Rondo would be fantastic to have leading these guys WHEN they get to the playoffs.  Which could be this year with the terrible East.

Again, I do not want to see Rondo go, especially for Brenden Wright, A player I know a lot about since I am a UNC alum.  Wright is overrated even as a back up.  He is very limited in his abilities on offense and will not really help the Celtics except if they move him in another trade.  Wright will take minutes from guys who can improve like Sully, Olynyk and Zeller. 

I say pay Rondo, keep em, and lets just see what is out there in Free agency and what happens with the ping pong balls.

Rondo is also so much fun to watch, so I would be very sad.

I love Marcus Smart but he is not ready to run a team in the NBA and it would most likely be Bradley and Pressey running the point if Rondo leaves.  You do not let a rookie run the point if you want to be successful.  Let Rondo mentor Marcus for a year or so or better yet, let them become the backcourt from hell on defense.

Just my opinions, based entirely on emotions and my limited knowledge of UNC players.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #242 on: December 18, 2014, 11:17:37 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Quote
He's Leon Powe with more length.

That would not be a bad thing in my book.  I loved how Leon Battled and he'd been a perfect center with three more inches of height or so.
The problem is that Wright rebounds less like Leon Powe and more like Brandon Bass.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2014, 11:32:35 AM by kozlodoev »
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #243 on: December 18, 2014, 11:19:52 AM »

Offline Cman

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And Im not very high with all these picks..i want proven players. Building thru the draft may hurt u than help, just look at Philadelphia.

you know the quote "beggars can't be choosers?"

That's the Boston Celtics right now. Pretty hard for us to get a star back in a trade, given how few stars there are and given how many of the stars have various no trade clauses. Best bet is first round picks...
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #244 on: December 18, 2014, 11:22:40 AM »

Offline Dino Pitino

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If Brandan Wright is so good, why has he been at 18 MPG for Dallas for a full three years?

Ever heard of Dirk Nowitzki? There's also a guy named Tyson Chandler there this year. Samuel Dalembert last year. Before that, Elton Brand and Chris Kaman. Plus, apparently Rick Carlisle has not been too interested in playing non-veterans. And still Wright got almost 20 minutes a game, which he has been maximizing the crap out of, more and more every year.

p.s. Good catch above by whoever I just awarded a Tommy Point to, that it's not just PER but just about all the advanced metrics that love Wright. Please don't let baseball fans look wiser than basketball fans, it's just an accident of their sport being less complex that they wound up being first to appreciate the general usefulness of advanced metrics. Fortunately most NBA front offices are almost all caught up.

Quote
He's Leon Powe with more length. A devasting offensive garbage man who doesn't do much else well but he doesn't try to do more.

Any evidence for that comparison, or do you describe all efficient big men playing non-starter minutes in the NBA according to a Powe matrix? Kelly Olynyk is just a tall Leon Powe with longer hair, less melanin, and more finesse...hmmm, this could be useful, actually. Powe Shares, anyone?

FYI: I am not totally convinced Wright is going to be really good or even good if he gets played starter minutes against starters. I just think the odds are good. I still want the draft picks Dallas has, first and foremost. Two picks, preferably. Both first rounders. Preferably 2015 and 2017, because as I said above the West is so brutal this year that Dallas could slip entirely out of the playoffs with a single major injury. Bird in the hand, one in the bush, and also Brandan Wright. Not as an afterthought, because I really do think he's got sleeper All-Star potential. But if it were just Wright plus, say, two second round picks, I would be livid at Ainge.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2014, 11:30:37 AM by Dino Pitino »
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #245 on: December 18, 2014, 11:26:17 AM »

Offline Evantime34

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If the package is Wright, Crowder, Felton and a pick I really hope we are routing those guys to another team for a young player or picks.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #246 on: December 18, 2014, 11:29:20 AM »

Offline JBcat

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I hope Ainge does not relent for the package he wants.  At worst hopefully Rondo would work with us for a sign and trade deal in the offseason. 

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #247 on: December 18, 2014, 11:29:30 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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If Brandan Wright is so good, why has he been at 18 MPG for Dallas for a full three years?

Ever heard of Dirk Nowitzki? There's also a guy named Tyson Chandler there this year. Samuel Dalembert last year. Before that, Elton Brand and Chris Kaman. Plus, apparently Rick Carlisle has not been too interested in playing non-veterans. And still Wright got almost 20 minutes a game, which he has been maximizing the crap out of, more and more every year.
I'm sorry, Brandan Wright is a seventh-year player, when exactly does become a "veteran", 35?

The fact that the Mavs felt compelled to go out and get a center pretty much every year over the last three seasons clearly indicates they don't view him as starter material. Also, the fact that 34-year Elton Brandt and the calcified remains of Chris Kaman got to start over him is not exactly a glowing endorsement, either.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #248 on: December 18, 2014, 11:31:46 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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If Brandan Wright is so good, why has he been at 18 MPG for Dallas for a full three years?

Ever heard of Dirk Nowitzki? There's also a guy named Tyson Chandler there this year. Samuel Dalembert last year. Before that, Elton Brand and Chris Kaman. Plus, apparently Rick Carlisle has not been too interested in playing non-veterans. And still Wright got almost 20 minutes a game, which he has been maximizing the crap out of, more and more every year.

p.s. Good catch above by whoever I just awarded a Tommy Point to, that it's not just PER but just about all the advanced metrics that love Wright. Please don't let baseball fans look wiser than basketball fans, it's just an accident of their sport being less complex that they wound up being first to appreciate the general usefulness of advanced metrics. Fortunately most NBA front offices are almost all caught up.
If Brand/Kaman/Dalmbert are all better options or just as good as Wright for a rotation spot that doesn't indicate something about Wright's level of play?
Quote
He's Leon Powe with more length. A devasting offensive garbage man who doesn't do much else well but he doesn't try to do more.

Any evidence for that comparison, or do you describe all efficient big men playing non-starter minutes in the NBA according to a Powe matrix? Kelly Olynyk is just a tall Leon Powe with longer hair, less melanin, and more finesse...hmmm, this could be useful, actually. Powe Shares, anyone?
Look them up yourself, they have similar offensive ratings and PERs pre-injury. Powe is less efficient scoring, but he got fouled more and got a lot of offensive rebounds. Powe also only got around 18 MPG.

Powe also couldn't defend and couldn't handle playing more than 4 rotation big minutes. Furthermore his offense wasn't something you could count on, it was all about crashing the glass or taking advantage of defensive attention being elsewhere. A garbage and a roll man.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #249 on: December 18, 2014, 11:32:11 AM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Don't you just love debates about NBA bench players.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #250 on: December 18, 2014, 11:33:56 AM »

Offline CFAN38

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I think other teams would value Wright more than we would. We want younger prospects IMO.

Would something like this work? With CHA maybe getting the Clips pick too?

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=lckzu6r

To Boston: C. Zeller, Felton, Hairston

To Dallas: Rondo

To CHA: Wright

I wonder if the suns would want wright?  He would add a dynamic to their roster that they lack. If they have interest then this may work,

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mbgd2t9

Cs would obviously receive picks in this deal either 2 from dallas or 1 from dallas and 1 from Phoenix. Felton should be immediately bought out and kept away from this team.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #251 on: December 18, 2014, 11:33:58 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Don't you just love debates about NBA bench players.
Sadly, there isn't anything more exciting to talk about here.
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Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #252 on: December 18, 2014, 11:34:45 AM »

Offline Fan from VT

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I suspect rondo will walk at the end of the year for nothing, but im ok with that if it has to be that way (i would most want to keep him at sub-max, but i dont think thats happening, but i dont think its a disaster if we dont trade him and he walks for nothing). Si because i dont care, id probably play hard ball if i were ainge and hold out for multiple future unprotectedz or demand a green/parsons inclusion.

For houston, we could get a 3rd team for ariza or we could trade rondo for terry amd other salaries amd also eparately give them bass into their trade exception with the c's getting a pick so they cam trade montejiuenas and jones and terry and koppljjddjjd for rondo in the separate deal.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #253 on: December 18, 2014, 11:36:02 AM »

Offline Endless Paradise

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I wonder if the suns would want wright?  He would add a dynamic to their roster that they lack. If they have interest then this may work,

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mbgd2t9

Cs would obviously receive picks in this deal either 2 from dallas or 1 from dallas and 1 from Phoenix. Felton should be immediately bought out and kept away from this team.

Err, not really seeing how Wright would be all that different than Plumlee and Len.

Re: ESPN: Celtics and Mavs discussing Rondo trade
« Reply #254 on: December 18, 2014, 11:37:12 AM »

Offline Dino Pitino

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If Brandan Wright is so good, why has he been at 18 MPG for Dallas for a full three years?

Ever heard of Dirk Nowitzki? There's also a guy named Tyson Chandler there this year. Samuel Dalembert last year. Before that, Elton Brand and Chris Kaman. Plus, apparently Rick Carlisle has not been too interested in playing non-veterans. And still Wright got almost 20 minutes a game, which he has been maximizing the crap out of, more and more every year.
I'm sorry, Brandan Wright is a seventh-year player, when exactly does become a "veteran", 35?

The fact that the Mavs felt compelled to go out and get a center pretty much every year over the last three seasons clearly indicates they don't view him as starter material. Also, the fact that 34-year Elton Brandt and the calcified remains of Chris Kaman got to start over him is not exactly a glowing endorsement, either.

Check their stats, Brand and Kaman produced. In limited minutes. Just like good NBA players do, even on their downswing.

Three years ago (cf. the question I was responding to) Brandan Wright had just turned 24, and his injury bugs had kept him from gaining traction, experience, etc. Meanwhile all the big men getting minutes ahead of him have been several years older than he has been each step of the way. That's what I mean by non-veterans. "Older players" works just as well. Common sense >>> semantics.
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